CDX2 vs streaming.

For me, if I was going to trade in the cdx2, it would have to be for an equivalent sounding box or better?

I will no doubt have to have a home demo.

wenger2015 posted:

For me, if I was going to trade in the cdx2, it would have to be for an equivalent sounding box or better?

I will no doubt have to have a home demo.

I have a CDX2 non digital output version and a HXD-SSD and speaking only for myself I hold them in equal favour notwithstanding whether or not one is more flexible than the other in general use or soundwise.

wenger2015 posted:

For me, if I was going to trade in the cdx2, it would have to be for an equivalent sounding box or better?

I will no doubt have to have a home demo.

It's the only way to answer the question for your system, in your room, with your ears/brain/preferences.

Interestingly I have just bought a Cambridge Audio CXC transport after reading rave reviews.

Looks like I can get some money back as the NDX is now being sold, there is no contest, the Cambridge is in a different league.

Huge posted:

wenger2015 posted:

For me, if I was going to trade in the cdx2, it would have to be for an equivalent sounding box or better?

I will no doubt have to have a home demo.

It's the only way to answer the question for your system, in your room, with your ears/brain/preferences.

Be interesting to hear from forum members who have made the switch? 

With your system, with the 300 and the Focals, the NDS is the one I think you should be looking at. I've seen them at Naim dealers preloved for around £4,000. Less than the price of 4m of your speaker cables, for Naim's top source. Can't be bad. 

Paul Downs posted:

Interestingly I have just bought a Cambridge Audio CXC transport after reading rave reviews.

Looks like I can get some money back as the NDX is now being sold, there is no contest, the Cambridge is in a different league.

Are you sure that your NDX was set up properly and you were using at least CD quality lossless rips?

I am not an NDX user, but I have heard Naim streamers in a variety of systems and I would be completely flabbergasted if the NDX did not sound very much better (in fact in a completely different league) than the Cambridge CXC.

Hungryhalibut posted:

With your system, with the 300 and the Focals, the NDS is the one I think you should be looking at. I've seen them at Naim dealers preloved for around £4,000. Less than the price of 4m of your speaker cables, for Naim's top source. Can't be bad. 

Will have to investigate further, no doubt my dealer will come up with a good deal.

Hmack posted:

Paul Downs posted:

Interestingly I have just bought a Cambridge Audio CXC transport after reading rave reviews.

Looks like I can get some money back as the NDX is now being sold, there is no contest, the Cambridge is in a different league.

Are you sure that your NDX was set up properly and you were using at least CD quality lossless rips?

I am not an NDX user, but I have heard Naim streamers in a variety of systems and I would be completely flabbergasted if the NDX did not sound very much better (in fact in a completely different league) than the Cambridge CXC.

That's exactly what I would have expected too, but no it's the other way around.

My NDX streams FLAC files from my Apple Mac using Asset UpNp.

wenger2015 posted:

Huge posted:

wenger2015 posted:

For me, if I was going to trade in the cdx2, it would have to be for an equivalent sounding box or better?

I will no doubt have to have a home demo.

It's the only way to answer the question for your system, in your room, with your ears/brain/preferences.

Be interesting to hear from forum members who have made the switch? 

Wenger, purchased a NDX a couple of years ago running into a Olive system after the arrival of the NDX the CDI just gathered dust.

The NDX rekindled my interest in music because it was convenient to use I chopped the olive system in about a year ago for new black boxes upgraded the 250 earlier this year I'm listening to a much wider genre of music and purchase more CDs than ever before just love streaming.

Listening to Chely Wright at the moment Mary Black is next in the queue so easy no more treading on CD cases!!

I have to admit that since I've had the 272 I've listened to a greater variety of music. It's just so easy. 

What I like most is having no CDs lying around. We have a modest sized house and over 2,000 CDs meant that they were in the living room on a wall unit, in the dining room in a huge rack, and overspill in the study upstairs in Ikea units. Inevitably the overspill never got played, and when the overspill over spilled it was time for action. We made the switch by selling the old setup and getting a SuperUniti. I started unable to play any albums until I'd ripped them, which certainly made me get a wiggle on. But we couldn't afford to have the CD player and the SuperUniti so it was the only way. It was certainly weird at first but that was over four years ago and we are clutter free. I like looking for albums on the iPad rather than looking at shelves with my head on one side. But streaming is not for everyone and there's no way I'd ram it down anyone's throat. There are always a few challenges in setting everything up, and metadata needs to be managed with rigour if one is to have a pain free way of finding one's music. It's certainly not ideal to switch without due thought. 

Sorry Wenger, I just realised that you probably wanted to hear whether anyone had swapped directly from the CDX2 to the NDX, in which case my waffling above is surplus to requirements. 

Paul Downs posted:

Interestingly I have just bought a Cambridge Audio CXC transport after reading rave reviews.

Looks like I can get some money back as the NDX is now being sold, there is no contest, the Cambridge is in a different league.

Cambridge Audio -- how do you hide that one on your rack??!! 

Hungryhalibut posted:

Sorry Wenger, I just realised that you probably wanted to hear whether anyone had swapped directly from the CDX2 to the NDX, in which case my waffling above is surplus to requirements. 

All information is good.

My main concern is I don't want to compromise on sound quality, ease of use is important . And being able to relay my music to the main lounge or kitchen ect 

Hungryhalibut posted:

Sorry Wenger, I just realised that you probably wanted to hear whether anyone had swapped directly from the CDX2 to the NDX, in which case my waffling above is surplus to requirements. 

A halibut & waffle,  not too sure about that,  roasted asparagus with garlic is my choice.

Wenger,  I moved from CDX2 to NDX in 2014:    The NDX  was connected from the start to my XPS so I'm comparing CDX2/XPS to NDX/XPS.   Comparing a CD replay with the same ripped CD on NDX it plays differently,  NDX is smoother & more refined with better detail & separation.   The CDX2 is more forward,  like sitting front row stalls with CDX2 & a few rows back with NDX.     NDX sounds more realistic/natural with voices & some instruments, timbre is more pronounced with more of the physical feel to string & body vibration.    With NDX quiet passages are quieter & loud are louder,  most noticeable with high res recordings.  Also more pronounced is the volume differences between albums, changing an album invariably involves a small volume adjustment more so than I had noticed on CD (maybe these differences might be in the ripping process,  & maybe me not getting it the same each time)      Obviously high res (24bit PCM) albums are different, especially so DSD & that takes the NDX a real step or two higher than CDX2.  But I have to say I do miss the verve of the CDX2 with raw electric rock, prog & blues.  

Mike-B posted:

Hungryhalibut posted:

Sorry Wenger, I just realised that you probably wanted to hear whether anyone had swapped directly from the CDX2 to the NDX, in which case my waffling above is surplus to requirements. 

A halibut & waffle,  not too sure about that,  roasted asparagus with garlic is my choice.

Wenger,  I moved from CDX2 to NDX in 2014:    The NDX  was connected from the start to my XPS so I'm comparing CDX2/XPS to NDX/XPS.   Comparing a CD replay with the same ripped CD on NDX it plays differently,  NDX is smoother & more refined with better detail & separation.   The CDX2 is more forward,  like sitting front row stalls with CDX2 & a few rows back with NDX.     NDX sounds more realistic/natural with voices & some instruments, timbre is more pronounced with more of the physical feel to string & body vibration.    With NDX quiet passages are quieter & loud are louder,  most noticeable with high res recordings.  Also more pronounced is the volume differences between albums, changing an album invariably involves a small volume adjustment more so than I had noticed on CD (maybe these differences might be in the ripping process,  & maybe me not getting it the same each time)      Obviously high res (24bit PCM) albums are different, especially so DSD & that takes the NDX a real step or two higher than CDX2.  But I have to say I do miss the verve of the CDX2 with raw electric rock, prog & blues.  

Thanks for the feedback,  I confess I am a little hesitant to make the change.

I am extremely fond of my cdx2 and with the XPSdr it's performed superbly. 

But I am certainly warming to the possibility of having new and old music available with ease, along with an endless supply of  radio stations ect ect

I suppose the presentation is always going to have its differences, but in a way that's also true with the humble cd, some are of a higher quality  then others.

Ps not keen on garlic but the rest of the meal very nice....

I too love the sound of the CDX2 and I wouldn't give it up lightly. If I thought I was missing something I'd have reached for the cd remote, but I haven't. I put my hands up and admit that I genuinely didn't want to swap a cdp for streaming but I've been genuinely surprised at the sound this combo makes. 

Hi Wenger and Finkfan, I thought I would give my two-penneth even though I did not move from CDX2 to NDX. I left Naim CD replay a few years ago when I sold all my Naim gear. When I came back to 2 channel hifi about 7 years ago, I started with a Uniti2 so took on streaming from the offset. You can look at my profile to see how that has progressed in recent years.

Yes, you do need to consider the relative performance attributes of CD vs streaming but there are other considerations that are as important IMV. Others have nicely summarised the SQ signature of the CDX2 vs NDX so I won't bother going over that ground and I don't have that precise experience anyway. For me having made the transition to streaming my sampling, consumption and subsequent acquisition of music has changed beyond recognition. Before streaming, I sampled very little new (to me) music, my collection was getting tired, much of that collection was unlistened to due to ill-informed and impulse buying and I found myself listening to music less and less.

With streaming (and Tidal) I now sample a huge amount of material that is new to me, much of it as recommendations from The Music Room on here. There are a huge number of iRadio stations to listen to also if you are that way inclined. I simply save stuff I want to sample in 'My Music' in Tidal, listen to it when time permits, keep the stuff I like in Tidal and finally buy the stuff I like the most either as a CD to rip or as hi res download. (The HiFi version of Tidal sounds pretty good these days but is bettered by CD rips and Hi res downloads of course). I now have a growing collection of diverse and wonderful music I had never heard of before moving to streaming. My interest in music has been reignited and gone are the racks of unloved CDs. The convenience of streaming is addictive. Yes some will miss the physical experience of selecting a CD and reading the inner sleeve. For me now, that seems to be a real faff and I do not miss it at all. I would rather spend my time listening to music than searching for it. Simply fire up the Naim app on the iPad and it is all there. Sort and select by album, artist, genre, performer, last played or even most recently added material. It is so easy and fast.

That all sounds wonderful, but there is a BUT. You do need to learn some stuff when getting into streaming. It is an entirely different set-up, the main difference being the need to set up and optimise a local network, hooked up with ethernet cable. I am no techie and if I can do it then anyone can. Dealers (and Naim) are also available to provide advice and support.

From my perspective, streaming was nothing short of a revelation. Music is now diverse, interesting, easily accessible and a joy to listen to. The main difference being the wonderful content I have been able to sample and build and the sheer joy of listening to a wonderful new find as well as an old favourite.

NIGELB, thanks for your thoughts.

I am certainly enthused by the idea of finding new music with such ease, new radio stations ect, I'm quite confident I can deal with the tech side, fortunately Finkfan, my son in law lives 5 mins away and is in the process of making the change from cdx2 to 272.

I am seriously considering speaking to my dealer and arranging a home dem.

My streaming journey started with a SuperUniti. Still have it - it's performing daily duties in the kitchen / dining area.

I then progressed through NDX (at some stage I had two - don't ask why...). My clever dealer arranged an extended NDS demo.... Ouch... But it stayed and one NDX had to be sold - I think it's now somewhere in Italy.
The other one is used daily - this one has an FM / DAB module - we have a large roof aerial.

So streaming is my primary solution for playing back my digital music collection - the entire apartment was actually wired (LAN Cat 6) with streaming in mind.

I thought I also needed a CD player  - CD5XS was the first one. Didn't last very long - swapped it for CDX2. Now this one is going too - it has become a surplus to requirements. I simply don't use it anymore.

As to setting up a streaming network - it takes some diligence, but its doable - I'm not an IT specialist and I've managed to setup the entire streaming network and the servers myself. So it can't be that difficult 

Adam Zielinski posted:

My streaming journey started with a SuperUniti. Still have it - it's performing daily duties in the kitchen / dining area.

I then progressed through NDX (at some stage I had two - don't ask why...). My clever dealer arranged an extended NDS demo.... Ouch... But it stayed and one NDX had to be sold - I think it's now somewhere in Italy.
The other one is used daily - this one has an FM / DAB module - we have a large roof aerial.

So streaming is my primary solution for playing back my digital music collection - the entire apartment was actually wired (LAN Cat 6) with streaming in mind.

I thought I also needed a CD player  - CD5XS was the first one. Didn't last very long - swapped it for CDX2. Now this one is going too - it has become a surplus to requirements. I simply don't use it anymore.

As to setting up a streaming network - it takes some diligence, but its doable - I'm not an IT specialist and I've managed to setup the entire streaming network and the servers myself. So it can't be that difficult 

 

Adam, how big is the step up from NDX to NDS? 

wenger2015 posted:

Adam Zielinski posted:

My streaming journey started with a SuperUniti. Still have it - it's performing daily duties in the kitchen / dining area.

I then progressed through NDX (at some stage I had two - don't ask why...). My clever dealer arranged an extended NDS demo.... Ouch... But it stayed and one NDX had to be sold - I think it's now somewhere in Italy.
The other one is used daily - this one has an FM / DAB module - we have a large roof aerial.

So streaming is my primary solution for playing back my digital music collection - the entire apartment was actually wired (LAN Cat 6) with streaming in mind.

I thought I also needed a CD player  - CD5XS was the first one. Didn't last very long - swapped it for CDX2. Now this one is going too - it has become a surplus to requirements. I simply don't use it anymore.

As to setting up a streaming network - it takes some diligence, but its doable - I'm not an IT specialist and I've managed to setup the entire streaming network and the servers myself. So it can't be that difficult 

 

Adam, how big is the step up from NDX to NDS? 

Ahm.... 

Initially when I put the test NDS on my rack I though 'what's the big deal?' (I already had my own 555PS DR which I used to power the NDX). The test lasted for 3 weeks and the time came to give the NDS back. I put my NDX back on, thinking this NDS was 'quite allright but I'm sure my NDX is absolutely fine'.

What came out of the speakers hit me like a proverbial brick wall. I remember saying: 'shit - someone stole my music'. I lasted 3 agonising long weeks and finally gave in. Placed an order for the NDS and never looked back.

That's how stupidly, insanely and amazingly good the NDS is.

Adam Zielinski posted:

wenger2015 posted:

Adam Zielinski posted:

My streaming journey started with a SuperUniti. Still have it - it's performing daily duties in the kitchen / dining area.

I then progressed through NDX (at some stage I had two - don't ask why...). My clever dealer arranged an extended NDS demo.... Ouch... But it stayed and one NDX had to be sold - I think it's now somewhere in Italy.
The other one is used daily - this one has an FM / DAB module - we have a large roof aerial.

So streaming is my primary solution for playing back my digital music collection - the entire apartment was actually wired (LAN Cat 6) with streaming in mind.

I thought I also needed a CD player  - CD5XS was the first one. Didn't last very long - swapped it for CDX2. Now this one is going too - it has become a surplus to requirements. I simply don't use it anymore.

As to setting up a streaming network - it takes some diligence, but its doable - I'm not an IT specialist and I've managed to setup the entire streaming network and the servers myself. So it can't be that difficult 

 

Adam, how big is the step up from NDX to NDS? 

Ahm.... 

Initially when I put the test NDS on my rack I though 'what's the big deal?' (I already had my own 555PS DR which I used to power the NDX). The test lasted for 3 weeks and the time came to give the NDS back. I put my NDX back on, thinking this NDS was 'quite allright but I'm sure my NDX is absolutely fine'.

What came out of the speakers hit me like a proverbial brick wall. I remember saying: 'shit - someone stole my music'. I lasted 3 agonising long weeks and finally gave in. Placed an order for the NDS and never looked back.

That's how stupidly, insanely and amazingly good the NDS is.

Thanks for the feedback it's much appreciated.

Adam Zielinski posted:

wenger2015 posted:

Adam Zielinski posted:

My streaming journey started with a SuperUniti. Still have it - it's performing daily duties in the kitchen / dining area.

I then progressed through NDX (at some stage I had two - don't ask why...). My clever dealer arranged an extended NDS demo.... Ouch... But it stayed and one NDX had to be sold - I think it's now somewhere in Italy.
The other one is used daily - this one has an FM / DAB module - we have a large roof aerial.

So streaming is my primary solution for playing back my digital music collection - the entire apartment was actually wired (LAN Cat 6) with streaming in mind.

I thought I also needed a CD player  - CD5XS was the first one. Didn't last very long - swapped it for CDX2. Now this one is going too - it has become a surplus to requirements. I simply don't use it anymore.

As to setting up a streaming network - it takes some diligence, but its doable - I'm not an IT specialist and I've managed to setup the entire streaming network and the servers myself. So it can't be that difficult 

 

Adam, how big is the step up from NDX to NDS? 

Ahm.... 

Initially when I put the test NDS on my rack I though 'what's the big deal?' (I already had my own 555PS DR which I used to power the NDX). The test lasted for 3 weeks and the time came to give the NDS back. I put my NDX back on, thinking this NDS was 'quite allright but I'm sure my NDX is absolutely fine'.

What came out of the speakers hit me like a proverbial brick wall. I remember saying: 'shit - someone stole my music'. I lasted 3 agonising long weeks and finally gave in. Placed an order for the NDS and never looked back.

That's how stupidly, insanely and amazingly good the NDS is.

Sorry Adam, I seem to remember 'suggesting' you might like to try the NDS at that time.

I also moved from NDX to NDS and I would concur with Adam's view. The NDX however lasted me for a good few years and it is the first serious streamer in the Naim arsenal IMV, other than the 272 which wasn't around at the time. In fact if I were to start on a streaming journey now, I would definitely explore the 272 first. But for you Wenger, as you already have a great preamp in the 282, maybe the NDX is the best place to start.