Munich High End 2017

I also did a compare between the Astel & Kerm Kann and the Ultimata 1000 again a big difference. While the Kann offers a nice package with a big storage possibility. It's more raw and less refined. Size wise also less attractive as the Ultimata, while one could live with that....

Avant-garde Acoustic had quite big horns and huge bass cabinets. Obviously the Tocatta of Bach with Cameron Carpetenter was a treat. While for me the top end of the speakers was sometimes dissapointing.....

Went intonthe Naim partitioned area. Waited for 5 mins or so but no music playing. The show is too big to waste time waiting for someone to be bothered to put some music on.

Hi Sunbeam, with two dem rooms and the Mu-so area, playing music continuously everywhere would result in cacophony. Spillage over the thin walls is a real problem. So we decided to alternate: dems on the hour in the large room with Utopia III Evo and Mu-so areas, on the half hour in the Uniti room.

You probably came in during the break. There is a sign right by the door showing the times but next year we need to put up even more signs -- a lot of people seem to have overlooked the one by the door.

Bert Schurink posted:

One impression I would like to leave our Chord friends with. Heard the Mojo besides the Hugo 2. I don't understand that some people on this forum see the chord Mojo in a same league as the Hugo. For me the Hugo was clearly in a completely different league. So much more mature and refined. This doesn't mean that the Mojo isn't a great product, it is ....however just in a different league...

Mojo vs hugo or mojo vs new hugo2...

Some people talk about hugo2 vs Dave....

Thomas Kunzler posted:

Went intonthe Naim partitioned area. Waited for 5 mins or so but no music playing. The show is too big to waste time waiting for someone to be bothered to put some music on.

Hi Sunbeam, with two dem rooms and the Mu-so area, playing music continuously everywhere would result in cacophony. Spillage over the thin walls is a real problem. So we decided to alternate: dems on the hour in the large room with Utopia III Evo and Mu-so areas, on the half hour in the Uniti room.

You probably came in during the break. There is a sign right by the door showing the times but next year we need to put up even more signs -- a lot of people seem to have overlooked the one by the door.

 

 

Thanks for the explanation. I did catch the dems later. With 100 rooms to get around its difficult to try to revisit rooms to a schedule -  there's so much walking to do already. The good thing was that you did play your equipment. Too many ither companies doing static displays which feels like a rip off as a visitor. I can look at stuff in mags and online, visitors want to hear stuff in action, so it was good that Naim and Focal were doing so.

It does seem mad to have static displays at hifi shows. 

Sure it may as well be a lego medel. 

.sjb

Emre posted:

Bert Schurink posted:

One impression I would like to leave our Chord friends with. Heard the Mojo besides the Hugo 2. I don't understand that some people on this forum see the chord Mojo in a same league as the Hugo. For me the Hugo was clearly in a completely different league. So much more mature and refined. This doesn't mean that the Mojo isn't a great product, it is ....however just in a different league...

Mojo vs hugo or mojo vs new hugo2...

Some people talk about hugo2 vs Dave....

Demo at home DAVE through 250DR to Sopra 2 next week.

sunbeamgls posted:

joerand posted:

Bert,

If you see Totem Acoustics I'm interested in their new Sky speaker. The bookshelf/standmount is currently available. There's a purported floorstander model I'm particularly interested in that could be making an appearance. My focus would be on its bottom-end speed and control. Cheers.

The very small Sky Tower (2k gbp) sounded fantastic. Much better than the more expensive floor standers with the 2x 6 inch drivers which were boomy and muddy sounding.

I totally agree, I was very impressed with the smaller Skys and absolutely gobsmacked by the new Tribe Tower. Apart from that the show stoppers were Chord Hugo 2 (the difference between it and the Mojo is very significant) and the 552 / double 300DR demo with some of the ugliest speakers ever seen. Just closed my eyes and enjoyed the 552 sweet spot. Also impressed by the Sennheiser 820. The show was overall so good I went back on Sunday.

sunbeamgls posted:

 

My goodness! Those speakers are ugly in the extreme!

Clive B posted:

sunbeamgls posted:

 

My goodness! Those speakers are ugly in the extreme!

Have you seen the Grand Utopias? They're even bigger.........

Clive B posted:

sunbeamgls posted:

 

My goodness! Those speakers are ugly in the extreme!

Exactly

I was there and not impressed at all with the Naim systems.

The most musical one was the simplest one with the Core and Atom or Nova. No powerlines and speaker cable was ..... A5. Too much bass but engaging and lots of value for money. The Nova brings a wider soundstage, more relaxed presentation with better attack and deckay. I could only imagine how this gear can play with Naim speakers, it will probably be fantastic!

The Focals room. I didn't like it at all, not the Naim sound i like. I would never buy a Naim system based on what i listened. I wouldn't waste more than a couple of minutes on it. Speakers were biamped with 300's....i thought Naim didn't "like" biamp.... trying to put Naims to have sinergy with Focals is a lost battle. My apologies to those who have a different opinion.

The Kudos room, i listened to the bigger ones. I had to leave, because they were playing so loud that the bass and midbass was overhelming. Not impressed. I got the impression that the speakers were not correctly positioned in the room.

What really impressed me were the numerous rooms so much better than the Naim rooms. I am very sad to write this, but .....

Best regards

Rui

Thanks chaps for posting your thoughts from the show. Very interesting. As usual, it seems that whether it's dealer open days or full on Hi-Fi shows, the simpler systems seem to impress more than the more complex setups. 

James

b_lund posted:

Clive B posted:

sunbeamgls posted:

 

My goodness! Those speakers are ugly in the extreme!

Exactly

 

I'm sure they look ok in the right sort of room - something that looks like a conference room perhaps - but enormous shininess is just not right for a normal sitting room. 

I have read so many negative comments about shows with Naim and Focal - it's such a shame. 

Hungryhalibut posted:

b_lund posted:

Clive B posted:

sunbeamgls posted: 

I have read so many negative comments about shows with Naim and Focal - it's such a shame. 

I didn't last long in Naim's "big room" at Acoustica's recent show.

I couldn't decide if it's that I just don't enjoy the sound of Focal speakers, or whether it's the Naim / Focal combo which fails to excite.

Sadly, the two brands are now inextricably linked at public events, so I'll just have to pass, I'm afraid. 

dave marshall posted:

Hungryhalibut posted:

b_lund posted:

Clive B posted:

sunbeamgls posted: 

I have read so many negative comments about shows with Naim and Focal - it's such a shame. 

I didn't last long in Naim's "big room" at Acoustica's recent show.

I couldn't decide if it's that I just don't enjoy the sound of Focal speakers, or whether it's the Naim / Focal combo which fails to excite.

Sadly, the two brands are now inextricably linked at public events, so I'll just have to pass, I'm afraid. 

Unfortunately, I have to agree with you. I've heard half a dozen or so Naim/Focal systems at shows, and every one of them was a complete turn-off to my ears. Other speaker manufacturers demonstrating their wares using Naim systems generally sounded very good, including Kudos, Dynaudio and Russel K, so it does seem to be a Focal thing. 

Hello, theres nothing worng with focal and/or naim, from my experience i can tell sure isn't mismatch, there are many factors like time, room size, system components...try to demo to dealer and you will change perception.

I suppose it's like an arranged marriage, whereby the two parties are conveniently suited according to astrology and caste, yet when you meet the bride to be you find you're marrying Godzilla!

who is godzilla

Adi Stefan posted:

Hello, theres nothing worng with focal and/or naim, from my experience i can tell sure isn't mismatch, there are many factors like time, room size, system components...try to demo to dealer and you will change perception.

I have to go with Chrissu on this one - and he mentions 6 different systems.  I have similar experiences at shows and dealers - classic / 500 / Statement and Utopia just don't seem to work together.  Naim with Sopra is a step in the right direction. Uniti or XS seem to work OK with Aria.

Adi Stefan posted:

who is godzilla

Sombody from king kong s family

At the Bristol shows that I've been to recently, I've found myself going back to, and staying for longer in, the Naim-Dynaudio room. To me the pairing "just sounds right".

Ok, my dealer don't have 500 or statement, but i listened to focal diablo with 272/250, focal electra with 200 and 250, sopra n2, n3, with 250, 300,  272, 282, it's hard to say mismatch, just that the bigger systems need attention.

The last show I went to, Russell K's sounded very poor, Kudos poor, Harbeth, most brands poor, but that doesn't mean any of the aforementioned should be steered clear of.... It is generally the room, the acoustics, ect ect

Even the naim room didn't sound any where near as good as it should. 

One of the best sounding speakers was a £1000 Revel offering, with the system sat on a dodgy rack bought from lkea....

For the first time i heard Harbeth speakers (big ones).

The sound was way beyond bad! It is not possible that these speakers sound so bad.

Room acoustics,  speaker positioning, other factors, i don't know. There was no bass whatsover, and the rest was bland.

Regards,

Rui