BBC news only:

Manchester Arena incident after Ariana Grande concert

Truly a sad state the world is currently in these days. God bless those killed and hurt. 

Daily news beginning here, they say about 20 people died and more than 50 hurt.  Cause of explosion not confirmed. Very little information available.

Manchester Arena is located adjacent to and is accessed via Victoria Railway/Metrolink Station. Initial indications are that 19 people have died some possibly due to the crush following the explosion which occurred as the concert was ending. It is believed that the explosion was detonated by a suicide bomber close to but not necessarily inside the actual venue.

Confirmed as nineteen people killed, fifty injured, probably all youngsters given the type of concert. How absolutely terrible. Let's hope they catch the sick bastards responsible as soon as possible. Sad times indeed.

Very very very sad....

My heart goes out to all those affected.

Just such sad news to wake up to.An absolute tragedy and targeting children how callous.Hope the perpetrator rots in hell.

Just woke up to this terrible news, my thoughts to all those affected by this horrendous act.

Kind of a microcosm of the history of human civilization where religious ideologies often motivate such atrocities, but who's to say at this point in this case?

Yes indeed a sad sad day in many respects.   22 killed & 59 injured is the lastest info.   The most shocking is the mindless, senseless & pointlessness of it, Ariana Grande's fans are children, young teens & mostly girls.     

joerand posted:

Kind of a microcosm of the history of human civilization where religious ideologies often motivate such atrocities, but who's to say at this point in this case?

I think it's fairly safe to assume that some idealogical point was being made here, as this happened on the fourth anniversary of the killing of soldier Lee Rigby, in London.

Music is the common factor with all of us here on the forum.  I'm sure we all feel for the families of those killed and for those injured in last nights atrocities which happened following an evening of shared joy which we all can relate to.

The psychopathic murderers that commit these crimes really are the most ghastly examples of human life.

Imagine the anguish of those parents still unable to find their kids, and vice versa.

Even by the desperately low standards of suicide bombers, you really have to be a special kind of degenerate to target an event mostly attended by teenage girls.

What a pity that Hell does not exist, as there should be a special place reserved in its darkest, dankest corner for the person or persons who did this.

Whether or not it was inspired by a deviant view of Islam (or of any other religion) it's still nothing other than murder.

The people and organisations involved in these acts shouldn't be given any more credibility or position than any other murderers.  And that's how I believe the media should refer to them, not lend them any credence as "terrorists", just call them what they are - murderers... plain ordinary murderers.

I completely agree with the above post by Huge.

The individuals who have committed this and other similar atrocities are simply evil, callous and sadistic mass murderers. Anyone who is found to have provided support for them should be arrested, charged and labelled accordingly. 

(Let me draw some of the ire on myself...- specially if I'm misunderstood - and I'll probably draw ire from all sides)

The individual who committed these acts were stupid, malleable, brainwashed, radicalized and coerced into committing this evil deed. I feel sorry for them, and pity - but not too much.

I feel sorry and sad at the meaningless loss of life. For the victims. All the lives lost. All the futures. All the brilliance.

I direct my anger at the organizations behind the heinous act. And their supporters, financers, and profiteers. The master manipulators who are ultimately seeking to profit by destabilizing the world. ISIS. I do wonder who is ultimately pulling the strings.

But also a little towards the society that allowed for the brainwashing and radicalizing of these sick people who commuted the atrocity. For allowing the religious places to go unchecked.

And also afraid for the next generation / if we don't learn the right lessons - what's to keep our children from getting radicalized?

[have I commuted a faux pas here? Our children? As vs. 'their'? Is there really a us vs. them? As opposed to just us?]

Unfortunately, evil is not the purview of one religion. Every single one can and has been weaponized. 

Now is the time to grieve. The time for questioning will come.

Frank F posted:

Hmack posted:

I completely agree with the above post by Huge.

The individuals who have committed this and other similar atrocities are simply evil, callous and sadistic mass murderers. Anyone who is found to have provided support for them should be arrested, charged and labelled accordingly. 

And also deported, even if they were born in UK.  IMO that is another reason for saying goodbye to the European Court of Justice.

FF

Deported to where? The Moon? 

I have been struggling to get my thoughts together today. Perhaps because I'm away from home this horrible event has left me less upset than I think somehow it ought.

The truth is however that I want to find some perspective. I want to find the right emotions of anger, sadness, sympathy and horror but I also want to see this in proportion.

The effect of a terrorist act like this is hugley disproportionate to its actual damage. This is the purpose of the act, and informs the choice of target. That is not to minimise the effect on the bereaved or wounded. I have some knowledge of this; a friend of mine, albeit not a close one, died in an infamous terrorist event some years ago. I can summon that feeling of loss and sheer disbelief still but it never stopped me functioning. It did not stop me catching a plane, just as this event will not, indeed must not, stop me attending concerts, sports events or whatever. This will also not make me demonise a faith group or a way of life. It won't stop me having friends from a range of cultures and faiths. It will not change my life although it may devastate others.

So I don't want to let this event pass without emotion but I also want to rember it is, in the scheme of things, not overwhelmingly important. What matters is that we don't respond as the terrorists wish us to do. We must do what we should to protect and secure (and to ask "why" with as much intelligence as possible) but we must also find the proportionality that means we get on with our normal lives. Lives that hopefully are messy, sociable, varied and rich in human experiences that these terrorists will not stop, and that they will never share either.

Bruce

next plane out of uk

The police have now named the bomber: a 22 year-old, born in Manchester of Libyan descent.

I think MangoMonkey makes a fair point above. How did this 22 year old come to act in this way? Surely not on his own. And how did he obtain the explosives and knowledge to produce the bomb? He must have been aided.  And what of his family and friends? Was he able to plan and execute this abhorrent act without leaving any hints or clues that his friends and family might see? The authorities will I'm sure be asking and pursuing these and other questions with vigour.  It is those that aided the perpetrator that deserve the heaviest penalties that the law can apply, and those close to hime that saw things and did nothing must also be held to account.     

One can say 'no' to radicalisation.

MDS posted:

The police have now named the bomber: a 22 year-old, born in Manchester of Libyan descent.

I think MangoMonkey makes a fair point above. How did this 22 year old come to act in this way? Surely not on his own. And how did he obtain the explosives and knowledge to produce the bomb? He must have been aided.  And what of his family and friends? Was he able to plan and execute this abhorrent act without leaving any hints or clues that his friends and family might see? The authorities will I'm sure be asking and pursuing these and other questions with vigour.  It is those that aided the perpetrator that deserve the heaviest penalties that the law can apply, and those close to hime that saw things and did nothing must also be held to account.     

Not too sure as to the relevance of the descriptor "of Libyan descent". 

If he was born and raised in Manchester he was British. Would we have differentiated had he been born to N. American, Swiss, Australian or Icelandic parents? No, I thought not.

Presumably Frank F would have seen him deported to Libya, had he survived!

i think it's time to accept this is not a Libyan, Syrian, Pakistani, Afghani etc. etc. issue. Unless it can be demonstrated that this young man was radicalised, trained and funded by a foreign regime, this is a British terrorist committing atrocities on British soul, it's a British problem, not one for which we should be demonising Libya or a Middle Eastern country.

What a disgusting thread this has become with some of the comments this afternoon ... taking such a horrific and tradgic crime into something to make political statements over.