Love my CDX2. But what about vinyl??
Posted by: Andib on 08 July 2017
After months of abstinence (only using my nds and bauer TT) I am once again very impressed by my CDX2. Just wow!! A very dynamic and "punchy" sound. And also warm and detailed - nearly a bit of everything to me..
But I never found a turntable with that CDX2 sound.. Is there any out there? I tried proJect expression and rpm5, rega P5 and RP10 (just lent 3 days), and bauer dps2 over the years. The "nearest" in that category to my ears was the RP10... But what would you say? Is there any TT masterpiece in this regard? Thank you for any recommendations.
I took a look at Andib profile, he has 4 turntables. All of a muchness, with not a suspended subchasis in sight. Although quality turntables.
Perhaps an old British subchasis turntable, LP12, Manticore or systemdek fitted with a good arm and Denon DL103 would produce the sound he’s after.
The manticore would probably give a more realistic presentati……… (NO, NO WHAT AM I SAYING 
).
You'd be surprised how good an LP12 Klimax can sound with Superline and Supercap with some decent all analogue LPs. I might have thought the same a few years back. I bought my first LP12 in 1990 and have had an LP12 ever since. Not everyone's cup of tea I accept but there's always room for one in this house
Funny old hobby this isn't it? My mate across the lane spends a small fortune restoring his E-type drop head and can't get our hobby at all. Still at least I get to ride in the E-type from time to time - just an AM radio in that!
Innocent Bystander posted:Keler Pierre posted:i found a recent review of comparaison of: dave-hugo- berkeley reference dac and don't remember the last two. The reviewer found the dave very good, but little harsh on voices vs the berkeley...
John Atkinson, on june stereophile, preferred the meridian ultra dac, more realistic true tones colors and decay of notes.
Martin Colloms preferred the nds/555dr to chord dave: nds was more dynamic and had more prat.
To end, dave is a very good dac, yes. the best of all: no. better as high end vinyl: absolutely not.
I've never heard any of the current crop of high end vinyl above standard LP12: I presume there are differences between them, too, with some possibly preferred by some reviewers, and some by others? If so, none is absolutely the best.
Similarly I haven't heard the other high end DACs quoted, and assume that yes, indeed there will be differences, and some systems will be better suited to some DACs over others, which in part will depend on system and user preferences. But Dave, and possibly some or all of these others, and, I contend, even lowly Hugo, make music that can be every bit as involving as vinyl. I believe.
For me, the sound that now can be achieved by good digital mean that the limitations of vinyl outweigh its all-analogue signal path (assuming recorded in analogue) and somehow I doubt any high end turntable can remove the surface noise or restore the dynamic range. But of course, others will prefer the colouration of analogue, if that is not too strong a word, just as some prefer the colouration of various other bits of kit, whether that be a particular 'house sound' or a particular style of speaker. And as others have said there's nothing srong with that.
It's a myth that vinyl suffers from surface noise. As long as you don't mistreat them most are silent and even slight crackles on older albums can be cleaned up using a decent record cleaner.
Of the c600 albums I own all but a handful bought second hand have any discernable surface noise. As long as you hold them by the edge and keep them in poly inner liners they will remain pristine.
The only "limitation" of vinyl albums is that you have to get up half way through to turn them over.
Jonn posted:It's a myth that vinyl suffers from surface noise. As long as you don't mistreat them most are silent and even slight crackles on older albums can be cleaned up using a decent record cleaner.
Of the c600 albums I own all but a handful bought second hand have any discernable surface noise. As long as you hold them by the edge and keep them in poly inner liners they will remain pristine.
The only "limitation" of vinyl albums is that you have to get up half way through to turn them over.
Well, my experience is very different. Most of the 500 or so records that I collected had some discernible surfacenoise from the day they were bought (mostly new), and over time this increased, more so with the most played records. And no I am not talking about master tape hiss, or turntable rumble, and yes, I knew how to handle LPs properly from before my first purchase, and took great care both to handle correctly and place in the inner sleeve carefully. (In fact I discovered a source of inner sleeves that folded over the LP rather than having to slide in, and used those to replace many of the original inner sleeves). Very occasionally, despite careful handling, there would be occasional mishaps causing minor damage on some records (clicks or pops), however those could be ignored more than the feint but gradually increasing frying eggs and bacon sound, which on 30-40 year old albums that may have been played 100s of times
Yes, tracking and bias were properly set and weight correct, and I was particular about regularly changing the stylus. I was also very particular about cleaning, using a velvet cloth, later a velvet pad with carbon fibre leading bruch, and a 'dust bug', and a piezo antistatic gun etc. however, recent received wisdom suggests that the root cause of the majority of the surface noise may have been gradually ingrained dust despite my best efforts at cleaning, as I never had -through lack of awareness of need - a wet cleaner. I accept that it is possible that dirt may have been the cause, but it was indeed real, And I doubtbcompletely unique to me - and is something to which digital streaming is completely immune.
analogmusic posted:Je comprends, vous avez une affection avec le Vinyl, a certain Je ne sais quoi.
enjoy the sauna, I'm enjoying the music
By the way I'm listening to David Hallyday, the debut album,
on Vinyl
Vive la difference
i am listening more with my nds, because it is more funny, have not to clean my lp, take some time to choose a vinyl...and i am not discovering much new lps to hear. The turntable is only on special occasions now, but always a great moment!
If one day my digital rig will sound so good as vinyl for music recorded originally on lp, i will sell my turntable with no regrets.
fatcat posted:I took a look at Andib profile, he has 4 turntables. All of a muchness, with not a suspended subchasis in sight. Although quality turntables.
Perhaps an old British subchasis turntable, LP12, Manticore or systemdek fitted with a good arm and Denon DL103 would produce the sound he’s after.
The manticore would probably give a more realistic presentati……… (NO, NO WHAT AM I SAYING
for me the most dynamic and punchy turntables are direct drive. But it can not be always the case, like clearaudio innovation, very dynamic, but a bit clinical.
For Fremer, the most bombastic is the vpi direct drive, a 25 k rig. I would love to have it. New garrard 401 or 501, and also less expensive brinkman bardo.
Lp12 / ekos/ armagedon/ lyra also...
Jonn posted:Innocent Bystander posted:Keler Pierre posted:i found a recent review of comparaison of: dave-hugo- berkeley reference dac and don't remember the last two. The reviewer found the dave very good, but little harsh on voices vs the berkeley...
John Atkinson, on june stereophile, preferred the meridian ultra dac, more realistic true tones colors and decay of notes.
Martin Colloms preferred the nds/555dr to chord dave: nds was more dynamic and had more prat.
To end, dave is a very good dac, yes. the best of all: no. better as high end vinyl: absolutely not.
I've never heard any of the current crop of high end vinyl above standard LP12: I presume there are differences between them, too, with some possibly preferred by some reviewers, and some by others? If so, none is absolutely the best.
Similarly I haven't heard the other high end DACs quoted, and assume that yes, indeed there will be differences, and some systems will be better suited to some DACs over others, which in part will depend on system and user preferences. But Dave, and possibly some or all of these others, and, I contend, even lowly Hugo, make music that can be every bit as involving as vinyl. I believe.
For me, the sound that now can be achieved by good digital mean that the limitations of vinyl outweigh its all-analogue signal path (assuming recorded in analogue) and somehow I doubt any high end turntable can remove the surface noise or restore the dynamic range. But of course, others will prefer the colouration of analogue, if that is not too strong a word, just as some prefer the colouration of various other bits of kit, whether that be a particular 'house sound' or a particular style of speaker. And as others have said there's nothing srong with that.
It's a myth that vinyl suffers from surface noise. As long as you don't mistreat them most are silent and even slight crackles on older albums can be cleaned up using a decent record cleaner.
Of the c600 albums I own all but a handful bought second hand have any discernable surface noise. As long as you hold them by the edge and keep them in poly inner liners they will remain pristine.
The only "limitation" of vinyl albums is that you have to get up half way through to turn them over.
exactly, very low noise, only on beginning when there is no music. I am buying only near mint or mint original records at discog. But i must confess it is not dead quiet as digital. For me it is the only negative aspect.
Innocent Bystander posted:Jonn posted:It's a myth that vinyl suffers from surface noise. As long as you don't mistreat them most are silent and even slight crackles on older albums can be cleaned up using a decent record cleaner.
Of the c600 albums I own all but a handful bought second hand have any discernable surface noise. As long as you hold them by the edge and keep them in poly inner liners they will remain pristine.
The only "limitation" of vinyl albums is that you have to get up half way through to turn them over.
Well, my experience is very different. Most of the 500 or so records that I collected had some discernible surfacenoise from the day they were bought (mostly new), and over time this increased, more so with the most played records. And no I am not talking about master tape hiss, or turntable rumble, and yes, I knew how to handle LPs properly from before my first purchase, and took great care both to handle correctly and place in the inner sleeve carefully. (In fact I discovered a source of inner sleeves that folded over the LP rather than having to slide in, and used those to replace many of the original inner sleeves). Very occasionally, despite careful handling, there would be occasional mishaps causing minor damage on some records (clicks or pops), however those could be ignored more than the feint but gradually increasing frying eggs and bacon sound, which on 30-40 year old albums that may have been played 100s of times
Yes, tracking and bias were properly set and weight correct, and I was particular about regularly changing the stylus. I was also very particular about cleaning, using a velvet cloth, later a velvet pad with carbon fibre leading bruch, and a 'dust bug', and a piezo antistatic gun etc. however, recent received wisdom suggests that the root cause of the majority of the surface noise may have been gradually ingrained dust despite my best efforts at cleaning, as I never had -through lack of awareness of need - a wet cleaner. I accept that it is possible that dirt may have been the cause, but it was indeed real, And I doubtbcompletely unique to me - and is something to which digital streaming is completely immune.
in that conditions i understand that vinyl is not a joy! try discogs, you can have mint original sealed lps: it smells also so good. No noise at all. Or new lps remasters by mobile fidelity: fantastic. like santana:abraxas, pink floyd, miles davis : in a silent way... better than original, than dsd, than even sex( sometimes)...
Keler Pierre posted:Innocent Bystander posted:Jonn posted:It's a myth that vinyl suffers from surface noise. As long as you don't mistreat them most are silent and even slight crackles on older albums can be cleaned up using a decent record cleaner.
Of the c600 albums I own all but a handful bought second hand have any discernable surface noise. As long as you hold them by the edge and keep them in poly inner liners they will remain pristine.
The only "limitation" of vinyl albums is that you have to get up half way through to turn them over.
Well, my experience is very different. Most of the 500 or so records that I collected had some discernible surfacenoise from the day they were bought (mostly new), and over time this increased, more so with the most played records. And no I am not talking about master tape hiss, or turntable rumble, and yes, I knew how to handle LPs properly from before my first purchase, and took great care both to handle correctly and place in the inner sleeve carefully. (In fact I discovered a source of inner sleeves that folded over the LP rather than having to slide in, and used those to replace many of the original inner sleeves). Very occasionally, despite careful handling, there would be occasional mishaps causing minor damage on some records (clicks or pops), however those could be ignored more than the feint but gradually increasing frying eggs and bacon sound, which on 30-40 year old albums that may have been played 100s of times
Yes, tracking and bias were properly set and weight correct, and I was particular about regularly changing the stylus. I was also very particular about cleaning, using a velvet cloth, later a velvet pad with carbon fibre leading bruch, and a 'dust bug', and a piezo antistatic gun etc. however, recent received wisdom suggests that the root cause of the majority of the surface noise may have been gradually ingrained dust despite my best efforts at cleaning, as I never had -through lack of awareness of need - a wet cleaner. I accept that it is possible that dirt may have been the cause, but it was indeed real, And I doubtbcompletely unique to me - and is something to which digital streaming is completely immune.
in that conditions i understand that vinyl is not a joy! try discogs, you can have mint original sealed lps: it smells also so good. No noise at all. Or new lps remasters by mobile fidelity: fantastic. like santana:abraxas, pink floyd, miles davis : in a silent way... better than original, than dsd, than even sex( sometimes)...
As I indicated, I found most brand new albums had some surface noise, clearly normal- occasionally if particularly bad I'd return it to the shop and exchange for another, when usually better but sometimes a whole pressing would be bad.
Of course, I was able to ignore the surface noise on all but the worst records, but once digital became good it was so nice to be free of having to ignore it (except on vinyl that I ripped and still have in streamable form).
Having ripped all vinyl I sold my turntable about 7 or 8 years ago - with some sadness as it had served me well, but it went to a new home where it would be cherished.
I'm a bit worried that you think some LPs can be better than sex. Digital of course may be another matter...
Innocent Bystander posted:Innocent Bystander posted:Jonn posted:It's a myth ......
The only "limitation" of vinyl albums is that you have to get up half way through to turn them over.
Well, my experience is very different. Most of the 500 or so records that I collected had some discernible surface noise from the day they were bought (mostly new), and over time this increased, more so with the most played records. And no I am no.....
As I indicated..........
Of course, I was able to ignore the surface noise on all but the worst records, but once digital became good it was so nice to be free of having to ignore it (except on vinyl that I ripped and still have in streamable form).
Having ripped all vinyl I sold my turntable about 7 or 8 years ago - with some sadness as it had served me well, but it went to a new home where it would be cherished.
Posted by Pierre:
"exactly, very low noise, only on beginning when there is no music. I am buying only near mint or mint original records at discog. But i must confess it is not dead quiet as digital. For me it is the only negative aspect."
These are the reasons I sold my LP 12!
1986 ~ $1,486
2015 ~ $1,550 > Ittock/K 9 The Dog
The two things, I miss the most:
The matching Walnut Fluted TT with Fluted Briks, and the Status of owning, an LP 12!
I LOVE MY CDX2, BUT WHAT ABOUT THE TT!
Allante93!
analogmusic posted:People listen for different things, Mojo has been voiced for neutral frequency response, with exceptional timing.
It’s voiced to be smooth and warm.
I purchased the mojo because it IS smooth and warm. And that’s straight from the horses mouth.
From an interview by EAR with Rob Watts
“You say you tuned the Mojo to have a smoother sound”,
“Yes I wanted it smoother and warmer”.
That’s right, you read that correctly, Rob Watts said the mojo is Smooth and warm.
analogmusic posted:not sure what is your issue...?
it's only a 400 GBP DAC, what did you want 8000 GBP of Dave performance for 400 GBP?
You get what you paid for.
I don’t have an issue with warm and smooth, as I said, I bought it because it IS warm and smooth. Obviously you didn’t read that part.
I personally think warm and smooth is good, very good. I know others don't, but I do.
Innocent Bystander posted:Keler Pierre posted:Innocent Bystander posted:Jonn posted:It's a myth that vinyl suffers from surface noise. As long as you don't mistreat them most are silent and even slight crackles on older albums can be cleaned up using a decent record cleaner.
Of the c600 albums I own all but a handful bought second hand have any discernable surface noise. As long as you hold them by the edge and keep them in poly inner liners they will remain pristine.
The only "limitation" of vinyl albums is that you have to get up half way through to turn them over.
Well, my experience is very different. Most of the 500 or so records that I collected had some discernible surfacenoise from the day they were bought (mostly new), and over time this increased, more so with the most played records. And no I am not talking about master tape hiss, or turntable rumble, and yes, I knew how to handle LPs properly from before my first purchase, and took great care both to handle correctly and place in the inner sleeve carefully. (In fact I discovered a source of inner sleeves that folded over the LP rather than having to slide in, and used those to replace many of the original inner sleeves). Very occasionally, despite careful handling, there would be occasional mishaps causing minor damage on some records (clicks or pops), however those could be ignored more than the feint but gradually increasing frying eggs and bacon sound, which on 30-40 year old albums that may have been played 100s of times
Yes, tracking and bias were properly set and weight correct, and I was particular about regularly changing the stylus. I was also very particular about cleaning, using a velvet cloth, later a velvet pad with carbon fibre leading bruch, and a 'dust bug', and a piezo antistatic gun etc. however, recent received wisdom suggests that the root cause of the majority of the surface noise may have been gradually ingrained dust despite my best efforts at cleaning, as I never had -through lack of awareness of need - a wet cleaner. I accept that it is possible that dirt may have been the cause, but it was indeed real, And I doubtbcompletely unique to me - and is something to which digital streaming is completely immune.
in that conditions i understand that vinyl is not a joy! try discogs, you can have mint original sealed lps: it smells also so good. No noise at all. Or new lps remasters by mobile fidelity: fantastic. like santana:abraxas, pink floyd, miles davis : in a silent way... better than original, than dsd, than even sex( sometimes)...
As I indicated, I found most brand new albums had some surface noise, clearly normal- occasionally if particularly bad I'd return it to the shop and exchange for another, when usually better but sometimes a whole pressing would be bad.
Of course, I was able to ignore the surface noise on all but the worst records, but once digital became good it was so nice to be free of having to ignore it (except on vinyl that I ripped and still have in streamable form).
Having ripped all vinyl I sold my turntable about 7 or 8 years ago - with some sadness as it had served me well, but it went to a new home where it would be cherished.
I'm a bit worried that you think some LPs can be better than sex. Digital of course may be another matter...
it is an expression of Michael Fremer, when he heard the continuum caliburn turntable in his house. The sound was so good, the pleasure so strong, that he said " better than sex". Ii is not to be taken too seriously....
As for lps, new one are very often noisy and the sound is compressed. I am buying new original one, which are still sealed since 40 years! or near mint ones.
Today new vinyl: only mobile fidelity and analogue productions.
But i can understand that you prefer all digital, no problem....For now i prefer both, but tomorrow i don't know....