Selling on the Naim Forum

Not a facebook fan (although I do have an active account due to a fundraising effort I have contributed to) but I imagine the difference is Naim owns this forum and sets the rules while Facebook has their own guidelines on what can or cannot be contributed on their forum.

There are lots of other options if you want to sell hifi equipment. Surely you don’t want the forum full of dodgy Arthur Daley types. (Apologies to trilby/sheepskin coat wearing members).

I got in trouble a couple of years ago for trying to give away a 3mm long screw worth about 15p.

What I don’t understand is how dealers can get away with posting in-depth positive reviews of equipment they sell.

Just to be clear, the last thing I'd want is selling on here, and I agree wholeheartedly with you. I just wondered why it's ok to sell stuff on the Facebook page. Perhaps it is simply, as suggested above, that it cannot be prevented. 

Aren't there two sites - one is the official Naim Facebook page, the other one is a Naim Audio Group.

I take it the Group must be unofficial and is the one that has the ads, modifcations etc allowed ?

You are right - I've just checked. There's the really boring official Naim Audio Limited site, which has endless promotional stuff, and the other one, which has lots of pictures of people stacking their boxes directly on top of each other. There seem to be a couple of posts from Naim people though. 

Clearly I should have checked properly before posting my inane question. 

i am a member of both, the FB page does have a number of posts with "i have this for sale" lots of photos of Naim systems,  but some good comments and photos,  my advise on the FB page for detailed questions is to join this forum

i would not buy from FB page or fle bay to be honest so just ignore the posts

Hungryhalibut posted:

You are right - I've just checked. There's the really boring official Naim Audio Limited site, which has endless promotional stuff, and the other one, which has lots of pictures of people stacking their boxes directly on top of each other. There seem to be a couple of posts from Naim people though. 

Clearly I should have checked properly before posting my inane question. 

Haha yes you can't help but notice all the stacking. Even seen phono stages on top of or pushed up against power supplies or amps. 

I'm part of the group but very rarely make comment. 

HH, I tend to try to steer clear of FB, but, if there are any posts of anyone trying to sell via the official Naim FB page, I will ask the person who runs the Naim FB page to review this.  

fatcat posted:

There are lots of other options if you want to sell hifi equipment. Surely you don’t want the forum full of dodgy Arthur Daley types. (Apologies to trilby/sheepskin coat wearing members).

I got in trouble a couple of years ago for trying to give away a 3mm long screw worth about 15p.

What I don’t understand is how dealers can get away with posting in-depth positive reviews of equipment they sell.

I'm not sure where you've seen this on here though? In my experience it does not apply to me. I have to take great care in talking about particular likes of mine other than Naim plus I do get bit of latitude on that Scottish turntable and that's about it. Richard has been very clear on this one.

FB groups are a different matter I suppose, but I tend to steer clear of them anyway.

KR

Peter

Quite.  To expand on Peter's post above, there are strict rules for trade members on discussion of non-Naim products.  With a few minor exceptions (generally networking and vinyl related discussion), discussion by a trade member of any non-Naim product with which they may have commercial interest is not allowed.

However, it's fine for a dealer to post a review of any Naim product.  Mention of any additional non-Naim ancillaries in the reviewed system is OK, so long as the review is not actually about them.

In all cases, the aim is to ensure that the Naim forum is as "clean" as possible, and not being used as a vehicle to promote other makers products.

Cymbiosis posted:

fatcat posted:

There are lots of other options if you want to sell hifi equipment. Surely you don’t want the forum full of dodgy Arthur Daley types. (Apologies to trilby/sheepskin coat wearing members).

I got in trouble a couple of years ago for trying to give away a 3mm long screw worth about 15p.

What I don’t understand is how dealers can get away with posting in-depth positive reviews of equipment they sell.

I'm not sure where you've seen this on here though? In my experience it does not apply to me. I have to take great care in talking about particular likes of mine other than Naim plus I do get bit of latitude on that Scottish turntable and that's about it. Richard has been very clear on this one.

FB groups are a different matter I suppose, but I tend to steer clear of them anyway.

KR

Peter

Peter.

I didn't have you in mind, but, I will investigate your claim this evening, when I have a few hours spare.

Tiger Paw.

https://forums.naimaudio.com/to...skale-for-aro?page=1

As the Aro is not in production I think that discussing accessories to it, like the sKale for Aro, is fair - but if Naim could be persuaded to re-start production of the Aro ........... 

Chris Dolan posted:

As the Aro is not in production I think that discussing accessories to it, like the sKale for Aro, is fair - but if Naim could be persuaded to re-start production of the Aro ........... 

Oh if only!!!

Anyway that thread was in 2012 not now, things are very different IMHO and also there was factory support for the Aro back then of course and not now

However, there is support for the Aro out there with an increasing number of "replacement parts" being available if you know where to look! 

Hopefully in the interest of Aro owners Richard will let this little misdemeanor go!

Best regards,

Peter

I have asked Trevor to consider having an official Naim Approved area, where Naim dealers can post for sale items. This would allow customers to locate items within the dealer network (which is v difficult at the moment) and know they come from a reputable source.

And would allow for some rules such as "if it needs a service, it gets it before sale" sort of thing, all as a quality experience thing. 

Postings would be read only, no discussion. 

However, nothing has come of it, which is a pity. If I was looking for second hand Naim kit, I would welcome such a thing.

Jon, that's a great idea, and would give prospective buyers some peace of mind. Come on Trevor, if the dealer has it second hand, someone has bought new product?

jon honeyball posted:

I have asked Trevor to consider having an official Naim Approved area, where Naim dealers can post for sale items. This would allow customers to locate items within the dealer network (which is v difficult at the moment) and know they come from a reputable source.

And would allow for some rules such as "if it needs a service, it gets it before sale" sort of thing, all as a quality experience thing. 

Postings would be read only, no discussion. 

However, nothing has come of it, which is a pity. If I was looking for second hand Naim kit, I would welcome such a thing.

This is something we tried to do some years back when I was at Naim as Customer Service Manager.  Unfortunately, interest in the scheme was limited and there were just too many concerns that could not be adequately satisfied so the idea was eventually shelved.

Jon. I'm afraid there a problem with your suggestion. Not all dealers are reputable.

If a naim dealer is not reputable, then they should not be a naim dealer. This is not rocket science. 

Richard: nevertheless, sending your customers to Ebay is has more concerns. Other sectors manage this just fine.

For example, a Naim dealer (with emphasis on Naim dealer, this is not generic) sold second hand product should have:

a) the right box

b) the right cables

c) the correct instruction manuals etc

d) a warranty of appropriate length

e) a check on service history, and appropriate servicing if necessary (eg a power supply must have a minimum of 5 years of service life left, if you accept the 10 year servicing strategy)

f) a check it hasnt, to the best of anyones knowledge, been stolen (a central register of stolen device serial numbers would help)

g) a functional check that it works, has no known faults

Given the above, who wants to spend 9 grand on ebay on a 552? Driving 2nd hand customers to official naim retailers can only be a good thing, and opens possibilities for other upsells -- an ongoing conversation to be had about cables, stands, and opportunity for chargeable install services (given there is no initial sale margin to play with here)

Can't really see the point as the free market works fine. Have you seen the difference in s/h prices across Naim dealers?  Not sure that some dealers would want that exposed on a collective site. Also some Naim dealers use eBay almost exclusively for s/h gear which benefits the customer as bargains are to be had.

Some dealers are reluctant to published selling  prices (please call) , some will negotiate, some won't.  It doesn't take long to find out what's available and which dealers are prepared to do a deal. It's a buyers market.

If you have a bit of common sense, buy through a reputable site and know what to ask and what to look for than buying s/h direct from the current owner can be perfectly safe and usually at significantly less cost than from a dealer ( not always of course and you need to weigh up the pros and cons like you would with any purchase).

Jonn posted:

Can't really see the point as the free market works fine. Have you seen the difference in s/h prices across Naim dealers?  Not sure that some dealers would want that exposed on a collective site. Also some Naim dealers use eBay almost exclusively for s/h gear which benefits the customer as bargains are to be had.

Some dealers are reluctant to published selling  prices (please call) , some will negotiate, some won't.  It doesn't take long to find out what's available and which dealers are prepared to do a deal. It's a buyers market.

If you have a bit of common sense, buy through a reputable site and know what to ask and what to look for than buying s/h direct from the current owner can be perfectly safe and usually at significantly less cost than from a dealer ( not always of course and you need to weigh up the pros and cons like you would with any purchase).

Agreed 150%

However, from a manufactures perspective, ain't nothing like new!

Allante93!

Jon, Naim would much rather customers buy from a Naim dealer. Many already offer good quality secondhand kit with a guarantee and sometimes even install. Some also get the kit serviced or checked by Naim before sale. No need to go to eBay...

Agreed, but do watch out. One dealer advertised a price but then expected me to pay the service on top without even having seen the equipment which was still in the hands of the original owner. I moved on to another, more honest dealer , who, needless to say, got the sale!

Richard Dane posted:

Jon, Naim would much rather customers buy from a Naim dealer. Many already offer good quality secondhand kit with a guarantee and sometimes even install.

{Some also get the kit serviced or checked by Naim before sale.}

No need to go to eBay...

Agreed again, plus I feel safer if any thing goes wrong!

Point in Case, an Authorized Naim Dealer in Canada, Advertised an 250.2 demo open box, with full warranty. Later he corrected it and said it was an error, but store demo with full 5 year warranty!

We bartered on price, and agreed, I asked for the SN, but never got it and pulled the trigger anyway!

STUPID, STUPID, STUPID!!!!!!!!!!$$$$$$

Anyhow got the 250.2, couldn't wait to unbox it, doubled box!

My jaw dropped to the floor when I seen the old Naim packaging!

What good is a 5 year warranty, on a 10 year old amp, it's ready for servicing!

To shorten the story, Eric @ Audio Plus Naim's North America repair Facility, got me out of that jam.

Two weeks later, got an real open box 2015 250.2 with full warranty from an US Naim Authorized Dealer.

And to your point Mr Richard Dane, an Authorized Naim Dealer in Europe, offered to convert an SC from 230V to 115V, before shipment!

Hence, I figured Naim had manufactured their products to work just fine in Europe & North America.

Allante93!

PS. Perhaps the same Transformers, as Innocent suggest! 

Of course, waiting on Steve to confirm!

Enjoy Your Music!

Richard Dane posted:

Jon, Naim would much rather customers buy from a Naim dealer. Many already offer good quality secondhand kit with a guarantee and sometimes even install. Some also get the kit serviced or checked by Naim before sale. No need to go to eBay...

You are missing the point. How do I find an item for sale at a uk naim dealer? Try trawling their websites? Hahahabonk. Phone each one in turn? 

This is the issue. If I am looking for, say, an xpsdr where do I start looking?????