A suggestion

I'm sorry to say that I think this idea is bound to fail. You will always find someone who has a problem with whichever router you name and anyway as we know from this thread, it can be fine one day and not the next, perhaps because of an app or firmware (or indeed router firmware) update. There are just too many variables in a home network with different products on it for this to be do-able. IMHO of course.

best

David

In the old days, Naim dealers were factory trained to set up SBLs, DBLs and the like. Perhaps it's time for them to be trained in getting the Network products working as they should. 

David Hendon posted:

I'm sorry to say that I think this idea is bound to fail.

Agree with that,   but why not,  just for the price of pig iron,  something might shake out.   And I'm assuming CP62 is taking on the responsibility of compiling the data base.

   My wireless hub is BT HH6 since early June 2017; its been 100% rock solid,  as was the previous HH5 that I had from late 2105 when I changed to their 80/20Mb/s service.      What might actually be more relevant is I have an all wired network centred on a switch.   I have no real problems with the app other than what I expected in beta testing;  nothing has stopped working as such,  definitely no discovery issues & 5.7.4 & 5.7.5 have been exceptionally good.

Hallo,

 I agree a router is like living organism because of updates but even with a little help somebody can find use of this settings.

And you can always update settings in the chart. And i agree that the dealer should know how to set up networks for the

customers. You can not sell a high end streamer to a customers and give him the box and say have fun. For most customers

this does not work. I worked for a company who sold audio like B&O and Nad en Rotel and we did mostly home installs.

I can remember the video recorders and how many times we had to go back to explain. Service is crucial if you sell high end

 and dealers should understand. I think with good install and explanation you would solve most problems. I am well aware of networks

and how they work but now i have problems i can not solve on my own. 

HH is spot on, hifi has changed and the dealers need to evolve, if they sell a few thousand pounds worth of wifi/ ethernet dependant product they need to be able to install. Not sure what Naim do in helping, by the number of problems on here, it would seem like it would be a good investment to train dealers in this area.

CP62 posted:

Hallo,

 As you read my problems with the new app and not knowing if it is the app or the router. So it’s strange is that the app always worked but the last three updated versions the app stopped working. Nothing changed in my router or other settings. The app keeps losing connection and even with a fresh install it only works for a few minutes.

 

A suggestion can we make a list with routers who can work with Naim streaming products and that we know work. So creating a database of routers and settings that we know that work. Just an idea?

 

I will say that I had an ASUS router and having UPnP enabled on the router really caused havoc with the NAIM app. I would go into the admin console and disable anything that the router is trying to do in regards to UPnP and DLNA so as not to conflict.

Unfortunately, with fewer and fewer hi-fi dealers in general, and Naim dealers in particular (at least in the USA), the distances to get to one can be prohibitive for that kind of custom service. My dealer is 3 hours drive, and of course I cannot expect him to come and do such a setup, although were I in the same town I would most certainly expect it. I agree that handing someone a box with a $5K streaming device and wishing them a good life is not enough.

This equipment should really be plug and play but from all the threads on here complaining that various apps/updates are causing issues, it really makes one wonder what really is going on in Salisbury.

A potential customer reading these forums is not going to be parting with (a lot of) cash to then register here to sort out issues.

As i have said before, I would love one of the new Uniti products but there is no way i am paying to be a guinea pig.

A Dummies guide would certainly not go amiss. As a member of the Beta group, I get the various app and firmware updates and they just work, other than the glitches we find as part of the process. I have a well sorted network, as do the other testers, so we rarely if ever come across the issues others face. But come across them people certainly do, and one tiny thing not being quite right can totally bugger things up and lead to hours of hair pulling. I remember sitting up most of one night trying to get my Unitiserve to backup to a nas, and it was only as a result of a few members on here going way beyond that the bloody thing didn't go through the window!

There simply has to be something that Naim can do. 

Do you expect Samsung to come and set up your smart TV?

This question isn't as facetious as it may first look. 

.sjb

I'm afraid having read these endless tales of woe that I will stick with my Sonos connect which feeds into a dac v1. Whilst there may be a compromise on sound it was cheap and works every time

Hungryhalibut posted:

In the old days, Naim dealers were factory trained to set up SBLs, DBLs and the like. Perhaps it's time for them to be trained in getting the Network products working as they should. 

I don't think that the physical set-up for a handful of speakers is a valid comparison to the complexities involved in a home network system. Far too many variables involved in the latter.

DrMark posted:

Unfortunately, with fewer and fewer hi-fi dealers in general, and Naim dealers in particular (at least in the USA), the distances to get to one can be prohibitive for that kind of custom service.

I agree and for that reason many dealers are inclined to sell the gear that is most universally successful at plug and play within their market, Naim may not be high on that list in the US.

sjw posted:

I'm afraid having read these endless tales of woe that I will stick with my Sonos connect which feeds into a dac v1. Whilst there may be a compromise on sound it was cheap and works every time

By all means do that, but remember that very large numbers of Naim customers don't come here looking for help because it just works for them or they resolve an issue easily, so you can't judge how something would work for you based on a few people who have intractable problems.

best

David

I was plagued by network problems a few years ago and found the solution was adding a couple of network switches, now the cable modem just works as a router / interface and wifi point to the internet with a single connection to a switch. the only devices using wifi are phone and tablet. Any network issues have reduced to a once or twice a year occurrence and are cleared up by a reboot of everything. The Naim app has worked well in it's many iterations and I have not experienced many major problems with it.

Today in the morning i will write a mail to Naim about my journey about my problems with the apps and networking. I also will ask them to read this tread so for in the future we can make set up for owners more easy. Thanks for all the suggestions. A little help can go a long way.

DUPREE posted:

CP62 posted:

Hallo,

 As you read my problems with the new app and not knowing if it is the app or the router. So it’s strange is that the app always worked but the last three updated versions the app stopped working. Nothing changed in my router or other settings. The app keeps losing connection and even with a fresh install it only works for a few minutes.

 

A suggestion can we make a list with routers who can work with Naim streaming products and that we know work. So creating a database of routers and settings that we know that work. Just an idea?

 

I will say that I had an ASUS router and having UPnP enabled on the router really caused havoc with the NAIM app. I would go into the admin console and disable anything that the router is trying to do in regards to UPnP and DLNA so as not to conflict.

I have a Hauwei HG533 router and on that you need to have both DLNA and UPnP enabled for reliable operation with a Naim system (and then it's rock solid).

This just illustrates the complexity of the problem and how the UIs implemented by the firmware programmers are really not helping the situation.

jasons posted:

This equipment should really be plug and play but from all the threads on here complaining that various apps/updates are causing issues, it really makes one wonder what really is going on in Salisbury.

A potential customer reading these forums is not going to be parting with (a lot of) cash to then register here to sort out issues.

As i have said before, I would love one of the new Uniti products but there is no way i am paying to be a guinea pig.

It's nothing to do with anything going on in Salisbury.

The problem lies squarely on the shoulders of the people writing the specification for the routers and those manufacturing them; both the people designing the hardware those writing the firmware.

CP62 posted:

Hallo,

 As you read my problems with the new app and not knowing if it is the app or the router. So it’s strange is that the app always worked but the last three updated versions the app stopped working. Nothing changed in my router or other settings. The app keeps losing connection and even with a fresh install it only works for a few minutes.

 

A suggestion can we make a list with routers who can work with Naim streaming products and that we know work. So creating a database of routers and settings that we know that work. Just an idea?

 

The database needs to contain not just the make and model of the router, but also any necessary configuration information.

It's a shame that some people struggle to get a painless streaming solution, but I concur with others that cheap ISP bundled routers are a big part of the problem. My approach to home networking is to use a decent router (Vigor 2860), switch (Cisco SG300) and access point (Ruckus 7363), and wire everything in a fixed location, leaving wifi for genuinely portable devices. It may be 'old school' and a bit more challenging to set up, but once working it's absolutely rock solid.

I disagree DaveBK,  my solution is a low cost ISP supplied single box hub & it & its predecessors have never failed to deliver faultless service since the ISP went to FTTC.   I admit to solving a reliability problem when I had all my old (unused) fax & telex extension removed, that was in ADSL days, & prior to that I frequently did curse the (not to blame) wireless hub.    I am not saying some problems may be ISP modem/router related,  but I am not convinced a solution such as you propose is the only way out of whatever difficulties they have.  

Mike-B posted:

I disagree DaveBK,  my solution is a low cost ISP supplied single box hub & it & its predecessors have never failed to deliver faultless service since the ISP went to FTTC.   I admit to solving my reliability problem when I had all my old (unused) fax & telex extension removed, that was in ADSL days, & prior to that I frequently did curse the (not to blame) wireless hub.    I am not saying some problems may be ISP modem/router related,  but I am not convinced a solution such as you propose is the only way out of whatever difficulties they have.  

Hi Mike, I'm not suggesting that my approach is the only solution, just what has worked for me. I spent 9 months living in a rental house last year with the latest BT HH, and had an absolute nightmare with my NDS... constant drop outs. Since returning home, nothing but musical bliss.

OK Dave, I hear ya,  obviously I don't/can't answer why it is so.  I will stick to my keep it simple stoopid way of doing things with audio (& TV)    simple single wifi box & simple ethernet to everything  ........ 

Netgear 105 or best is Cisco 2960

Cisco - all day long.

Mike-B posted:

I disagree DaveBK,  my solution is a low cost ISP supplied single box hub & it & its predecessors have never failed to deliver faultless service since the ISP went to FTTC.   I admit to solving a reliability problem when I had all my old (unused) fax & telex extension removed, that was in ADSL days, & prior to that I frequently did curse the (not to blame) wireless hub.    I am not saying some problems may be ISP modem/router related,  but I am not convinced a solution such as you propose is the only way out of whatever difficulties they have.  

Mike I am with you, some ISP routers (certainly in the UK) these days are some of the more advanced available  because they need to process the more advanced internet services that are now   such as UHD/4K video and multicast services.... I would be very wary of off the shelf third party routers unless they are using the latest chipsets from the likes of Broadcom suitable for the services you are using and ISP validated modems.... lot of mis info on home routers on this and other consumer forums and fanciful myths around many of the latest ISP devices

Simon