Naim Uniti Core, HiFiBerry Digi+ Pro, Allo DigiOne and SPDIF DACs

Ardbeg10y posted:

I like the nDac too, there are some pros and some cons - as usual for any product.

Pro:

...

Cons:

...

I will be tempted all the time to add a super expensive 555PS power supply.

In this case you should probably better look elsewhere. For me, I have decided that I do not want expensive and, above all, large PSUs. Neither for the nDAC nor for the SN2. A second hand nDAC is a very good value for me. But if I had to upgrade, I would first consider more modern designs rather than adding a PSU. I have been considering buying a second nDAC as a backup, however. Second hand, od course. Let us know what the search for a DAC yields in the end!

nbpf posted:

[@mention:55771800629066628]: have you mangaged to install upmpdcli under Raspbian stretch? I have tried to post the repositories that needs to be included by sources.list (the content of the files raspi.list and upmpdcli.list mentioned above) but my post was moderated. I guess that we are not allowed to post names of repositories in this forum, I'll have to double check. Anyway, the upmpdcli repositories for Raspbian stretch are listed on the upmpdcli web page in the downloads section and the installation worked flawlessly for me. Best, nbpf

It is currently running Jessie and I'm happy with it. MPD, upmpdcli and Raspotify work.

Stretch should work too, but I've not tried to move further. Maybe I buy another sd card to try. Looking backwards, I think that I've taken a wrong installation sequence. I first made Raspotify to work and then MPD + the failed attempt for upmpdcli.

Now, on Jessie, I installed MPD first, the upmpdcli and as last step the Raspotify.

I'm a bit busy for my work so cannot spend too much time on it. I've decided to quit my current assignment so at the end of the month I will have time. Will try to get my unix knowledge back up to speed by these RPi's. I've built webservices in the past so lets see if I can get that running nicely. Would be cool: a loadbalanced cluster of application servers on RPi's.

Another idea I have is to make a night movie of all the creatures in my quite large garden. I recently catched the warthog on photo and a RPI + night cam would be cool.

Ardbeg10y posted:

nbpf posted:

[@mention:55771800629066628]: have you mangaged to install upmpdcli under Raspbian stretch? I have tried to post the repositories that needs to be included by sources.list (the content of the files raspi.list and upmpdcli.list mentioned above) but my post was moderated. I guess that we are not allowed to post names of repositories in this forum, I'll have to double check. Anyway, the upmpdcli repositories for Raspbian stretch are listed on the upmpdcli web page in the downloads section and the installation worked flawlessly for me. Best, nbpf

It is currently running Jessie and I'm happy with it. MPD, upmpdcli and Raspotify work.

Stretch should work too, but I've not tried to move further. Maybe I buy another sd card to try. Looking backwards, I think that I've taken a wrong installation sequence. I first made Raspotify to work and then MPD + the failed attempt for upmpdcli.

Now, on Jessie, I installed MPD first, the upmpdcli and as last step the Raspotify.

I'm a bit busy for my work so cannot spend too much time on it. I've decided to quit my current assignment so at the end of the month I will have time. Will try to get my unix knowledge back up to speed by these RPi's. I've built webservices in the past so lets see if I can get that running nicely. Would be cool: a loadbalanced cluster of application servers on RPi's.

Another idea I have is to make a night movie of all the creatures in my quite large garden. I recently catched the warthog on photo and a RPI + night cam would be cool.

I think that gardening and installing / setting up software have much in common. Anyway, one of the nice features of the Raspberry Pi's system is that one can easily backup images of the SD card. I have a number of RPis and I regularly make copies of their SD cards on my backup drives. Best, nbpf

Ardbeg10y posted:

The DigiOne has arrived, an sd card was setup having a fresh Raspbian installation. VNC installed, all configurations done (thanks for mentioning dtoverlay=allo-digione, nbpf) MDP was installed. But ... I forgot to get a proper coax cable ...

Any recommendation for a coax to coax cable? Normally I get the AudioQuest cables, but if there is something significantly better, I'd be interested.

I am using a DC1 BNC/BNC. 

What is it about dtoverlay=allo-digione, nbpf)?

michael1702 posted:

Ardbeg10y posted:

The DigiOne has arrived, an sd card was setup having a fresh Raspbian installation. VNC installed, all configurations done (thanks for mentioning dtoverlay=allo-digione, nbpf) MDP was installed. But ... I forgot to get a proper coax cable ...

...

...

What is it about dtoverlay=allo-digione, nbpf)?

If one wants to use the Allo DigiOne with Raspbian, one has to add a line with "dtoverlay=allo-digione" to /boot/config.txt  for the system to detect and configure the Allo DigiOne card at boot time.

If you are using a so-called audiophile distribution, it is likely that support for the DigiOne is already enabled in your config.txt. Here are my current additions to the file:

# Disable internal (snd_bcm2835) audio
dtparam=audio=off

# Configure the Allo Digione audio card
dtoverlay=i2s-mmap
dtoverlay=allo-digione

# Disable bluetooth
dtoverlay=pi3-disable-bt

# Archimago CRAAP settings
# arm_freq=800
# sdram_freq=400
# core_freq=400
# gpu_freq=300
# over_voltage=-4
# over_voltage_sdram=-4
# gpu_mem=16

Best, nbpf

I've been running piCorePlayer on a DigiOne without any issues. Easy setup and I can control LMS from my PC, smartphone or a synced SB Touch's screen via remote control. Using the same 5V linear PSU that I was using with my Touch sound quality is better on all levels compared to the Touch and to an sMS-200 (with stock SMPS) which I previously owned. If I were to upgrade I might look towards an sMS-200 Ultra with sPS-500 PSU but that would cost 10x what I paid for the DigiOne.

Iconoclast posted:

I've been running piCorePlayer on a DigiOne without any issues. Easy setup and I can control LMS from my PC, smartphone or a synced SB Touch's screen via remote control. Using the same 5V linear PSU that I was using with my Touch sound quality is better on all levels compared to the Touch and to an sMS-200 (with stock SMPS) which I previously owned. If I were to upgrade I might look towards an sMS-200 Ultra with sPS-500 PSU but that would cost 10x what I paid for the DigiOne.

Interesting device the sMS-200 Ultra but no SPDIF output, I am afraid! At the moment there seems to be no alternative to Naim Uniti Core, HiFiBerry Digi+ Pro and Allo DigiOne where an electrical SPDIF output is needed. A Schiit Eitr or a Mutec MC-3+ Smart Clock USB are certainly valid propositions but add to a player/renderer an additional box. Best, nbpf 

For me S/PDIF was imperative as I no longer own a DAC with decent USB input. In all fairness the sMS-200 might not have been given a fair shake as, in addition to being used with its SMPS, it was feeding the diminutive Chord Mojo whereas the DigiOne is using a linear PSU and its S/PDIF output is being sent to less compromised full sized DAC. As good as the Mojo is it does have its shortcomings.

I have meanwhile compared the RPi + Allo DigiOne (with ifi PSU and music library on attached USB HDD) to my current source (fitPC3 + M2Tech HiFace Evo, both powered by TP PSUs, also with music library on attached USB HDD) into the Naim DAC.

Both the RPi + Allo DigiOne and the fitPC3 + M2Tech HiFace Evo were running MinimServer and the upmpdcli UPnP renderer with similar settings. Upmpdcli relies on MPD which also was running essentially under the same settings on RPi and fitPC3.

I have not done truly systematic comparisons: I have first listened to the RPi + Allo DigiOne for about two weeks and than compared two short pieces of music that I know rather well.

My impression is that the RPi + Allo DigiOne is almost as good as my current source but perhaps not quite there. The soundstage is perhaps a bit better but the violins sound slightly more aggressive. I have the impression that the faintest and more delicate sequences (the first seconds of Sibelius violin concert, for instance) are slightly better rendered by my current system. The differences are certainly not big and perhaps quite subjective.

From the point of view of functionality and simplicity, the RPi + Allo DigiOne are clearly hard to beat, the two systems are comparably flexible and reliable. I never had to restart the RPi during the two weeks of testing and the fitPC3 has been running for months since the last reboot.

nbpf posted:

...

From the point of view of functionality and simplicity, the RPi + Allo DigiOne are clearly hard to beat, the two systems are comparably flexible and reliable. I never had to restart the RPi during the two weeks of testing and the fitPC3 has been running for months since the last reboot.

Thanks for posting, nbpf.

I assume you have tested this on your Ovators. I have been impressed by the amount of details Ovators can show. Since I have Ovators, it has been so easy to distinct good and bad recordings. BMR's are fantastic.

Regarding the RPi - I share the observation that RPi's are rock solid. Never needed to reboot. Once the run, they run forever. This also gives me a bit the feeling that I should not touch them in order not to break anything. Maybe I should just get more sd cards and copy in order to start tweaking.

Ardbeg10y posted:

nbpf posted:

...

From the point of view of functionality and simplicity, the RPi + Allo DigiOne are clearly hard to beat, the two systems are comparably flexible and reliable. I never had to restart the RPi during the two weeks of testing and the fitPC3 has been running for months since the last reboot.

Thanks for posting, nbpf.

I assume you have tested this on your Ovators. I have been impressed by the amount of details Ovators can show. Since I have Ovators, it has been so easy to distinct good and bad recordings. BMR's are fantastic.

Regarding the RPi - I share the observation that RPi's are rock solid. Never needed to reboot. Once the run, they run forever. This also gives me a bit the feeling that I should not touch them in order not to break anything. Maybe I should just get more sd cards and copy in order to start tweaking.

Yes, I have listened to the two sources wit the Ovators. I agree the BMR are fantastic. I have demoed a number of speakers and to me the Ovators just sounded "right" from the very beginning. I like to listen to music while laying on the sofa, sitting at the table or in front of the fireplace and in all settings the Ovators sound right. 

I should have probably compared RPi + Allo DigiOne to my current source also on headphones. I have very revealng ones but I feel that the headphones output of the SN2 is not so great. Perhaps I'll do another round of comparisons on headphones.

I keep images of the SD cards of my Raspberry Pi devices on my laptop and backup disks. If something goes wrong, I can always copy the image to a SD card in minutes. To this end, it is useful not to have too big SD cards. I usually buy 16GB ones.

nbpf posted:

Ardbeg10y posted:

nbpf posted:

...

From the point of view of functionality and simplicity, the RPi + Allo DigiOne are clearly hard to beat, the two systems are comparably flexible and reliable. I never had to restart the RPi during the two weeks of testing and the fitPC3 has been running for months since the last reboot.

Thanks for posting, nbpf.

I assume you have tested this on your Ovators. I have been impressed by the amount of details Ovators can show. Since I have Ovators, it has been so easy to distinct good and bad recordings. BMR's are fantastic.

Regarding the RPi - I share the observation that RPi's are rock solid. Never needed to reboot. Once the run, they run forever. This also gives me a bit the feeling that I should not touch them in order not to break anything. Maybe I should just get more sd cards and copy in order to start tweaking.

Yes, I have listened to the two sources wit the Ovators. I agree the BMR are fantastic. I have demoed a number of speakers and to me the Ovators just sounded "right" from the very beginning. I like to listen to music while laying on the sofa, sitting at the table or in front of the fireplace and in all settings the Ovators sound right. 

I should have probably compared RPi + Allo DigiOne to my current source also on headphones. I have very revealng onesbut I feel that the headphones output of the SN2 is not so great. Perhaps I'll do another round of comparisons on headphones.

I keep images of the SD cards of my Raspberry Pi devices on my laptop and backup disks. If something goes wrong, I can always copy the image to a SD card in minutes. To this end, it is useful not to have too big SD cards. I usually buy 16GB ones.

While OK for TV/movies the headphone out on all Naits is mediocre at best for music. I would never use it to evaluate any upstream components.

Iconoclast posted:

nbpf posted:

Ardbeg10y posted:

nbpf posted:

...

From the point of view of functionality and simplicity, the RPi + Allo DigiOne are clearly hard to beat, the two systems are comparably flexible and reliable. I never had to restart the RPi during the two weeks of testing and the fitPC3 has been running for months since the last reboot.

Thanks for posting, nbpf.

I assume you have tested this on your Ovators. I have been impressed by the amount of details Ovators can show. Since I have Ovators, it has been so easy to distinct good and bad recordings. BMR's are fantastic.

Regarding the RPi - I share the observation that RPi's are rock solid. Never needed to reboot. Once the run, they run forever. This also gives me a bit the feeling that I should not touch them in order not to break anything. Maybe I should just get more sd cards and copy in order to start tweaking.

Yes, I have listened to the two sources wit the Ovators. I agree the BMR are fantastic. I have demoed a number of speakers and to me the Ovators just sounded "right" from the very beginning. I like to listen to music while laying on the sofa, sitting at the table or in front of the fireplace and in all settings the Ovators sound right. 

I should have probably compared RPi + Allo DigiOne to my current source also on headphones. I have very revealng onesbut I feel that the headphones output of the SN2 is not so great. Perhaps I'll do another round of comparisons on headphones.

I keep images of the SD cards of my Raspberry Pi devices on my laptop and backup disks. If something goes wrong, I can always copy the image to a SD card in minutes. To this end, it is useful not to have too big SD cards. I usually buy 16GB ones.

While OK for TV/movies the headphone out on all Naits is mediocre at best for music. I would never use it to evaluate any upstream components.

Good to know, thanks Iconoclast! Any suggestions for a good headphone amplifier for a Sennheiser HD800? Best, nbpf

Having a bit of a frustrating time at the moment trying to get Pi recognised by my mac for remote use I have downloaded Jessie Lite loaded it on to my sd and inserted into my Pi then I have found my Pi IP address and then opened Terminal on my mac and typed ssh Pi@ - IP address  Password: Raspberry and then I get a message that connection cannot be made and something about Port 22???

ssh is not enabled by default on most unix distributions. you need to put a file 'ssh' in the root of the filesystem.

so, take the sd card, put it in the pc or sd card reader and create a file 'ssh' (no extention nor contents) in the root, put the card back to the rpi and there you go.

Bob the Builder posted:

Having a bit of a frustrating time at the moment trying to get Pi recognised by my mac for remote use I have downloaded Jessie Lite loaded it on to my sd and inserted into my Pi then I have found my Pi IP address and then opened Terminal on my mac and typed ssh Pi@ - IP address  Password: Raspberry and then I get a message that connection cannot be made and something about Port 22???

- Have you put an empty file named "ssh" in the "/boot" folder of the SD card? Thiss is mandatory for being able to connect to the device via ssh.

- The username should be  "pi", not "Pi"

- The password should be "raspberry", not "Raspberry"

- What happens when you enter "ping 192.168.178.42" (replace "192.168.178.42" with the IP address of your device) in the mac terminal?

nbpf posted:

Iconoclast posted:

nbpf posted:

Ardbeg10y posted:

nbpf posted:

...

From the point of view of functionality and simplicity, the RPi + Allo DigiOne are clearly hard to beat, the two systems are comparably flexible and reliable. I never had to restart the RPi during the two weeks of testing and the fitPC3 has been running for months since the last reboot.

Thanks for posting, nbpf.

I assume you have tested this on your Ovators. I have been impressed by the amount of details Ovators can show. Since I have Ovators, it has been so easy to distinct good and bad recordings. BMR's are fantastic.

Regarding the RPi - I share the observation that RPi's are rock solid. Never needed to reboot. Once the run, they run forever. This also gives me a bit the feeling that I should not touch them in order not to break anything. Maybe I should just get more sd cards and copy in order to start tweaking.

Yes, I have listened to the two sources wit the Ovators. I agree the BMR are fantastic. I have demoed a number of speakers and to me the Ovators just sounded "right" from the very beginning. I like to listen to music while laying on the sofa, sitting at the table or in front of the fireplace and in all settings the Ovators sound right. 

I should have probably compared RPi + Allo DigiOne to my current source also on headphones. I have very revealng onesbut I feel that the headphones output of the SN2 is not so great. Perhaps I'll do another round of comparisons on headphones.

I keep images of the SD cards of my Raspberry Pi devices on my laptop and backup disks. If something goes wrong, I can always copy the image to a SD card in minutes. To this end, it is useful not to have too big SD cards. I usually buy 16GB ones.

While OK for TV/movies the headphone out on all Naits is mediocre at best for music. I would never use it to evaluate any upstream components.

Good to know, thanks Iconoclast! Any suggestions for a good headphone amplifier for a Sennheiser HD800? Best, nbpf

I'm not that up to date but if I were shopping for myself (with my budget) I would consider one of the Cavalli amps being offered on Massdrop or one of Schiit Audio's offerings. If I had a lot of disposable income to spend and was really into headphones I'd probably be looking at the Alo Audio Studio Six.

Edit: I listened briefly to a Violectric V281 at a friend's house and liked what I heard but would need more time before committing.

Or a Chord DAC? (They aLl have good headphone amps included)

Thanks IB, the next step is replacing the M2Tech HiFace Evo with something newer. Then I'll take care of the source for the headphones. The problem is that the M2Tech with the TP PSU is pretty good! But it is an old design and drivers will become a problem at a certain point. I thought I would give the Schiit Eitr a try but it seems to be out of stock since weeks. Also, it does not have a BNC connector which is a bit of a bugger. I should probably try a Mutec as they are just around the corner. Moving to a Chord DAC is certainly an interesting path but ... that would be the beginning of a completely new chapter! I was hoping to be able to replace the fitPC3 + M2Tech and their PSUs with just a Core but that is not going to work out. Best, nbpf 

nbpf posted:

I have meanwhile compared the RPi + Allo DigiOne (with ifi PSU and music library on attached USB HDD) to my current source (fitPC3 + M2Tech HiFace Evo, both powered by TP PSUs, also with music library on attached USB HDD) into the Naim DAC.

Both the RPi + Allo DigiOne and the fitPC3 + M2Tech HiFace Evo were running MinimServer and the upmpdcli UPnP renderer with similar settings. Upmpdcli relies on MPD which also was running essentially under the same settings on RPi and fitPC3.

I have not done truly systematic comparisons: I have first listened to the RPi + Allo DigiOne for about two weeks and than compared two short pieces of music that I know rather well.

My impression is that the RPi + Allo DigiOne is almost as good as my current source but perhaps not quite there. The soundstage is perhaps a bit better but the violins sound slightly more aggressive. I have the impression that the faintest and more delicate sequences (the first seconds of Sibelius violin concert, for instance) are slightly better rendered by my current system. The differences are certainly not big and perhaps quite subjective.

From the point of view of functionality and simplicity, the RPi + Allo DigiOne are clearly hard to beat, the two systems are comparably flexible and reliable. I never had to restart the RPi during the two weeks of testing and the fitPC3 has been running for months since the last reboot.

Edit: in the meantime I have made more extensive comparisons and now I find it more difficult to say which source sounds better. The DigiOne seems to add some "presence" to the instruments, perhaps better distinctness. With the M2Tech the presentation seems more fluid and perhaps less tiring. Anyway, kudos to Allo for having build a small, sensible device that delivers a good SPDIF stream!

The Mojo has arrived and is connected by an usb cable from the RPi - I have no coax / bnc to 3.5 mini coax jack cable. Need to order one. Enjoyable sound so far.

I've just ordered a digione player from Allo to use with my Mojo. Will update this thread once it's up & running. Anyone else using the Allo digione have any views of it's performance?

You need a good cable between the Digione Player and the Mojo. I ordered one at Flashback Sales. There are not so much BNC to mini coax cables on the normal market.

I've replaced the included SD card which has Volumio with a new card and installed the latests Raspbian on it. I Installed MPD and UPMPDCLI on it. Use Hi-Fi Cast to control the streaming from my Synology Nas.

On my Ovator s600 setup, I hear a difference between my other sources, but what I hear is the silkyness of the Mojo.

Thanks ARDBEG10Y, already have the flashback cable (think we may have discussed this in another thread?) Went with Volumio OS, looking forward to some tinkering with it once it arrives! Have you owned Naim streamers? would like to hear some comparisons against the Digione...

Singlespeed posted:

Thanks ARDBEG10Y, already have the flashback cable (think we may have discussed this in another thread?) Went with Volumio OS, looking forward to some tinkering with it once it arrives! Have you owned Naim streamers? would like to hear some comparisons against the Digione...

Indeed. My mind is messy when it comes to what was discussed with whom.

I have no Naim streamer currently. I do want to buy one, and I don't want to buy one. It's complicated.

Lets put it this way:

I bought a classy house 2.5 years ago to live in with my family until I die. When we moved in the house, the previous owners left their loudspeakercable since it was in-wall. So I put my Technics midfi all in one amp and speaker in the livingroom and alas, the room was too large to listen to decent music. So, I thought I need new loudspeakers (quite amateurish looking backwards) and I purchased BW CM1's because they fit exactly in the bookshelves. Then the CD Player of my Technics amp died. I decided that I need a good amp and a good cd player. I started to search which brands did still produce in Europe, I made an appointment with a Naim dealer and there was my dealer supplied Supernait and CD5i.

Finally music. I never thought that such music was possible in a normal house, I thought it was only possible in Churches, Concerthalls etc ...

Upgraditis bit me and I bought a Naim set for my TV. AV2 + Nait 5 driving BW CM5's. Performs again well.

Since I work mostly at home - software engineering or so - I needed a set for my office too. Bought Active Ovators and 2xNap 200.

I temporarily shifted my AV2 to the office, but clearly the AV2 is insufficient.

So I need a good Pre for the office to drive the Snaxo / Nap200s / Ovators.

I'm reluctant to buy a 202 / 282 because it's the pre only and they need powersupplies too. 252 / 552 is too expensive for me currently - well we could buy it but we have expensive years ahead. So I came to the conclusion that a Nac 272 is the answer to everything.

I'm likely to buy a Nac 272 next year and use it as a pre / dac fed by the DigiOne player. Normal spotify playback can be done using the Nac 272 directly.

This is all fine.

What I don't like to the Naim streamers, and streamers in general, is that the streamer sections age quickly. In a few years, it is likely that the current streamers can't be used anymore, or can't use the latest inventions of the market.

I'm fine on the good old classical Pre amp, I believe that Dacs are also quite safe (the trick which they apply currently is to increase the number of taps by better / faster IC's) and Dac are stronger reliant on the analogue stage than we think.

My problem is with the streamer section.

Therefore I've bought the DigiOne / Raspberry. I tend to believe that this last longer, or if it does not last longer, it is only $200.