NAP250.2 with Dynaudio Focus 160

yes

It depends on what the rest of the system is and whether you like the sound of the 250.2 over that of the 200. It's not as easy as 'yes'. 

HH, Dynaudio focus 160, well it will respond better to a NAP 250.2, than a NAP 200  

I've owned 3 pairs of Dynaudio speakers, NAP 200 and NAP 250 and heard 250.2 quite a few times.

It's not that Dynaudio 160 is very difficult to drive, it isn't actually, but the NAP 250.2 has a richer more full sound, than the "apparently' slightly dry nature of the old NAP 200, (along with the slightly dry nature of the Dynaudio sound)

I never found the old 200 dry though, but the 250.2 got a richer sound which  will pair well with the focus 160 (I got the focus 260)

However it has been reported that the 250.2 really needed a 282/HCDR or a 282/SC2 as a preamp to make the most of it's capabilities . I think the 202 was really voiced to go together with the NAP 200, and that preamp balanced out some of the weaknesses of the NAP 200. No preamp or poweramp is perfect - well not until you reach 500 series or Naim statement , so it's a matter of making the most of what they (202 and 200) both got, which Naim did very well to my ears.

I've heard 172/250.2 together it sounded very good to my ears, so 272/250.2 will sound even better....

Keep in mind the regulated amps performance starts going downhill after 8 to 10 years, and they do need a service at that time.

analogmusic posted:

HH, Dynaudio focus 160, well it will respond better to a NAP 250.2, than a NAP 200  

I've owned 3 pairs of Dynaudio speakers, NAP 200 and NAP 250 and heard 250.2 quite a few times.

It's not that Dynaudio 160 is very difficult to drive, it isn't actually, but the NAP 250.2 has a richer more full sound, than the "apparently' slightly dry nature of the old NAP 200, (along with the slightly dry nature of the Dynaudio sound)

I never found the old 200 dry though, but the 250.2 got a richer sound which  will pair well with the focus 160 (I got the focus 260)

However it has been reported that the 250.2 really needed a 282/HCDR or a 282/SC2 as a preamp to make the most of it's capabilities . I think the 202 was really voiced to go together with the NAP 200, and that preamp balanced out some of the weaknesses of the NAP 200. No preamp or poweramp is perfect - well not until you reach 500 series or Naim statement , so it's a matter of making the most of what they (202 and 200) both got, which Naim did very well to my ears.

I've heard 172/250.2 together it sounded very good to my ears, so 272/250.2 will sound even better....

Keep in mind the regulated amps performance starts going downhill after 8 to 10 years, and they do need a service at that time.

Thanks, I have a 282 with a PSU, driven from a Mojo.  The 282 replaced a 202, and was a big step (to my ears).  Yes, the PSU gets polarised opinions, but not for debate here.  The 250.2 that I might be able to get is under 3 years old and must be close to the cut over to the DR.  At that age, should have some years left before a service.

I liked the 250.2 with my 282 and psu. Into Neat Momentums it was my preference to the 200.

More drive and life to the music.

If a good match to the 160s then you have tmade a God chive. I mean, good choice! 

I can't comment on the 160 but I tried a pre dr 250 with the Contour 1.8s but went back to the 200 - I found it stodgy. The dr version though was a revelation.

Regards,

Lindsay 

If you factor in the cost to buy a 250.2 as opposed to the DR version then the former becomes an attractive chice. 

The non DR version is still a Stirling performer of which one cannot get an equal near the price.

Just enjoy the amp for all its merits . The future always allows time for upgrading if you must, allowing funds to accumulate along with greater availability of DR versions as time goes on.

Have you got the option of a home trial?

The transfo of the 250 have a lot more torque (400 VA donut instead of 300 VA donut), wattage is not the end of story. The key here for all Dynaudio is you need good power reserve, and this power can be hold and stay stable at very lower impedance when the amp take a drop. Dynaudio love lot of torque (reserve)  and the most important, stability.

My 160 with my 250DR is one of the best pairing I founded to date. My SN2 had not enough grip/control over my 160. The Devialet120 was a lot better, but, my NAP 250DR was/is the best fit of the bunch. I can't talk about the 200, but, I can draw a parallel of SN2 vs 250DR here. The 250DR was a revelation for the 160. Lesson to retain is, if you really like Dynaudio and they're keepers for you, go with more power reserve if you can, to get a better control on bass, and at lower volume too...it will reveal the real nature of the capability of 160, so, yes, I really suggest to look this avenue. Nothing is better than a road test in your home, in your room.

I agree MAGAGNE,I also had focus 160's with SN2 at one time,I ended up selling the 160's to fund another purchase,even though I loved what they did.Next,I tried my C1's with the SN2,and the SN2 really struggled with them,much more than with the 160's.Long story short,I now have a 250dr with special 40's,and it drives them with ease,they are actually a 6ohm load,compared to the 4ohm 160's.I would think the SN2 and 200 are similar in stature,but the 250 is in another league,I have even borrowed my dealers C1 platinum's to try with my 250dr,no problems at all there either,and I believe the C1's are Dyn's toughest load to drive.I would make the jump from 200 to 250 for sure.

Thanks, some interesting replies.  I cannot have a home demo, and so this will have to be a speculative purchase.  If I buy the 250.2 then it does give me the option of having the DR upgrade at a later stage, and so it is not a big gamble if I do not like aspects of the presentation.  Of course, if I was to find that it was not as good as the 200 then it would feel like a backwards step, but with Naim then at least the residuals will cushion the blow. 

250.2 is considerably better than nap 200 in a Dynaudio context

You won’t regret it. 

No quarter posted:

I would think the SN2 and 200 are similar in stature,but the 250 is in another league,

 

All you have to do is peek inside the two amps to see that the assumption above is totally incorrect, in fact the SN2 and the 250-2 DR seem to share the same transformer and are rated exactly the same at 80 watts per channel, and both transformers are rated at 400VA. Both amps are completely stable into 2ohm loads. The SN2 has much more current than the 200, and it sounds it!

When I did a home demo of the amps mentioned with my Dynaudio speakers, which are somewhat of a tough load, also being a 4ohm load, the SN2 completely took control of the speakers, the 200 sounded much less powerful. The SN2 sounding very much the equal to the 250-2 DR as far as power is concerned, while the presentation was different, the difference in power was not audible when the SN2 and HiCap DR were used together.  

While the 250-2 is a regulated amp, that has more to do with presenting the amp with a stable power supply that will send the correct voltage to the amp, no matter what the input voltage may be, thus reducing spikes. It has nothing to do with being more powerful.

When both amps are tested into different load resistance. Both SN2 and 250-2DR show very similar power into 2, 4, 8ohm loads, with neither showing any advantage over the other. If you have a hard time believing what I'm saying, try contacting Naim, and ask them for the levels that the amps put into different loads.

the 250.2 has a 1020 va rated transformer 

Well I owned the SN2 with a high-cap DR for a couple of years,and now own a 250 DR for the 

last year,and it is very clear to me which one is the better amp.Both were tested with the same speakers Dynaudio C1's YMMV.

analogmusic posted:

 

the 250.2 has a 1020 va rated transformer 

From the Naim website!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

•  80W per channel output into 8 ohms
•  Large custom-designed transformer providing 400VA of transient power

Exactly the same as the SN2!!!!

No quarter posted:

Well I owned the SN2 with a high-cap DR for a couple of years,and now own a 250 DR for the 

last year,and it is very clear to me which one is the better amp.Both were tested with the same speakers Dynaudio C1's YMMV.

Not saying the 250-2 isn't technically the better amp, what I am saying is that when each amp is tested into different ohm resistance, neither amp puts out any more power than the other!!!!

transient power is not the same as Transformer rating.

anyway - you tested it and you are happy with SN2, that's all that matters.

FWIW, the 250 and 300 share the same transformer, but everyone who heard both knows they don't sound the same

The regulated 250, is considerably better than any of the unregulated amps like NAP 200 and SN2 from Naim to my ears.

A little more to this Naim upgrade path than numbers.... 

analogmusic,

don't know where you are getting your rated specs from, but even the 500 has an 1100VA rated transformer, so unless you have some kind of one off 250-2 with a 500 rated transformer, I would check the specs on the Naim website before posting specs as facts!

Have to say though there is a LOT of engineering packed into 250 DR, no wonder the 300DR sounds better as it got more space inside.

badlands posted:

analogmusic,

don't know where you are getting your rated specs from, but even the 500 has an 1100VA rated transformer, so unless you have some kind of one off 250-2 with a 500 rated transformer, I would check the specs on the Naim website before posting specs as facts!

yes apparently the 250.2 and 500 got the same size of transformer. After a certain Point, Naim don't think it's worth increasing transformer size.

The 500 is a bridged amp, and has much more regulation than a 250.

It is a bridged amp as it avoids the return speaker currents from contaminating signal earth.

https://www.naimaudio.com/connection-magazine/21950/naim’s-dr-power-amplifiers-taking-you-inside-music

By tackling one of the fundamentals of amplifier design –­ the provision of the cleanest possible power to each part of the signal chain within an amp – Naim’s latest Discrete Regulator amplifiers bring you even closer to the music.

The ideal for a power amplifier looks simple: the relatively low-level signal from the preamp goes in one end, and out the other comes the same signal, increased to enable it to drive a loudspeaker. That’s it: nothing added and nothing taken away ­– just a direct amplification of the signal.

Of course, it’s not that simple, and while the old idea of ‘a straight wire with gain’ sums up what a power amp should be doing, a whole load of other factors are brought to bear in any design: the need for each section of the amp to do its job as optimally as possible, the different (and varying) load speakers present to the amplifier, and the need to keep the whole plot stable and reliable under a wide range of conditions, both physical and musical.

Fundamental to the way any amplifier works is the way its powered, and it really isn’t as simple as ‘…want more power? Fit a bigger transformer!’ Each part of an amplifier has its own power requirements, from the input stage all the way through to the output transistors, which correspondingly means each section needs its own power supply.

Again, that sounds simple enough, and most hi-fi products have several secondary windings on their power transformers, providing different voltages to the various parts of the amplifier, or serving the different sections of, say, a CD or network player to avoid noise passing between those sections. Some manufacturers even use multiple transformers; having one for each channel in a stereo power amplifier for example, or for the digital and analogue sections of a player. This isn’t a path Naim follows – we prefer to use just one large primary transformer to supply the whole product.

Naim Electronic Design Director Steve Sells explains the thinking behind this: ‘A single large transformer has a lower impedance and so charges PSU reservoir capacitors faster than two smaller transformers. This in turn allows the mains conduction angle to be shorter, essentially allowing the PSU to be disconnected from the mains for a longer time.’

However, providing just the right power in all the relevant places throughout an amplifier can mean the use of many different regulated power supplies, any of which has the potential to introduce noise into the signal path. With the different power requirements of the various sections, each needs a power supply with its own regulation to guarantee exactly the right power is available, keep any noise in one section away from the others, and ensure the amplifier can handle the demands placed on it by the requirements of the signal passing through it.

You seem to be pretty hung up on the numbers, I'm just stating facts.

The pictures you posted are deceiving, the transformers are the same size, they are just located differently in the amp, and the pictures of the amps are different sizes also.

Whatever transformer rating you are quoting, the 250-2 and the SN2 are rated exactly the same!!!

Whether an amp is regulated or non regulated, or which one is better sounding, is a moot point as far as power ratings are concerned.