Optical cable running in ?

How would a piece of plastic or glass "burn in"?

For that matter, how would a piece of wire "burn in" (other than possibly if recently cryogenically treated and crystal structure still stabilising)?

Of course, that doesn't stop people mentally adjusting as they get used to the sound, nor does it stop peple's hearing being affected by physiological or environmental factors, the former in particular not uncommonly varying over time (try listening, then yawning, especially if you have a bit of a cold or othe cause of sinus congestion). 

My layman's opinion would be no burn-in for optical cables. The optical cable transmits light rather than carrying electrical impulses and are likely at their optimum when new. The poignant question for me would be at what point do optical cables demonstrate age, crystal structures degrade, insulators crack, and when should I replace them?

Thanks for the stereotypical dogmatic regurgitation bystander. Most informative I must say. I was hoping for some answers from members who could actually think for themselves.

Thanks Joerand for an intelliigent and measured response.

I can’t see how fibre can ‘burn in ‘, however it can settle in. Fibre is very susceptible to vibration, and once put in situ, may take a little time to fully mechically relax, over which time its response to sound vibration might change. What will vibration do? It will modulate in terms of time the signal being carried. This will be minuscule, but because of our accentuated hearing when listening to our audio equipment, we may notice a subtle sonic change due to low frequency intermodulation of the SPDIF transport clock with the receiving electronics.

I heard a demo of the physics of this occurring... a fibre carrying a digital carrier was passed through a room where people were speaking and the receiver demodulated the carrier, and the voices were completely audible and recoverable.... the fibre acted as a microphone.

Audio affair offer a QED burn in service for optical cables, no clue how they do it, or if it actually makes any difference. I have never heard any difference after a new optical cable has been added to my system.

Sister Ray posted:

Any opinions as to whether optical cables require any running in?

Logic would say no. But as we all know logic does not always prevail in our little niche in the world.

I believe they do, I don't know why but I can hear a change in sound after a couple of weeks, 24/7 use. That goes for USB cables as well. 

People keep saying that ears adjust, I don't buy in to that, my ears certainly didn't adjust to my previous set up that I had for 5 years. If anything, it got worse with time.

I believe that burn in exists, however you can always get a taste of the overall sound signature when new.

Sister Ray posted:

Thanks for the stereotypical dogmatic regurgitation bystander. Most informative I must say. I was hoping for some answers from members who could actually think for themselves.

Well, you asked, and I responded with what I honestly think, which is not a view I have repeated from hearing someone else say, so is only a repetition (regurgitation?) insofar as when similar questions have been asked before. If you don't like to hear different people's views, don't ask, rather than insult those who do take the time to answer.

I think they take light years to burn in....

Gazza posted:

Audio affair offer a QED burn in service for optical cables, no clue how they do it, or if it actually makes any difference. I have never heard any difference after a new optical cable has been added to my system.

  I can understand the logic behind the theory with copper wire,  but optical ?? maybe not,  whatever it's a free world.     But companies who extract money from their so called "customers" for providing this "service" are the modern equivalent of the old time snake oil peddlers.  

M37 posted:

Sister Ray posted:

Any opinions as to whether optical cables require any running in?

Logic would say no. But as we all know logic does not always prevail in our little niche in the world.

I believe they do, I don't know why but I can hear a change in sound after a couple of weeks, 24/7 use. That goes for USB cables as well. 

People keep saying that ears adjust, I don't buy in to that, my ears certainly didn't adjust to my previous set up that I had for 5 years. If anything, it got worse with time.

I believe that burn in exists, however you can always get a taste of the overall sound signature when new.

Does this really prove that 'burn-in' exists for optical or other digital cables? Surely, since you say that the sound probably worsened with time in your previous system, it could also be the case that your ears simply adjusted to the sound, but the sound was not really to your taste?  

Simon has indicated that there may be a scientific reason for the phenomenon of 'burn-in', and I certainly can't argue against this possibility from a scientific perspective. However, I tend to agree with IB's assertion that differences are down to our ears and our perception changing over time.

Sister Ray, you state that logic would dictate that 'running in' should not be necessary, but then proceed to criticize IB for expanding upon that logic. Your sarcastic comment about his "stereotypical dogmatic regurgitation" and your assertion "that he could not think for himself" following his very reasonable and logical response to your original question was neither tolerant nor logical.   

Hmack posted:

M37 posted:

Sister Ray posted:

Any opinions as to whether optical cables require any running in?

Logic would say no. But as we all know logic does not always prevail in our little niche in the world.

I believe they do, I don't know why but I can hear a change in sound after a couple of weeks, 24/7 use. That goes for USB cables as well. 

People keep saying that ears adjust, I don't buy in to that, my ears certainly didn't adjust to my previous set up that I had for 5 years. If anything, it got worse with time.

I believe that burn in exists, however you can always get a taste of the overall sound signature when new.

Does this really prove that 'burn-in' exists for optical or other digital cables? 

All I said is that I believe it exist. I never claimed to have any proof.

Sorry M37,

I should probably have used the word 'suggest' rather than 'prove'. 

Hmack posted:

Sorry M37,

I should probably have used the word 'suggest' rather than 'prove'. 

It's alright HMACK

Trying different cables set ups and "burn in" theories has becomes rather confusing and tiering for me. Because I always hear subtle but very much real changes in the sound. The more I elaborate the harder it gets to reach "my preferred sound."

I've also tried some 20 different USB cables and the all sound different. Some generic ones even sound much better than the expensive ones.

Same with interconnects and now mains cable. To much variables for me, I just want to enjoy the music, not obsessing over cables.

For some years I used a Wireworld Supernova 6 between a Mac mini and nDAC.  I did not hear any change in performance that I could attribute to the cable, but that may reflect more on my lack of golden ears, than absence of burn in.

Roger

Adam Zielinski posted:

I think they take light years to burn in....

If it took 4.25 light years you could wait far enough to get to Proxima Centauri!

Sister Ray, you state that logic would dictate that 'running in' should not be necessary, but then proceed to criticize IB for expanding upon that logic. Your sarcastic comment about his "stereotypical dogmatic regurgitation" and your assertion "that he could not think for himself" following his very reasonable and logical response to your original question was neither tolerant nor logical

My response was elicited by receiving a generic response from a member of the cable deniers brigade, when my question was very specific, and didn't require the usual lecture about differences between all cables being psychological. We have all heArd this argument a million times before, and I consider the poster was putting out trollbait in an attempt to turn this into yet another cable wars thread

Well, your consideration was wrong: nothing was further from my mind. And I did not suggest it was purely psychological, but also pointing out that human hearing is not always constant, physiological factors also affecting our hearing from time to time.

However, ignoring my view, what is your considered opinion regarding optical cables? Have you heard a difference? 

I have neither.owned nor compared any. My question was entirely hypothetical.

A while ago I treated myself to a Tempur Mattress and pillow set. Surprised to read in the instructions that the feel of them may take some time to bed in.  A bit too firm at first but did seem to soften up a touch after a few weeks.  Still not sure if that's true or just me being more accustomed to them !

650nm I read (red) somewhere and if there’s attenuation (more in the plastic variant it seems) something is getting excited which will turn into heat most likely so there might be some settling. Significant? probably not but if you hear a difference new to old you might not just be fooling yourself.

Anyone compared different Toslinks?

I've been using a glass Lifatec cable with excellent results, nicely constructed at a very reasonable price.  I prefer it over a Stereovox XV2 coax into nDAC. Would it be reasonable to suggest glass works better than plastic in toslink audio applications?

yeti42 posted:

650nm I read (red) somewhere and if there’s attenuation (more in the plastic variant it seems) something is getting excited which will turn into heat most likely so there might be some settling. Significant? probably not but if you hear a difference new to old you might not just be fooling yourself.

Yikes! I run my whole LAN on 650nm plastic....now I'm going to have to dig it all up and reinstall it on comfy foam mattresses 

ChrisSU posted:

yeti42 posted:

650nm I read (red) somewhere and if there’s attenuation (more in the plastic variant it seems) something is getting excited which will turn into heat most likely so there might be some settling. Significant? probably not but if you hear a difference new to old you might not just be fooling yourself.

Yikes! I run my whole LAN on 650nm plastic....now I'm going to have to dig it all up and reinstall it on comfy foam mattresses 

Taking bedding in a bit literally there Chris. 

That’s the wavelength and it’s red, not very exciting.