Expensive Cables. Are they worth the Money?

Never tried any expensive cables (yet) but I did swop chord odessy for naca5 a number of years ago preferring naim cable presentation. Weather it is 'better' or not, I'm not sure. I just preferred it.

Rendering oil from a snake doesn't seem that difficult - I wonder if it has been tried and does it have and medicinal benefit aural acuity? 

stuart posted:

...

Rendering oil from a snake doesn't seem that difficult - I wonder if it has been tried and does it have and medicinal benefit aural acuity? 

Indeed, but for auditory use you first need to winterise it and centrifuge it to ensure that you only have the lighter fractions.  Then you use it in the same way as olive oil...   However, dependant on the specie you need to be absolutely sure that the oil isn't contaminated with venom.

Huge posted:

stuart posted:

...

Rendering oil from a snake doesn't seem that difficult - I wonder if it has been tried and does it have and medicinal benefit aural acuity? 

Indeed, but for auditory use you first need to winterise it and centrifuge it to ensure that you only have the lighter fractions.  Then you use it in the same way as olive oil...   However, dependant on the specie you need to be absolutely sure that the oil isn't contaminated with venom.

A dollop of the aforementioned pure snake oil in both ears apparently works wonders......it’s rarely talked about but all high end cables come with a couple of tubes....

True but many animal venoms are protein based and if ingested orally are digested in the gut and rendered harmless. I'm not sure I would try it unless under the supervision of an expert!!!

Getting off track a bit...... Sorry 

As Wenger and I have pointed out, like olive oil, snake oil is used in the ears; so there's a small risk of the protein based venom being transported into the blood stream, and no high concentration of acid to denature the protein or protease to break it down!

Perhaps the purpose of the expensive cables is to function as an applicator to introduce the snake oil into the ears?

(How's that for a twisted [pun intended ] way to connect back to the subject of the thread?)

Spot on Huge, I could not have explained it better myself...,,..this is one of the reasons these High end cables are so expensive......snake oil extraction is a very costly process 

Small amounts of venom, if hallucinogenic, might explain the "Mandelbrot effect" some forum members describe getting from their systems.

Ah I see, to clear the Auditory Canals rather than Auditory hallucinogenic effects of said oil. I was clearly on the wrong track. 

Richard Dane posted:

Ardbeg10y posted:

jfritzen posted:

The Mogami cable from DSM to SNAXO is just fine and the Active Leads to the 200s are alternativlos. 

 

Active Leads are fantastic. They increased the control by my Amps over the drivers dramatically. Anyone tested the relatively cheap Active Leads between a Pre-amp and Power-amp in a non-active setup?

Yup, it's essentially the same as the DIN-XLR lead, just with DINs at both ends.

I had to tell my Naim dealer which cable he should order. Dealer contacted Naim HQ and then it was sorted. Not all dealers know Active inside out apparently. Thanks to the forum ...

Nick from Suffolk posted:

And whether sharing the event with a naked partner adds or detracts from the SQ?

Depends on what your listening to.  The hifi or the naked partner ?

Eoink posted:

Small amounts of venom, if hallucinogenic, might explain the "Mandelbrot effect" some forum members describe getting from their systems.

Getting to the "Mandelbrot effect" in this way will only get you so far before you hit the wall, then you either get a full on whitey or die !

Filipe posted:

yeti42 posted:

And talking of vinyl who is using SL on their analog side? I have lavender supercap to 552 and of course the standard leads for the power amp. I don't want to disturb the superb timing I have now but an increaase in scale would be welcome, which is what I heard when I had an SL CDX2 to 282 but unfortunately it didn't time as well as even a Hiline. Speaker cables will remain A5.

Yes, I have SL RCA to DIN on the Rega Aria phonostage and DIN to DIN on the nDAC. I started with the nDAC and then the speaker cable and finished with the DIN to XLR. They provided a noticeable improvement at each step, but the real timing benefit came when the spacing between power supplies and brain boxes was doubled. I tried HiLine on the CDX2 but SL was much better. Love my 282 now the timing is perfect. The much improved timing makes it possible to turn the volume down a bit for the reasons [@mention:71399038679995297] explained. The separation of instruments improves a lot etc.

Phil

I agree with you Phil 100 %.

Putting my 282 and Hicap DR on a new QS rack with plenty of space took everything to a new level in terms of timing - and enjoyment ! 282 is a truly awesome preamp, when set up properly.

The fine cable nuances can be detected only while sitting in the sweet spot. The value of expensive wires has to be determined also in the context of the amount of time spent in front of the speakers. I occupy the strategic spot only 20% of the playing time so I do not have any serious urgency to replace the standard stuff.

Personally, I would rather 'invest' the money in a high-end Stax headphones and an Hawaii Blue head amp which will produce a much greater sound improvement than any cable or even black boxes upgrade. I can't imagine any other way to get closer to the music in such a giant step.

I don't think that any cable upgrade is worthwhile unless the owner can consistently identify the 'better' wire at least 60% (10% better than flipping a coin odds) of the times in numerous blind testing.

Haim Ronen posted:

I don't think that any cable upgrade is worthwhile unless the owner can consistently identify the 'better' wire at least 60% (10% better than flipping a coin odds) of the times in numerous blind testing.

I would suggest you can hear a considerable improvement 100% of the time. 

After reading through the numerous posts it seems we have a 50/50 split between the YES and NO oppinions? 

Am I right in assuming the biggest negative is simply  the cost of the Cables?

wenger2015 posted:

After reading through the numerous posts it seems we have a 50/50 split between the YES and NO oppinions? 

Am I right in assuming the biggest negative is simply  the cost of the Cables?

Without being able to have a home demo before purchase I would say yes to your question. 

Context is everything so the answer is "it depends".

It's up to the cable sellers to prove sufficiant benefit within your own system to justify the cost against the incumbent cables and whatever else you could do with the money, this will at least require a home demo or the offer of a refund if not delighted after a reasonable period. This will of course effect the price of the cables as these both have a cost but getting it wrong costs more.

wenger2015 posted:

Am I right in assuming the biggest negative is simply  the cost of the Cables?

Beyond the obvious cost consideration I would not let into the house any monstrosity that looks like a boa constrictor that swallowed a shoe box (the network case) for esthetic reasons. I couldn't care less how good it sounded.

Wenger, I find it hard to believe that if I gave you two interconnects (Highline and Lumina?) to familiar yourself with for a whole month and then I showed up for blinding testing that you would be able to identify 100% of the times which wire is in the system.

H

Well now, there's a challenge Haim!

Have to say from my experience, I believe that I would easily be able to tell you on interconnect between cd player and pre-amp whether lavender/ hi-line/ sarum t on all good quality recordings.  There may be less clear distinctions where the source material is not great quality - I'm only conceding this because I (perhaps erroneously) tend to make comparisons using familiar favourite decent quality cds or lps.  I am not endowed with the best hearing but I am sure that most people would be able to distinguish the differences on my system.

Peter

I'm pretty sure that playing unfamiliar recordings, even played multiple times, I'd usually have a hard time guessing which cable is in my system.  Swap between two cables however and the difference is usually very clear.

In other words, the relative differences are fairly easily detected but the differences are not sufficient to distinguish in absolute terms.  This is because the differences in technical quality between different recordings are much greater than the differences between cables.

Haim Ronen posted:

wenger2015 posted:

Am I right in assuming the biggest negative is simply  the cost of the Cables?

Beyond the obvious cost consideration I would not let into the house any monstrosity that looks like a boa constrictor that swallowed a shoe box (the network case) for esthetic reasons. I couldn't care less how good it sounded.

Wenger, I find it hard to believe that if I gave you two interconnects (Highline and Lumina?) to familiar yourself with for a whole month and then I showed up for blinding testing that you would be able to identify 100% of the times which wire is in the system.

H

I bet he could. 

Finkfan posted:

Haim Ronen posted:

wenger2015 posted:

Am I right in assuming the biggest negative is simply  the cost of the Cables?

Beyond the obvious cost consideration I would not let into the house any monstrosity that looks like a boa constrictor that swallowed a shoe box (the network case) for esthetic reasons. I couldn't care less how good it sounded.

Wenger, I find it hard to believe that if I gave you two interconnects (Highline and Lumina?) to familiar yourself with for a whole month and then I showed up for blinding testing that you would be able to identify 100% of the times which wire is in the system.

H

I bet he could. 

To bad there's possibility for a demo! 

It would be fun. 

I would have thought the majority of us know are systems inside out, and would be able to recognise any cable changes especially if the cables are  of high end quality 

Finkfan posted:

Haim Ronen posted:

wenger2015 posted:

Am I right in assuming the biggest negative is simply  the cost of the Cables?

Beyond the obvious cost consideration I would not let into the house any monstrosity that looks like a boa constrictor that swallowed a shoe box (the network case) for esthetic reasons. I couldn't care less how good it sounded.

Wenger, I find it hard to believe that if I gave you two interconnects (Highline and Lumina?) to familiar yourself with for a whole month and then I showed up for blinding testing that you would be able to identify 100% of the times which wire is in the system.

H

I bet he could. 

I bet he could, too. And I know damn well that I could.