DIY Interconnects 272 to 300DR

Mogami to Klotz? Hmmmm... How is it working out?

I'll be interested to know how you get on with the Klotz Huge. Keep us posted!

I now have a conclusion on the Klotz MC5000 cable...

In my system (272, 300DR, Spendor SP2s + a sub) working between the 272 and the 300DR, then in comparison to the Mogami W2549:

Bad:  There's less detail in the signal, the midrange seems rather recessed and there's less differentiation of instrumental timbres.
Good:  There seems to be more weight in the bass (integration to the sub is subjectively better) and the sound has very slightly more dynamic contrast.

Overall I prefer the Mogami W2549, but I can truly understand how other people might prefer the Klotz MC5000.

I'm just about to make up the cables with the Mogami W2497.

Interesting, keep us posted 

Yes, thanks Huge, I'll continue with the trusty W2549 for the time being.

I'm having a bet with myself that someone will suggest give it time to burn in ............  

Yes, I've been waiting for that! 

Oh, go on then!

I bet it sounds rubbish when it’s burned in 

Spurred on by Huge's cable experiments I realised I had not burned my cables in,  now I have & it really sounds rubbish. 

Carbon's an even worse conductor than rhodium!

Huge posted:

Carbon's an even worse conductor than rhodium!

Yeah but don't tell Furutech  

As discussed previously, the conductivity of plating on large area / low contact pressure connectors is of little relevance.  On the other hand, silver isn't always the best choice either (for instance it's a awful choice for RCA phono connectors).  The properties of contact plating need to be matched to the contact type.  My preference is as follows:-

High pressure, low contact area, wiping contacts (e.g. DIN connectors) - Silver
Medium pressure semi-wiping contacts (e.g. XLP* connectors) - Silver or Gold
Low pressure, large contact area, non-wiping contacts (e.g. RCA Phono & 4mm connectors) - Gold or Rhodium

Silver should only be used in wiping connectors where the sulphide can easily be removed by an insertion cycle.
Gold should not be used in high pressure contacts as it becomes too soft when plated thickly enough to stand up to the wear.
Rhodium and chromium should not be used in low contact area connection due to their resistivity.

Just my opinion.

* The Neutrik MX / FX series connectors (and I believe all other Cannon X series connectors manufactured today) are actually XLP connectors not XLR.  XLR connectors have rubber insulation; XL series connectors insulated with plastic are actually XLP!

Hi Huge, looking forward to your results with W2497 as well. Since you are discussing details of contact pin platings, what about solders, do you prefer the stuff with a few percent silver or does standard lead work just as well?

(Got my W2549 today still waiting for din plugs...)

Just finished and installed the unbalanced Mogami W2947 cables;  OMG that cable's a bugger to work with.

But the results actually are worth it in my system, it's a worthwhile improvement on the W2549, it's certainly not 'night and day' but definitely worth  the extra £7 per metre and the hassle of trying to stick a still cable into a DIN plug.

It's staying in the system and indeed Mike I'm not going to 'burn it in'!

Compared to the W2549, the biggest differences are:-

It has better bass integration, similar to that of of the Klotz (but maybe still not quite as good as that).
I occasionally hear quiet instruments in the mix that were previously missed.
Vocal readability is a bit better.
Instrumental differentiation is a bit better.
Tonally it seems a little more solid and perhaps a slight touch warmer - I put this down to the better bass integration.

Joppe posted:

Hi Huge, looking forward to your results with W2497 as well. Since you are discussing details of contact pin platings, what about solders, do you prefer the stuff with a few percent silver or does standard lead work just as well?

(Got my W2549 today still waiting for din plugs...)

Funny I was just typing when your post came in! 

I use a eutectic Tin / Silver / Copper alloy.  I don't believe there's any point is using more than about 4% silver (the eutectic is about 3.8%) as then all that'll happen is that the silver will just crystallise out first, creating more and larger crystals with differing composition and hence more trouble with crystal boundaries.

I wish you well with the W2549, it certainly worked well in my system, and I hope it works for you.

Just as a side note - I use Mogami 3368 as my 'go to' bass guitar cables, if and when not using a wireless trasmitter. Talk about stiff and thick ))

The rest of the system is wired with Mogami 2524 (pedalboard connections, rack connectors, etc).

All very good stuff and I found the tonally neutral.

OK, Adam, you win on difficult cables! 

But then you're only connecting it to 1/4" TS Jacks.  W2947 is just as thick and almost as stiff (same diameter and similar thick internal foamed PE insulation, but no conductive polymer layers and a lapped screen rather than a braided screen) - try soldering that into a DIN plug with just 3mm space between adjacent pins and only a 5mm working length from the end of the cable insulation to the pins!

Last night I noticed an additional advantage to 2947:  It performs even better than 2549 at very low volumes - there seems to be less loss of detail and energy.

I'm not entirely sure why this should be, I'm pretty sure it's not due to better electrical performance with low level signals (2549 is a very high quality microphone cable after all).  I believe it may be due to the different psycho-acoustic characteristics of the 'sound' of the cable allowing the brain to still 'lock on' to details and timing in the signal even at significantly lower volumes.  In any case, it's a very worthwhile advantage when living in a terraced house (even one built in the 17thC with party walls that are double skinned limestone & rubble and which are 500mm thick!)

How was it installing the two coax's into the DIN?

    I didn't have to.

I use a 272 and a 300:  The 272 has two 4 pin DIN output sockets. 

OK,  silly me, didn't check beforehand. 

I was considering making a DIN-DIN with it, the HiLine is a double coax so why not.    However my application is NDX-SN (source-pre),  I've found this lower level signal section to be more resonsive to SQ variations than over pre-pwr.    But on the otherhand my NDX-SN is only 28cm in length & I wonder if its worth the trouble for whatever SQ change any cable will make over that length.

Mike it was hard enough soldering a single stiff 8mm∅ cable into a DIN4 240°.
Soldering 2 x stiff 8mm∅ cables into a DIN5 180°, with even less working space would be, to say the least, well, 'interesting'!
If you manage that I'll be mighty impressed - so there's a challenge for you. 

We seem to be in different places Huge, my Mogami 2947 spec sheet shows it as a coax twin flex with each of the individual coax’s at 3mm dia = 6mm.     But I’m away from home at mo so can’t check. 

D'oh - my bad...

Dyslexia lures KO?

Try 2497 NOT 2947!   Unbalanced HiFi cable, Neglex, dual concentric construction, 8mm∅.

Ah-ha   OK maybe I won’t attempt 8mm doubled up!!!      I’m still semi interested in a very low C, high spec copper/silver,  PTFE type insulation in a miniature twin coax pair.