Another 552 owner

Congrats on your new pre Simon!

Once you'll swap your 250 for a 300, you'll have one of the best pre/amp combo ever!

However even with a 250.2, the 552 can be stunning!

Enjoy!

Edouard

Darke Bear posted:

A new 552, especially a DR version, takes a few months to properly come on-song. It is indeed the Bass that most obviously improves.......

Unless experienced the above will seem silly and crazy, but it is what happens.

{Why can't it be delivered like that with all this done }

- well if Naim could warehouse them for a year as they get completed playing music, then perhaps, but we are not that patient!.......

It is a nice ride with quality Pre-amps from Naim. The 552 is always exciting and capable and just gets better and better with time. If you are concerned about the price, then content yourself it is possible to do the same all over again with the next one up in the hierarchy - it is the same effect all over again with run-in, but think of all that money you have saved with the 'modestly-priced' 552 - now I shall duck.

DB.

It can, it's called Pre-loved!$$$$$$$$$!

Just Joking, I've been exercising the ignore button!

But couldn't resist!

Merry Christmas To All!

The Naim Family!

Nothing but the Best!

Allante93!

Preloved is exactly the way I’ve gone 

however im led to believe the burn in process is much more painful with a 500

i don’t see an easy way round that for me given the scale of the task 

lyndon

Edouard posted:

Congrats on your new pre Simon!

Once you'll swap your 250 for a 300, you'll have one of the best pre/amp combo ever!

However even with a 250.2, the 552 can be stunning!

Enjoy!

Edouard

Yes I have to support this. I know Simon has just made an important step towards audio heaven, but with a 300 he will ask himself why he has not done that before, as they form indeed a great duo...

Well I had my first wow moment this morning with the 552, I think I get it... absolutely phenomenal... the feel, detail and insight with no trebleness or etching... I had no idea the Hugo sounded this transparent and this is with 44.1/16/2 incredible, what a combo..... my Mandelbrot set analogy has developed several fold more iterations.. you hear so much more... including the defects like tape master flutter, bad notes,  clicks and ticks ... but it’s all about letting the recording sound so much more authentic.. coupled with an infectious feel of beat, pace and timing.

Anyone still reading this and values my ramblings... if putting together a system, get the best preamp/NAC you can... it really is the heart of the system and as such probably the most important component quality wise....

Hi Simon, interested to know if you ever auditioned Chord Dave at home with you 252, and what did you think.

I hear what you're saying about the preamp - the 552 is one of the best in the world, so enjoy it !

Hi Ali, I listened to Dave a few times on different systems over the months at my dealers, but not at home...

Simon-in-Suffolk posted:

Anyone still reading this and values my ramblings... if putting together a system, get the best preamp/NAC you can... it really is the heart of the system and as such probably the most important component quality wise....

It also goes to show what a phenomenal power amp the 250.2 is, let alone the 250DR, if it can up its game so much with the 552 in charge. And yes, it also implies, as I have always believed, it is the pre amp that is the heart and soul of any Naim system.

erm... as it's Christmas I don't wish to spoil the fun. So apologies for what I am about to post.

I remember when I had my DAC V1 and replaced my 202 with a 282, yes the soundstage expanded in all directions, the resolution increased, and so did frequency extremes, but it was still very much the DAC V1 I was listening to musically.

I guess maybe it depends what is being measured and what criteria is important ?

Our esteemed Moderator Richard Dane always, without any exception, no matter how many times I would ask him this question told me "source first"

I disagree there, Analoguemusic! It’s the recording, because a well mastered 196kHz 24bit has many delicacies the 44.1kHz 16bit lacks - both top of their game.

Sometimes I wonder whether that bypasses the preamp contributions (word used figuratively), but my intuition tells me the bass depth comes through the preamp?  Does it? Or is that the power amp?

Ali, happy Christmas, sources are important, but they give a view or colour of the recording by rendering the audio from whatever format it is, vinyl, tape, FM, PCM sample data etc .. which is why many of us have multiple sources, buecause each is a compromise not one size neccearrily fits all, or is optimum for all... which of course is why there are different format masterings.

 the NAC optimises what is there in the rendering from your varying and different sources to be poweramplified bu doing its best to retain as much as possible of the rendering, a really critical part of the replay chain process.

Simon-in-Suffolk posted:

Anyone still reading this and values my ramblings... if putting together a system, get the best preamp/NAC you can... it really is the heart of the system and as such probably the most important component quality wise....

This is very true - although overlooked by too literal 'source-first' approaches IMO. I've always noticed over many decades of this hobby-interest-passion that those that invested in the best Pre always had better-sounding musical performance that more money spent on source, power-amps or speakers. I think it has to be discovered personally in use and experience.

'Source-first' has an undeniable logic and a lot of truth to it, but the best approach is 'system balance' once you have a capable source. This does turn out to be a very good source IMO, but once you get any source that is very capable then you do not gain anything from continuing to improve the source if you don't re-balance the rest of the system to use its capabilities.

The Pre is very important. I've also tried to remove it, by-pass it's function but always to very poor results, even after a while deluding myself it was better or just as good - it wasn't and any mental-gymnastics could not resolve the fact that wherever a good Pre was in a system - with a good source - then music was there and better than with any other way of spending the same system money.

And now I find that the musical performance as mastered is my limiting factor. Note I did not say format or 'high-def', as I do not necessarily find these formats offer better rendering of the music that the same material mastered with some surviving integrity onto the CD format or even Vinyl. Later renderings onto high-bit-rate/bit-depth  formats have been surprisingly poor so far to my way of hearing the end-result - when I hear otherwise I will get the source to replay them, as it is the end-result I'm looking for, not the promise, unfulfilled do-date, that something is better.

But the Pre is a critical item in a good HiFi system. It seems getting a low-noise, linear amplification and volume control with good input and output line-buffers takes significant engineering to get right.

DB.

Simon-in-Suffolk posted:

Anyone still reading this and values my ramblings... if putting together a system, get the best preamp/NAC you can... it really is the heart of the system and as such probably the most important component quality wise....

Hi Simon.

I am glad you are having fun, and I appreciate you taking the time to share your impressions, as always.

Has your 552 given Spotify via the NDX any sort of lift?  In the past, you may recall, I have said it occasionally seems to beat a lossless rip of the same track, to my disbeliving ears.  I have wondered if the 552 was responsible for making the most of it, like MSG!  

Merry Christmas.

Nick

Firstly, well done to Simon in Suffolk (I see bitcoin has dropped dramatically since your purchase which must be a relief). Glad it is going well. I have always felt the 552 was my single biggest upgrade in sound quality and like Darke Bear, I think this is not in keeping with the original upgrade protocol, however with improvements in electrical components over the past 20 years, the source first strategy seems to be outdated (I remember in the 80s being told your vinyl collection should be worth more than you system, impossible now with a high end system).

 I also agree and totally feel hi-res playback etc has not bettered cd sound quality. I think there is a clever marketing ploy going on of rehashing excellent existing recordings. Most of my best sounding playback comes from the cd part of an sacd hybrid. Iam glad someone has said it. It is like the emperors new clothes.

a £70,000 system compared to modern vinyl prices? It’s not that difficult to match if you consider new replacement cost rather than what you paid in the distant past or at a charity shop.

You can have the best source and the best pre in the world but if you have crap speakers you will have crap sounding system. 

True, but luckily there are great sounding speakers that cost very little. 

sorry to hijack the thread, but which ones in a naim context (still available to buy)

Well Analog, it’s best for a separate thread, but just one example of great speakers starts for a tenner with something like a secondhand pair of Maxim 2s - however, the best stands might cost you much more!  They are hugely musically entertaining and any sins are purely of omission. Anyway, apologies to Simon and congrats on the new 552.

oh yes congrats to Simon

I was just thinking if I came into some unexpected money I would too, buy a 552 right away

The floating suspension boards and the split rail power supply is something no other preamp has other than Statement !

Dunno whether he was first but Peter Walker of The Acoustical Manufacturing Company (Quad) is attributed with describing the perfect amplifier as a piece of straight wire with gain.

Seen the inside of a 552 folks?

'Go figure', as our American friends say.

John.

analogmusic posted:

oh yes congrats to Simon

I was just thinking if I came into some unexpected money I would too, buy a 552 right away

The floating suspension boards and the split rail power supply is something no other preamp has other than Statement !

 

Sitting on the side line soaking this up!

Wow floating suspension boards, electrical isolation at its best!

Perhaps this accounts for the musical gap between the sister pre-amps:

282/252

Allante93!

J.N. posted:

Seen the inside of a 552 folks?

 

That's one thing that always impresses me when i see a picture of the internals of a Naim product is the neatness and thought that goes into the internal wiring. You look at the inside shots of some 'hi-end' (bloody expensive) kit and it looks like a real dogs dinner with internal wiring all over the place - it does make me wonder about the consistency of performance and what you are actually paying for. 

I'd never argue that the NAC 552 seen above doesn't possess a tidy internal visual outlay and it only ever sounded impressive on the rare occasions I've head it. OTOH - when I'm demoing gear at my own lesser level the thought of removing the case, or for that matter even googling pics of the inside has never occurred to me.  My system boxes could well have a relative bird's nest of internals under the hood, but that doesn't enter my evaluation process. SQ output in my room the ultimate currency.