network streaming tweaks

Obsydian posted:

Thanks I already have a Cisco 2960, was new and sealed.

Just realised the TP link Converters have 2 pin plugs, what a pain.

i am french, i followed the explanation on :   pont optique audiophile on google then you have all details on home cinema . fr and what exactly to buy.  My tp link are mc110cs model.  

Sorry for your pain.  You have all the links for amazon to know what to buy:  tap just:  pont optique hifi home cinéma.fr on google then you find the post 04 november 2015. Then translate in english.

Obsydian posted:

Thanks I already have a Cisco 2960, was new and sealed.

Just realised the TP link Converters have 2 pin plugs, what a pain.

you will normally have a big improvement: more fluidity, bigger soundstage and all more natural, with more colors of instruments.

Do  not bother with expensive  CAT5 cabling, it will make no difference to the sound. If there was a difference you can bet companies like Naim would be producing them, we would have "super lumia" and "Hi-Line" variants of such cables? 

Not so sure....Naim took an age to get the cables you mention.....I would be surprised if in the next 5 years, they come up with new cables for streaming.

Obsydian posted:

Thanks I already have a Cisco 2960, was new and sealed.

Just realised the TP link Converters have 2 pin plugs, what a pain.

i found a link in english, using tp link mc200 converters:  electrically isolate your networked audio/ audiostream.  Michael Lavorgna explains all you need.

djh1697 posted:

Do  not bother with expensive  CAT5 cabling, it will make no difference to the sound. If there was a difference you can bet companies like Naim would be producing them, we would have "super lumia" and "Hi-Line" variants of such cables? 

sorry, but there are differences.....as important as with analog interconnects.  Try one day...

French Rooster posted:

Obsydian posted:

Thanks I already have a Cisco 2960, was new and sealed.

Just realised the TP link Converters have 2 pin plugs, what a pain.

i am french, i followed the explanation on :   pont optique audiophile on google then you have all details on home cinema . fr and what exactly to buy.  My tp link are mc110cs model.  

Sorry for your pain.  You have all the links for amazon to know what to buy:  tap just:  pont optique hifi home cinéma.fr on google then you find the post 04 november 2015. Then translate in english.

I went for the TP Link MC 200CM, will find some plus adapters and realised I need one more ethernet, luckily I have another chord c stream.

I followed the audio tream guide thanks.

Let's will maybe try if everything arrives tomorrow just worried where to hide all them boxes and plugs.

Obsydian posted:

French Rooster posted:

Obsydian posted:

Thanks I already have a Cisco 2960, was new and sealed.

Just realised the TP link Converters have 2 pin plugs, what a pain.

i am french, i followed the explanation on :   pont optique audiophile on google then you have all details on home cinema . fr and what exactly to buy.  My tp link are mc110cs model.  

Sorry for your pain.  You have all the links for amazon to know what to buy:  tap just:  pont optique hifi home cinéma.fr on google then you find the post 04 november 2015. Then translate in english.

I went for the TP Link MC 200CM, will find some plus adapters and realised I need one more ethernet, luckily I have another chord c stream.

I followed the audio tream guide thanks.

Let's will maybe try if everything arrives tomorrow just worried where to hide all them boxes and plugs.

behind the rack, in a shoes box....    i hope it will work for you.  We will see tomorrow....

Simon-in-Suffolk posted:

a network streaming tweak is a tweak irrespective of whether its for NDS or UQ2!!

True, but if you're looking for improved sound quality, you could easily blow, say,  £1000 on network 'tweaks' only to find that they produced subtle changes/subjective improvements. With an NDS, this might be justified, but with a Unitiqute, you're into major hardware upgrade territory. 

Yes, but a thousand pounds won’t get you from a UQ to an NDS (along with needed pre and power amp). Plus one doesn’t have to spend anywhere near that. Caveat though: I’ve tweaked my network to the point that I realize I need a bigger amp now to truly show off how clean the source is via the microRendu and V1. My little 110 still sounds sweet but with such a lower noise floor I’m able to keep turning it up and up with less fatigue but it loses some steam and grunt for sure. So a better network could show you where you’re lacking upstream. Ignorance is bliss as they say. 

Where does the £1000 come from?

Switch and entry level ethernet cables = £150

Network bridge and isolation £130.

He means that even if you spend £1000 on tweaks, it won't make a UQ2 (which costs about that much) sound like an NDS.

best

David

ChrisSU posted:

Simon-in-Suffolk posted:

a network streaming tweak is a tweak irrespective of whether its for NDS or UQ2!!

True, but if you're looking for improved sound quality, you could easily blow, say,  £1000 on network 'tweaks' only to find that they produced subtle changes/subjective improvements. With an NDS, this might be justified, but with a Unitiqute, you're into major hardware upgrade territory. 

well i think most of these tweaks as per my post cost very little - that is the whole point tweaks don't need to be expensive and there is a lot of bling for not insignificant sums that to my mind are aimed at the gullble. Things like fibre adapters are a completely ridiculous - there is no technical merit at all unless you have a segment greater than 100 metres - and in fact I suspect they are going to cause more harm than good in terms of digital noise, unless you are using professional grade equipment - but of course some might prefer this noise - it just seems an elaborate way to achieve this.

If one is concerned about attached ethernet radiation - and I have quoted the TI paper on this to this forum many times, then one should use commercial grade Cat 5e either shielded or non shielded or wifi with quality wifi access points  - the issues of ethernet radiation are going to massively be reduced with wifi or quality Cat 5e, Cat6 preferably shielded cable. The ethernet carrier frequencies are far closer to what is going to make audio differences than wifi. Until Naim use fibre adapters directly on their equipment ( and I have discussed this with them) then its either WLAN or wired ethernet.... and with the attached segments keep it absolutely simple - ie don't use unnecessary wifi adhoc bridges, power line adapters or fibre adapters - unless for the latter you definitely need to have a segment longer than 100metres... which is going to be pretty rare for most of us....

The other ridiculous item is the unhealthy obsession with linear powersupplies - these can cause their own issues - especially if the core gets saturated with DC in the mains etc - and are essentially inefficient compared to a quality switch mode power supply. If one needs a large low impedance source then yes use transformers, which Naim of course does - otherwise use quality switched mode powersupplies for network devices, NAS etc. You tend to find with some network devices anyway that they have internal DC to DC converters which function a bit like switch mode power supplies anyway.

Finally - arguably - some of these tweaks are going to be more apparent on mid performance type equipment - as the higher performance equipment such as streamers like the NDS employ higher levels of system decoupling with reduced cross talk... albeit with the NDS differences between FLAC and WAV are still quite apparent so there are  still system coupling issues even here...

+1 Gullible; )

Simon I would say you are right about most things, but don’t knock the fiber media converters until you’ve actually tried them. I know I would certainly love to lose mine and their accompanying power supplies but whenever I remove them the noise (mostly as a harsher treble) is back and instrument separation not as good. It can sound a bit zingier, but more fatiguing. So please explain more how this is wrong? 

Plus, these things are dirt cheap in the scheme of things (for Naim, microRendu, and most only 10/100 is needed). And if you order from that big river site you can always return if they make things sound worse. 

a linear ps for nas, unitserve or uniticore is not an obsession. It just works .  The uniticore has , vs the past unitserve with stock smps, a linear ps. The uniticore sounds better than stock unitserve.  I put a linear ps on the serve and it sounds better now.  A lot of members on this forum have linear ps on nas, serve, mac mini and even switch.....they found an improvement.

Mr Rooster all parts setup, but at the switch end no signal, tried all off , reboots and setting one media unit to force (one to switch).

My setup is router (lan cable) to media unit 1 (fibre) to media unit 2 (lan cable) to switch and to Nova (lan cable).

Obsydian posted:

Mr Rooster all parts setup, but at the switch end no signal, tried all off , reboots and setting one media unit to force (one to switch).

My setup is router (lan cable) to media unit 1 (fibre) to media unit 2 (lan cable) to switch and to Nova (lan cable).

are the tp link powered?  are they lighting on?  

Silly question but my Router is not Gigabits, yet the media units and switch are. Was never an issue using router to switch.

Obsydian posted:

Mr Rooster all parts setup, but at the switch end no signal, tried all off , reboots and setting one media unit to force (one to switch).

My setup is router (lan cable) to media unit 1 (fibre) to media unit 2 (lan cable) to switch and to Nova (lan cable).

the nova must be connected to the second tp link. 

cisco 2960 then lan cable to first tp link then fibers optic to the second tp link then lan cable to the nova.   The nas is connected to the cisco.   the tp links must be powered and lighting.

Obsydian posted:

Silly question but my Router is not Gigabits, yet the media units and switch are. Was never an issue using router to switch.

only the cisco is connected to the router.  

So it should be router to switch, the switch (lan cable) to media unit 1, then to media unit 2 (fibre), then to Nova (lan cable) ?

Ok will try but followed the audio stream instructions.

• Connect Ethernet cable to Router and Media Converter 1
• Connect Fiber Patch Cable from Media Converter 1 to Media Converter 2
• Connect Ethernet cable from Media Converter 2 to the Ethernet Switch

Obsydian posted:

So it should be router to switch, the switch (lan cable) to media unit 1, then to media unit 2 (fibre), then to Nova (lan cable) ?

Ok will try but followed the audio stream instructions.

• Connect Ethernet cable to Router and Media Converter 1
• Connect Fiber Patch Cable from Media Converter 1 to Media Converter 2
• Connect Ethernet cable from Media Converter 2 to the Ethernet Switch

yes, as you said first.  The instructions don’t mention a dedicated switch like your cisco.  I have also a router and cisco 2960 switch.  The network bridge is between the cisco and the nova.

Ok so router to switch (lan cable) switch lan = green working.

Switch (lan cable) to media unit 1 = switch no light

Media unit 1 (fibre) to media unit 2 = neither TX or RX only power and link lights on.

Media unit 2 (lan cable) to Nova = Nova not responding (Naim app)

Restarted router, switch and media units also, same issue.

Obsydian posted:

Ok so router to switch (lan cable) switch lan = green working.

Switch (lan cable) to media unit 1 = switch no light

Media unit 1 (fibre) to media unit 2 = neither TX or RX only power and link lights on.

Media unit 2 (lan cable) to Nova = Nova not responding (Naim app)

Restarted router, switch and media units also, same issue.

Are you trying to connect a Gigabit FMC to the Nova? This might be a problem, as Naim streamers are 100MB, not GB, and as I understand it, fibre devices cannot autonegotiate between speeds the same way that copper Ethernet can. In other words, you may need a 100MB FMC.

First things first, though. Try restarting everything - if you haven't already!