Turntable Dilemma

Another vote for Rega RP10 with Aphelion. So far been using it with Rega Aria. One important factor - RCA>DIN is a significant improvement over RCA-RCA interconnects.

Hi Adam

Yes, I heard an RP10/Apheta 2 for the first time at a demo in Auckland yesterday ... very impressive.

The dealer doesn't stock Linn, so I was wondering how your RP10 compares to your LP12?

Since the RP10 is so good, I'm now wandering about checking out the RP8/Apheta 2 and would be interested n any views from owners of the deck.

I currently have the Rega Plannar 3/Elys2 (2017) with the Rega Fono MM phono stage - but it is no match for my Naim ND5Xs/Chord Hugo into my active ATC system (ATC SCA2 preamp and ATC SCM 40A speakers).

Having not really played vinyl for many years until recently, I was wanting to rediscover many artists that I don’t have on digital and the nostalgia etc

I have about 300 LP’s and don’t really see myself buying more records ... I’m more likely to stick with ripping CD’s and networking the digital streaming etc.

But .... for the ‘rare’ (due to busy family life and kids!) occasions that I can listen to records, I want the sound quality to be at the same level as my digital source - otherwise I will be less than satisfied with the sound quality....... hence the reason for wanting to change the turntable.

As good as the Rega Plannar 3/Elys 2 is (latest version bought September 2017), it simply doesn’t inspire me to keep playing records because my Naim/Chord Hugo sounds much better.

Perhaps the RP8/Apheta 2 may be the answer 

Just to be pedantic - I acutally use RP10 with the Aphelion cartridge - it was a worthwile improvement over the factory-fitted Apheta 2 (my Apheta 2 suffered a left-channel failure in the first month and my dealer replaced it wth an Aphelion cartridge). This brought the RP10 to a much higher level - gone was the slightly mechanical sound of the Apheta2 and engaging, organic magic  of an Aphelion started to come through.

How does RP10 compare to my LP12? 

Both are fantastic decks - LP12 is fluid, warm and just brilliant . RP10 is fast, engaging and has that something special to it. 

Thanks Adam, so I guess it's difficult to choose between the two.

What spec is the LP12 (PSU, Arm, Cartridge etc) .... just to give me an idea of where it sits comparatively to your awesome RP10/Aphelion?

It’s: Trampolin, Kore, Akito with Klyde, Urika and Radikal. So ready for upgrading to Keel and Ekos SE at some stage

Thanks Adam, that really helps me get an idea of the level at which the RP10 can certainly shine. Many thanks

Mr Frog posted:

Thanks Adam, so I guess it's difficult to choose between the two.

What spec is the LP12 (PSU, Arm, Cartridge etc) .... just to give me an idea of where it sits comparatively to your awesome RP10/Aphelion?

 

 

full lp12 is near 20k....you will be always tempted by upgrades.  

Absolutely ... it is interesting that Adam enjoys the sound equally, from both his turntables and that the RP10 can hold its own against the much more expensive LP12 set up.

I just need to weigh up as to whether the RP8/Apheta2 will give me the sound that I am seeking (on par with ND5XS/Chord Hugo) 

Any takers?

Spending that much (£20k) you can get SME/Nottingham Audio/Clearaudio/Kronos etc....

Personally, I couldn't justify such an expensive outlay on an analogue source - with my mere 300 LP's.

Though I fully respect people who do - good for them. They probably have far more LPs to enjoy, than I.

Hence the reason why I want something comparable to my current digital source and enjoy both vinyl and streaming, equally.

I would rather save the funds and continue to upgrade the digital source 

Mr Frog posted:

Absolutely ... it is interesting that Adam enjoys the sound equally, from both his turntables and that the RP10 can hold its own against the much more expensive LP12 set up.

I just need to weigh up as to whether the RP8/Apheta2 will give me the sound that I am seeking (on par with ND5XS/Chord Hugo) 

Any takers?

with a good phono stage it may be even better.  Rega fono is perhaps not enough....

Mr Frog posted:

Personally, I couldn't justify such an expensive outlay on an analogue source - with my mere 300 LP's.

Though I fully respect people who do - good for them. They probably have far more LPs to enjoy, than I.

Hence the reason why I want something comparable to my current digital source and enjoy both vinyl and streaming, equally.

I would rather save the funds and continue to upgrade the digital source 

 

A mere 300 LP's will take a very long time to listen to. It's not quantity that matters, it's the quality.
I've not counted my LP's but suspect I don't actually have many more than you but, I LOVE listening to them on my system.

Mr Frog posted:

Absolutely ... it is interesting that Adam enjoys the sound equally, from both his turntables and that the RP10 can hold its own against the much more expensive LP12 set up.

I just need to weigh up as to whether the RP8/Apheta2 will give me the sound that I am seeking (on par with ND5XS/Chord Hugo) 

Any takers?

With a good phono-stage I’d hazard a guess it will.

I too only have a few hundred LPs amassed over many years...but when I listened to vinyl... which is often..on my LP12 / tigerpaw / aro deck ..I find myself reaching for the same thirty or forty favourite one's time after time along with new offerings from the likes of rag and bone man / ed sheeran etc  ...just me I suppose..

Mr Frog posted:

<snip>

I just need to weigh up as to whether the RP8/Apheta2 will give me the sound that I am seeking (on par with ND5XS/Chord Hugo) 

Any takers?

That depends on how you judge them (i.e. how you weigh up your aural preferences).

That cartridge is holding you back as is the phono pre-amp.   I would describe both as "fine."  Is "fine" worth your time?  I'll just answer for you--no, it isn't.  I think 300 records is more than enough to throw some cash at this.  There really is no other way to do it other than to try it in your system and see if it appeals to you.  I can't speak to the RP10/Apheta 2 that is getting so much love here, but I had the RP6/Exact 2 for a while and it was also just "fine."  It collected a lot of dust.  The combo sounded blurry and sloppy to me.  I subsequently upgraded to non-Rega tables and cartridges and they embarrassed that Rega combo as they should I suppose given the cost.  I recently had the chance to pick up a new Rega P6/Ania and it's an entirely different thing from the RP6/Exact2.  This cartridge is quite quite good.  I now have the sound that I thought I'd have with the RP6/Exact 2.  It's a very nice combo, especially if you don't want to stretch much beyond $2K USD.  HOWEVER, you also absolutely need a quality phono pre-amp.  By all accounts the Rega Aria is quality.  I personally endorse Sutherland.  You need something at that level, else I'd say don't bother with this exercise.

agree with you, i always found that the phono preamp is , as individual part of the turntable chain reproduction, the most important.  

French Rooster posted:

agree with you, i always found that the phono preamp is , as individual part of the turntable chain reproduction, the most important.  

The phono preamp as most important, really? The cart tonearm combi is most important and belt or DD gives you the character you like or not.  

Robiwan posted:

French Rooster posted:

agree with you, i always found that the phono preamp is , as individual part of the turntable chain reproduction, the most important.  

The phono preamp as most important, really? The cart tonearm combi is most important and belt or DD gives you the character you like or not.  

from my experience, i don’t say it is the truth, i always found the phono stage to play a fundamental part in sound quality, a little bit more than a better cartridge or arm.

A great phono stage with a little cartridge will sound, for me, in most cases, better than a great cart with a budget phono pre.   All is also relative.

Okay, thanks for all the replies and I've been listening to various decks - albeit at different dealers, which is the problem here in NZ.

Despite my previous reservations about the 'upgrading treadmill', I did rather like what the LP12 Majik did for its relatively 'mid price' outlay.

It certainly sounded better than my Rega Planar 3/Elys2 and also better than the RP6/Ania .... which is the whole purpose for changing my turntable - to try and match the sound from my Naim ND5xs/Chord Hugo digital source.

So, at this stage I have pretty much narrowed the choice down to either;

1. Linn LP12 Majik ….. using my existing Rega Fono MM Phono Stage for the Adikt cartridge
2. Rega RP8/Apheta 2 ….. changing to a Rega Fono MC for the Apheta 2 moving coil

Once again, there are difficulties in this part of the world doing a direct comparison.

with a rega phono you will never compete with a nd5x/ chord hugo, i am quite 100% sure. If you have not the budget for a minimum rega riaa phono/ apheta/ rp8, i would better put an apheta with rega riaa on your existing rega p3 combo.  

But just my feeling, try first at your dealer place. You heard the linn majik, what was the cartridge and phono?  the electronics were equivalent to yours?

I'd be surprised if those didn't already surpass your digital solution. Of course, if you were to go the LP12 route, you could upgrade over time as funds allow to something that would keep abreast of any digital developments. 

Mr Frog posted:

Okay, thanks for all the replies and I've been listening to various decks - albeit at different dealers, which is the problem here in NZ.

Despite my previous reservations about the 'upgrading treadmill', I did rather like what the LP12 Majik did for its relatively 'mid price' outlay.

It certainly sounded better than my Rega Planar 3/Elys2 and also better than the RP6/Ania .... which is the whole purpose for changing my turntable - to try and match the sound from my Naim ND5xs/Chord Hugo digital source.

So, at this stage I have pretty much narrowed the choice down to either;

1. Linn LP12 Majik ….. using my existing Rega Fono MM Phono Stage for the Adikt cartridge
2. Rega RP8/Apheta 2 ….. changing to a Rega Fono MC for the Apheta 2 moving coil

Once again, there are difficulties in this part of the world doing a direct comparison.

Did you listen to the RP8/Ania with the Aria phonostage stage? The Fono MC is a good match to the RP6/Ania but may not be up to the Apheta. Spend the money saved to put toward the Aria phonostage stage at 3 times the price.

Phil

If you liked what LP12 did, I would recommend going for that solution. But with a better phono-stage - perhaps one of Linn’s own? It’s always a neat and easy solution to use the same turntable and a phonostage (at least to begin with ).

The obvious advantage of an LP12 is that it can be upgraded step-by-step, as appetite and disposable funds grow

Yes it was the Aria, more expensive mm/mc phono amp.

i could perhaps stretch my budget if that would be a huge improvement.

I guess it would work well for either the Apheta 2 mc if I choose a Rega and equally fine with the Linn Majik with its Adikt mm