Why no love for Sopra 1?

Thanks Phil. The S1 need some stands (means roughly 7000 for speaker + 1600 for stands) = 8600 vs 10.000?  And some even add a sub to the S1....

Ralf

ok...checked- the S2 cost roughly 12-13:-)

Sopra 2 USD 14,999 and Sopra 1 USD7,999 without stand. 

I've heard both plenty and the So1 has plenty of authority (after break-in) in a medium-sized room. 

No Quarter, it may also be worth waiting for the new Kudos Titan 505 standmounts as they are expected to be in the 5-6K GBP price range - and Ed Selley (a UK audio journalist) rated them as the sound of the show when visiting the Bristol Sound & Vision show last weekend. Search for the AV Forums podcast and he mentions them - about 20minutes in.

Irrespective of how they sound, at least Focal have been courageous in their Sopra styling, (which naturally divides opinion) and not defaulted to wooden boxes. I think they look refreshing.

YETIZONE

i saw the write up about the Kudos 505s,I am over in Canada,so not even sure if I can get those over here.I really was not looking to change from the S40s,and the only reason I am even demoing the Sopras,is the price offered to me by my long time trusted LOCAL dealer.He said if I prefer the Sopras over my S40s,he would take the 40s back on trade towards the Sopras,so I am not exactly looking around for other options,if anything,I will also look at the Dyn C20s,but that would depend on the price he quotes.

Phil Harris posted:

T38.45 posted:

Think the S1 is too expensive, my dealer told me that most of his customers jump to S2....

Hi,

If you can properly accomodate the bigger S2's then yes - they are not *THAT* much more expensive but they are also a much more imposing speaker and also interact to a much greater degree with the room ... it's rarely just a decision based on perceived value for money ...

Phil

Just a bit!  But they sounded lovely on the end of a 300DR when I heard them in store so I might try them at home at some point in the near future  

No quarter posted:

YETIZONE

i saw the write up about the Kudos 505s,I am over in Canada,so not even sure if I can get those over here.I really was not looking to change from the S40s,and the only reason I am even demoing the Sopras,is the price offered to me by my long time trusted LOCAL dealer.He said if I prefer the Sopras over my S40s,he would take the 40s back on trade towards the Sopras,so I am not exactly looking around for other options,if anything,I will also look at the Dyn C20s,but that would depend on the price he quotes.

Hey, no problem, I perfectly understand. Just thought I’d mention the new Titan505 as they look like they have potential in the high end stand mount marketplace. Good luck with the Dynaudio & Sopra comparison. As I like the sound of both speakers I look forward to reading which you choose!

No quarter posted:

YETIZONE

i saw the write up about the Kudos 505s,I am over in Canada,so not even sure if I can get those over here.I really was not looking to change from the S40s,and the only reason I am even demoing the Sopras,is the price offered to me by my long time trusted LOCAL dealer.He said if I prefer the Sopras over my S40s,he would take the 40s back on trade towards the Sopras,so I am not exactly looking around for other options,if anything,I will also look at the Dyn C20s,but that would depend on the price he quotes.

It would also be worth trying a 555PS instead of thinking about the speakers. You may be surprised. 

I heard the Sopra 1’s at the factory driven by an Atom, then 272/250 and then a 500 series system fronted by an NDX/XPS2. 

I found the Sopra’s quite nice but rather underwhelming. I certainly didn’t find them unpleasant or bright but Naim’s room is probably an excellent space to show off equipment.

When I heard how much they were I felt they were poor value for money until they wheeled the Focal Maestro Utopia’s in. I didn’t take to these at all, they sounded shut in and lost all the music to me, I much preferred the Sopras on reflection.

The best music I heard that day was when I got home to my own system.

It was though a very enjoyble day and Naim were excellent hosts.

Hi NQ,

Like MDS I listened to the Sopra No 1 in a friends system and they are very capable speakers.

Earlier you were asked whether they had been set up by the dealer, I think this is a critical question. My experience is that Focal speakers show up issues in your system & their setup, and the symptoms are sharpness and edge.

I use the Focal II 1008be, and they are SPECTACULARLY capable speakers, but it has taken me over a year to get the best from them. Initially I was bowled over by the differences from my earlier speakers, but over time things started to irritate. These symptoms were caused by things in four principle areas:

    1. Grounding
    2. Power
    3. Speaker Support
    4. Room Acoustics

Having sorted these out, and I will go into (3) in a bit more detail shortly, I read the review of the Sopra No 1 on 10audio and found what turned out to be spectacularly good advice therein:

Application Note: Add a subwoofer or two. Plug the rear ports on both Sopras with the included foam port plugs, and set the sub's low pass crossover to around 65-70 Hz. The resulting system, properly dialed in, could rival any full range speaker on the planet.

I would add that the sub needs to be as fast as the speakers, but that doesn't mean especially expensive -  I use the BK XXLS400FF, which is a sealed unit and keeps up with my Focals. I did NOT have the foam bungs in, and I now believe I had the speakers too close to the rear wall, which was muddying the mids. Setting up as described above has taken them from good to addictive.

In addition to dialing in the sub as advised I have found the speaker needs OCD levels of attention, I use a tape measure a lot. I have my speakers on Partington Dreadnoughts filled with Atacarma Atabites & sitting on Atacama Gels. The spikes are removed and replaced with IsoAcoustic GIIIs. I am using these in preference to the bespoke 1008be stands I have.

With them well set up they are detailed and neutral. When something is off I find that any issues in recordings are emphasised horribly - I can supply a list of tracks that show these issues.

The Sopra No 1's being further up the scale I would expect to give more of the good stuff, but also be more fussy in the setup perhaps. Certainly my Electras are as good as I need, but it has been a journey and a half getting the best from them.

Please do report back your findings.

M

Thanks for all the comments guys,it looks like opinions are very divided,and it will come down to my own personal taste,and how they work in my room.Not sure if I ever mentioned,but the room is about 131/2 wide by 151/2 feet and is fully treated with viscoustics panels.I guess I should attempt to post some pics again,in preparation for their arrival.I only managed that one time,when I was using photobucket still...what is it I need now,Flickr?

Mr Underhill posted:

Hi NQ,

Like MDS I listened to the Sopra No 1 in a friends system and they are very capable speakers.

Earlier you were asked whether they had been set up by the dealer, I think this is a critical question. My experience is that Focal speakers show up issues in your system & their setup, and the symptoms are sharpness and edge.

I use the Focal II 1008be, and they are SPECTACULARLY capable speakers, but it has taken me over a year to get the best from them. Initially I was bowled over by the differences from my earlier speakers, but over time things started to irritate. These symptoms were caused by things in four principle areas:

    1. Grounding
    2. Power
    3. Speaker Support
    4. Room Acoustics

Having sorted these out, and I will go into (3) in a bit more detail shortly, I read the review of the Sopra No 1 on 10audio and found what turned out to be spectacularly good advice therein:

Application Note: Add a subwoofer or two. Plug the rear ports on both Sopras with the included foam port plugs, and set the sub's low pass crossover to around 65-70 Hz. The resulting system, properly dialed in, could rival any full range speaker on the planet.

I would add that the sub needs to be as fast as the speakers, but that doesn't mean especially expensive -  I use the BK XXLS400FF, which is a sealed unit and keeps up with my Focals. I did NOT have the foam bungs in, and I now believe I had the speakers too close to the rear wall, which was muddying the mids. Setting up as described above has taken them from good to addictive.

In addition to dialing in the sub as advised I have found the speaker needs OCD levels of attention, I use a tape measure a lot. I have my speakers on Partington Dreadnoughts filled with Atacarma Atabites & sitting on Atacama Gels. The spikes are removed and replaced with IsoAcoustic GIIIs. I am using these in preference to the bespoke 1008be stands I have.

With them well set up they are detailed and neutral. When something is off I find that any issues in recordings are emphasised horribly - I can supply a list of tracks that show these issues.

The Sopra No 1's being further up the scale I would expect to give more of the good stuff, but also be more fussy in the setup perhaps. Certainly my Electras are as good as I need, but it has been a journey and a half getting the best from them.

Please do report back your findings.

M

Hi MR UNDERHILL

 Wow,lots of info there...I happen to have a set of the GAIA 111s under my Dynaudio XD 600s,I am not sure Focal recommends them under the stands,I have seen a video of one person using the ISO pucks between the speaker and stands.As to subwoofers,I happen to have two JL audio Fathom 112s in my closet that I have not used since I moved into this APARTMENT,you may understand why,if you have ever heard JLs in action.Still though,I could use them if I feel it is needed.I will spend the time to dial in the location of the Sopras,along with toe in,thanks for the suggestions,none the less.

I have had Sopra 1s for about a year now, bought as replacements for B&W 805s, and I think they are superb. I had intended to go for 805D3 but I much preferred the Sopra’s, both home demoed, to my ears the the D3’s were a bit too bright and lacked bass compared to the Sopra’s.
I have felt no need for a sub woofer.
I would say that the supplied stands for the Sopra’s are too tall (certainly for our room), so I use my 30 year old Atacama stands, it is a pity there is no option of buying without stands.

Curious on your thoughts of S1 and C20. I haven't heard S1 but just done reviews I have read and comments here they seem to lack a bit of dynamics compared to Dyns. Not surprising as many speakers lack dynamics compared to Dyns. Looking forward to what you think. 

spurrier sucks posted:

Curious on your thoughts of S1 and C20. I haven't heard S1 but just done reviews I have read and comments here they seem to lack a bit of dynamics compared to Dyns. Not surprising as many speakers lack dynamics compared to Dyns. Looking forward to what you think. 

Hi John

i will  definitely give you my impressions of the S1 versus my S40s,and as you might of guessed,I am extremely excited to FINALLY get to hear the exact same speaker you are using(C20s),same color too.I will take a good listen to the Contours,but it will be a limited for time one,obviously I will want to get home with the Sopras,to get them playing.I don’t know about you,but I am also interested in those Kudos Titan 505s,from what some of the guys have been saying.I am going to ask my dealer if he has any way of getting those here in Canada too,just in case the Sopras and Contours are not my cup of tea.

No quarter posted:

spurrier sucks posted:

Curious on your thoughts of S1 and C20. I haven't heard S1 but just done reviews I have read and comments here they seem to lack a bit of dynamics compared to Dyns. Not surprising as many speakers lack dynamics compared to Dyns. Looking forward to what you think. 

Hi John

i will  definitely give you my impressions of the S1 versus my S40s,and as you might of guessed,I am extremely excited to FINALLY get to hear the exact same speaker you are using(C20s),same color too.I will take a good listen to the Contours,but it will be a limited for time one,obviously I will want to get home with the Sopras,to get them playing.I don’t know about you,but I am also interested in those Kudos Titan 505s,from what some of the guys have been saying.I am going to ask my dealer if he has any way of getting those here in Canada too,just in case the Sopras and Contours are not my cup of tea.

I'm wanting to hear Focal Kanta No. 2. I may make a trip to hear those. Would love to find a Naim/Foxal/Dyn dealer close by. I bet the S1 will be nice by I'm guessing they won't fill the need for bass just a guess however. I do like the looks. 

Yes I have always liked the futuristic look of the Sopra1s,really the only cool looking Dyn speaker to me is the C1’s.Remember,I am limited to volume where I currently live,so bass is something I can live without for now.Like I said earlier,those JLs are begging to come out of the closet.I have always liked black an white speakers,wood grains are a little 70s (panelling) to me.Guess what,my dealer also agreed to loan me his Chord Dave soon too,he is waiting for a Qutest to arrive any time,then the Dave is mine to play with.

I feel the same about speakers or I did. I love the walnut on the C20. Has a nice mid century modern look. If I were to get Kanta 2 it would be walnut with white face. Would just need an Eames chair to go with those. 

Well I will tell you what I think of the walnut soon,that’s what my dealer has...my old focus 160s were walnut,and I liked them,just prefer a more modern look

After decades, the war between Dynaudio Esotar textile dome and Focal inverted fiberglass, kevlar, and now beryllium dome tweeters is never going to end it seem. Nice try Focal but... 

FWIW I have heard the Focal Supra 1 recently at a hospitable Naimees’ home. It was in a medium sized room and on the end of an NDS/252/300DR system.  It was great with the human voice, it was wonderful with rock and also acoustic guitar. Drums really were palpable, you could feel the thwack of the sticks on the drum edge. They were no compromise over a floor stander, and I could happily live with them. 

Thanks for that KIWI CAT,exactly what I wanted to hear...Saturday can’t come soon enough!

No quarter posted:

Hi MR UNDERHILL

 Wow,lots of info there...I happen to have a set of the GAIA 111s under my Dynaudio XD 600s,I am not sure Focal recommends them under the stands,I have seen a video of one person using the ISO pucks between the speaker and stands.As to subwoofers,I happen to have two JL audio Fathom 112s in my closet that I have not used since I moved into this APARTMENT,you may understand why,if you have ever heard JLs in action.Still though,I could use them if I feel it is needed.I will spend the time to dial in the location of the Sopras,along with toe in,thanks for the suggestions,none the less.

Hi NQ,

Gaia III: For clarity, the ones I use are designed to go under speakers and come with a variety of fitting to replace the spikes, e.g. M8/M6.

JL Sub: Well, that looks interesting . In BK terms I have the single sub fed from the speakers into the Hi-Level input - NOT direct from the power amp.

Look forward to hearing your thoughts and impressions.

M

Mr Underhill

Hi again,it looks like we are using the same footers from Isoacoustics,mine are threaded into the outriggers on my Dynaudio’s,in place of the spikes.I suppose I could take them off,and thread them into the Focal stands to try,but I am not sure I would bother when just demoing them...maybe if I decide to keep them..For my JL subs,if I decided to use those,I would connect them to the line out,or pre out on my 272.Are the stands on your  Focals similar to the Sopra stands,with a glass base...and bolt to the speaker bottoms?In preparation for the arrival of the Sopras tomorrow,today I will be moving my Dynaudio S40s to another room,from what I have read,the Sopras should form an equilateral triangle with your listening position,with a slight toe in.Also,I will ask my dealer where he suggests that I place them,and if it would be similar to  my S40s position,as a starting point.

Kiwi cat posted:

FWIW I have heard the Focal Supra 1 recently at a hospitable Naimees’ home. It was in a medium sized room and on the end of an NDS/252/300DR system.  It was great with the human voice, it was wonderful with rock and also acoustic guitar. Drums really were palpable, you could feel the thwack of the sticks on the drum edge. They were no compromise over a floor stander, and I could happily live with them. 

I would 2nd that, but as has been said a home dem is a must. Personally I don’t think you will be disappointed.

And if you can buy a set with such an exceptional discount, happy days as they say....