172xs/155xs VS ND5xs/152xs/155xs VS ND5xs/202/200

The NAP200 pairs very well with the 172. No need for a new 200DR, as you wouldn’t be using the DR power with a 172, so a good used one would be fine. 

But I would like to remove the 172xs in favor of the ND5xs.

I would like to understand if I will have an improvement in the quality of the source or not.

That said, I would like to understand which combo you would prefer to drive the s400 (using the ND5xs as source) ... 152/155 or 202/200?

Thx a lot

For the S400, a 200 will be better than a 155, and a 250 better still. Why not get the power amp and then swap the 172 for a 272?

If buying new, the improved ND5XS-2 is due out maybe later this year. If buying secondhand, the new streamers may bring more secondhand mk1s  onto the market...

There are non-Naim streamers as well, some of which do Tidal well - the obvious one there is Roon, which with an appropriate implementation and a separate DAC (whether a Naim DAC, or something else like the Chords often mentioned on here) might be another way to go - but you’d want to try the Roon interface first to see if it is for you, some people love it but others don’t  (you can get a free trial that you can run on a computer, even if not playing the music it will show you the visual interface). There have been several threads on Roon over the past year.

If you like what your 172 does, but want to improve sound quality, replacing it with a 272, as HH says, is another option to consider. Use it with your 155, or look for a 200 or 250. In future, you could then add an XPS power supply to the 272 for another big improvement. 

Regarding power amps, I like my 200, but as you say, not everybody likes its presentation, and it’s very hard to choose unless you can hear one for yourself. I would suggest that after you have made your source upgrade, you look for a good used 200 and try it. If you don’t like it, you should be able to sell it quite easily. Be careful not to buy an old one that needs a service. 

Thanks for the answers ... I'm really appreciating your help ...

The 202/200 option stems from the fact that I have the opportunity to exchange my old 150x with a Nac202. Hence the idea of completing with a Nap200 and a dedicated streamer (ND5). In the future I could always upgrade the power both for the 202 and for the ND5.

A curiosity ... so far I have never had to run a service and therefore I do not know exactly what it consists exactly and how much it could cost ... and especially how old it must be to need a service.

I have a 172/200 driving S400s. This has been my system for 3 1/2 years. Whilst I love my sound, I have always felt the black boxes are a bit under what S400s need to make them really sing. And honestly a Nova is much better than the 172/200...and cheaper.

My upgrade heirachy advice would be :-

1. Consider a Nova. Simple, cheap, wonderful and joy to use. It wasn't available when I bought my toy, but I wouldn't hesitate to buy one now with S400s.

2. Go a 272 to replace the 172. Then a 200 or 250. And then maybe a power supply like the XPS, (but no problem if you don't get that far). Nice balance, reasonable outlay and simple to do in stages. Careful buying can help soften the blow. A 272/200 is lovely with S400s. A 272/555PS/250DR gets you into "music" territory. I can see the appeal HH!

3. Sure if you have more cash a better streamer works. I think the ND5 xs is not worth the effort, with the proviso that the new version may be a lot better. So I would go for the NDX ex demo/used, (or wait for the NDX2).  Of course then you need a pre, so the 282 comes into play, or a 252. And a power supply. A 200 is fine but a 250 makes more sense. And at this level the 300 calls. To me the logic leads to a NDX2/555PS/252/SCDR/300 combo as the next significant step up the ladder. The 400s will shine. And still make sense. Just.

Well to me at least. There would be a Fraim in there as well as some insane cables as well, but you know what they say about a half penny 'o tar..

This is where I want to get to. Unfortunately the steps along the way are much steeper. And this crazy goal is about triple the outlay of a 272/XPS/250. Six times a 272/200. Nine times a Nova. I could get myself a Golf convertible here in Australia for less... Might even come with a hot blonde to boot. Goodness what am I thinking? A hifi or hot blonde? I gotta get out more.

People will say if all you are doing is Tidal then you're not going to get the best result. Before anything, sort out a NAS full of good music.

I definitely agree, but as logical as a NAS full of decent music is in the context of your current, (and future), system, there are other considerations. For some the ease of use and the wonderful music library that Tidal offers "fits" better. I have a NAS chock full of hi res and cd rip files. Would take me over a year playing 6 hours a day to hear everything just once. Fantastic music resource. Taken me years to acquire and sort.  But Tidal is often my go to and it's still good listening. A few red wines and it's the BEST option.

FWIW

I ran a ND5XS > NAIT XS 2 (70W) > NacA5 > Ovator S400 and enjoyed it quite a bit.  

In December I took advantage of the end of life sale and upgraded to a NDX & with the January increase in prices announced I also bought a SN2 to go with the Ovator S400 and enjoying that as well and thought it was a very positive upgrade.

Besides Tidal I have all my CD's ripped to a NAS.

I find running a two box solution works quite well for me but may add power supplies at a future date.

Good luck with your decision.

I think Steve and Seek laid it all out with all the details in between: Don’t stay XS, go high Classic, 272/250 or NDX/SN2 if not NDX/282/250. ????

Chag -

Thank you so much

I knew that I would have received good advice on which way to go for a correct upgrade ....

I think that, with a bit of time and patience, I will leave the series xs in favor of the hight classic with Streamer + Pre amp + Amp (I do not want to take a 272 and bind me on possible updates only of the streamer part)

Just another request ....

If I remove the 172 in favor of an NDX, can I "temporarily" connect it to my faithful NAIM AV-2 (as pre amp)?

in this way the steps (to be done over time) could be:

1) NDX (instead of 172) connected to AV-2 "temporarily"
2) NAP 250.2 (instead of the 155xs) (I think it makes sense now to step only once and not go from 200 and go directly to 250.2)
3) complete with a 202 (or 252 or 282 based on what I will find and that the finances will allow me) and finally connect the NDX to its right pre amp.
.....

Could it be a way forward ???

I found the 152XS pre amp is a very week link. The the 155XS is worthy of a much better pre amp. I had a previous version of the pre which ran rings round the 152. When listened to in isolation the 152 pre is not bad. I had a 155 power which wasn't improved upon until I upgraded to a 250. Rich

I’d be inclined to add an NDX to the 172, then get a better preamp, which can be powered by the 155. Then you will need a Hicap, and then finally swap the power amp for a 200 or 250. If you want a 250 you will be looking at a 282 preamp. This follows the source first approach and will give a satisfying system while you upgrade.

Alternatively, adding the NDX and then swapping the 172 and 155 for a Supernait 2 would seem very appealing, given that you don’t want to go the 272 route. You need to consider how much you have to spend and whether you will be happy to upgrade over an extended period. An NDX/SN2 may very well be all you need. It’s a lovely system. 

If you go for the 202/200, I think it is good enough to deserve a source of NDX standard, so I would not consider an ND5XS. 

There are quite a few Naim amps on the used market, but be careful if buying an older model, as there are some that have had unofficial modifications or that need a service to sound as they should.