Naim Nova and Harbeth 30.1

Hi,

Many Naim users happily use Naim and Harbeth together so that shouldn’t be the problem. When you heard the Harbeth speakers with the Creek amps was it in your room?  I ask this because I think it might be a speaker positioning problem.  How much room is their behind and to the sides.  You might experiment a little to see if that helps.

Regards,

Lindsay 

No, heard the Harbeth at the dealer. Now speakers are 30 cm from the corner and 30 cm from the side of the walls, little bit pointing to my listing position, almost a triangle, doing that they have more base.speakers are 4 mt my from each other’s. I tried to place them closer to each other let’s say 2mt as distance and I believe they loose more the base. I am placed at 2,5 mt from the speakers on a sofa. Probably is the sound of the speakers that is very natural. With my Yamaha they are less controlled compared with Naim but I can regulate tone in the amplifier so I remove something if I think they are weak for a particular song. Wondering if is the bass that is missing or just a certain punch in the low. 

Set the speakers up using the Cardas formula if you can (use google). Also I used to own some big Sony speakers, they were dreadfully coloured in the lower registers but much fun. You might have to retrain your ears a little.

Yes. If your sitting 2.5 mt from your speakers and you have them 4 mt apart as you have, then you will have a big hole in the soundstage presentation. 

If your more used to having speakers towards corners because of tone, you could try putting them both in the corner at 2.5 mt apart firing across to another corner - With your hot seat at apex of 2.7 mt from the central line plan from the speakers.

BeppeP posted:

Looking for reccomandations and impressions if there are owners of Nova + Harbeth 30.1. Coming from a match Monitor Audio S8 and amplifier Yamaha, recently updated with Nova and Harbeth 30.1. I listen mainly Rock music and pop/electro 80, some blues from time to time. I own this match since a week and I am thinking that there is something missing here. Is my impression but with this combination my feeling is that sound is little bit too polite, I cannot say flat but polite. Harbeth are not aggressive speakers, but the bass are too smooth and sometimes songs are lacking of base ( cannot say bass but base)When there are tracks with drums they are reproduced faraway and the middle tones in your face. Got my friend at home asking me if there are control tones in the Naim, so I am wondering if this is a good match with this speakers. I am very annoyed as when I listen the Harbeth they where matched with Creek 100a and I didn’t got this impression.

Which firmware do you have on the Nova?  There have been 2 updates in the past few weeks which to me and several others have completely neutered enjoyment of our Novas.

Please see thread here:

https://forums.naimaudio.com/to...-april-2018-comments

I use some old Epos ES14s, the Nova prior to 2.3.1 used to sound very well rounded, nice warm sound from digital, good bass and very enjoyable generally to listen to.

After 2.31 bass seems very attenuated, almost apologetic, and most music is quite unengaging.

There does seem to be more detail but 'polite' is a phrase I can relate to - everything seems very very restrained - instruments may sound better separated but they lack all power and 'oomph', as though everything is a bit muffled almost as though we're hearing each individually wrapped in cotton wool (pardon the analogy).  The soundstage is also very flat.  There is a particular song I can remember testing with the Nova and my speakers at a demo where I can recall a driving bass line being a bit overpowering but that bass is now completely ineffectual - same source file on a USB stick in the Nova.

Which firmware - did you test with older firmware?

See:

https://forums.naimaudio.com/to...-april-2018-comments

Alley Cat posted:

Which firmware - did you test with older firmware?

See:

https://forums.naimaudio.com/to...-april-2018-comments

Are you in the right thread?

In my experience, this is a placement issue. Try to get some help from a dealer to get them right. 

In my view, start with 2m apart and experiment from there. Also get them further out from the front wall, you may be surprised what can be achived. At some point, they will open up and also do better speed and base. At least mine did. If speakers are 2m apart, then listening position should be 2m or more.

Another thing, Harbeth`s may not suit your musical taste.

S

I have installed the latest firmware and since there I have this clap on the speakers every time I turn on power then seems that is a water flush in the tweeter when is on, probably the electricity tension. I have switched back the ground to the original position and it sounds less boxed. Is there a way to downgrade the firmware asking assistance, I have downgraded once in my Yamaha Rn500 via usb. I mean is a quite expensive toy, at this point was better to have a streamer and amplifier separated if we have all this issues and if something doesn’t work with the streamer you change but you are sure that sound quality in the amplifier is always the same. I will plug my speakers tonight with a Cambridge Audio from my neighbor and I will take my decision after, I am still in the 30 days window and I can return it.

hafler3o posted:

Alley Cat posted:

Which firmware - did you test with older firmware?

See:

https://forums.naimaudio.com/to...-april-2018-comments

Are you in the right thread?

Yes, my earlier longer post seemed to get stuck in moderation.

I can't explain why but a few of us felt recent firmware updates have had a negative effect on SQ which is contrary to the experience of the majority - real or imagined I'm unsure, but it's a possibility that in some setups new firmware might not work as synergistically as older firmware.

I have 2.6.9508, to be honest the app is full of bug when I start the Nova doesn’t open in the main menu as selecting source but is still stuck on what I listened previously and I cannot come back. So when is like that I restart from zero pairing the nova or if I am lucky I restart the iPhone. 

I would like to get back to the previous one if is possible, if not using this forum I give a call to the assistance and if they say no I return everything. I mean is my right to have a product that fulfill the expectations now my Yamaha rn500 paid 12 times less works better and no bug.

Beppep, I suggest you get in touch Naim support, either by e-mail or by phone.

Hi Rich, yes I will call them tomorrow and see what they can suggest.Just to make  the point, I am not a type of person that complain easily, i like Naim products, just want to have the quality I paid for and no bugs. as me there are others who believe sound changed with latest firmware upgrade and they already flagged bugs in the interface or application, I believe is worth to hear what technicians suggest.

BeppeP posted:

Hi Rich, yes I will call them tomorrow and see what they can suggest.Just to make  the point, I am not a type of person that complain easily, i like Naim products, just want to have the quality I paid for and no bugs. as me there are others who believe sound changed with latest firmware upgrade and they already flagged bugs in the interface or application, I believe is worth to hear what technicians suggest.

Hi BeppeP - my query to you earlier was really whether or not you ever upgraded the firmware and noticed a change as some of use felt we did - many others did not or felt it was better - perhaps all groups are correct!

At least we know now we can go back to earlier firmware if we preferred the overall sound - we may find it simply sounds the same when we do it, but at lest we are able to.

In addition to the helpful suggestions already made I’d double check the wiring, that the left channel and right are wired correctly and in phase, there are test tracks available on the internet.  Essentially + on amp must go to + on speaker, - to -.  Having the wires on one speaker the wrong way round could produce the problem you describe.  Make sure to turn the amp off before having a fiddle.

I’d also tend to avoid having the symetary you describe, 30cm from front and side walls.  This may also be too close for 30.1s as the cabinets radiate a lot of sound.  Move them closer together as others have suggested.

Your system should sound very impressive.  I’d try and find a few tracks you know are well recorded and in at least CD quality and stick with them for testing.  I’d suggest Lou Reed Walk on the Wild Side and a track called Trøllabundin by Eivør (both sound amazing on a well sorted system) to assess you bass performance.  Christy Moore So do I and Nora Jones Little Room to assess the stereo image, but you probably have your favourites.  You need to have confidence that the music used is well recorded.  Some pop might be low resolution and poorly recorded so that can just confuse the issue.  The 30.1s decend from studio monitors, so if the recording is a rubbish, low res file they will reveal it.

Good luck with it.