Dipping toes into the NAS (world) with no clue and getting rid of the CD player

Stephen, interesting topic I've been streaming for nearly seven years starting with a NAS and using a Core since early last year personally I've always struggled with the computer side of streaming so I find the Core so easy to use.

Initially the editing on the Core was rather iffy to say the least but numerous App and firmware updates have been made which makes editing so easy using a I Pad. I can't comment on Classical music because it's a genre of music I am not keen on.

My original Core had an intermittent problem after it was a month old whilst ripping quite a few CDs  it got very warm and cut out this happened again a couple of months later Naim and the dealer were informed on both occasions and the second time this happened Naim requested that I took it back to the dealer. The dealer checked it out but could find no fault but a quick phone call to Naim resulted in Jason ringing back to confirm a new Core would be dispatched this was installed and working within three days of my visit to the dealer.

So to me taking into account the ease of use the fact it can reside on the equipment rack and operate in total silence (Seagate Pipeline drive fitted) plus you have the legendary Naim after sales service and dealer back up this far outweighs the additional cost of the Core over a PC and NAS its a matter of personal choice.

I should mention the CD player left the premises three years ago and not missed in fact I purchase far more CDs that I have ever done so as it is so easy to rip and store plus very convenient to play via the App.

Just take your time and enjoy your journey.

Huge posted:

Stephen Tate posted:

Ok, thanks for clearing that one up.

So it will end up more expensive and will push my system out it's context, not something i'm able to do at this present time. 2K is really my absolute limit.

Cheers guys!

 

Secondhand ND5 XS £1600

Synology 216j or 218j £180
WD Red or Segate NAS drive 3TB £100
Netgear GS105 £25
Ethernet Cables £12
DBpoweramp (software) £25 or EAC (whatever you want to pay)

Total £1942 - i.e. in Budget!

Provided you want the NAS for Music streaming and backup/general file storage a Synology 216j (or 118 or 218) will be perfectly adequate.  The only limitations you may encounter are with transcoding, but the simple answer is to just use WAVE files, the more complex answer is to use Minim Server).  The more powerful NAS drives are intended for use with multiple concurrent users (mote than 10) or for intensive jobs like transcoding video files; for music and domestic use, they simply aren't justified.

WOW!

Thanks Huge!

docmark posted:

I've used the Core for about 6 months now.  I use its S/PDIF output into my Dave DAC, then analogue output into my 272, output into a 250DR, then out to my speakers (Burmester B10).  Sounds great, I think better than thru my network by Ethernet.

so you use only the pre section of the 272, not its streamer functions?  if i understand well

ChrisSU posted:

Stephen Tate posted:

Hungryhalibut posted:

No good for internet radio though. 

Yes, this is also something else to ponder on, I had not even given this a thought.

Or get an Innuos Zen Mini for £700, which is a ripper/store/server like the Core, but has iRadio, Tidal, Spotify and Roon. Plenty of cash left over for a DAC upgrade. 

Thanks for this Chris, I will need to look this up!

Stephen Tate posted:

ChrisSU posted:

Stephen Tate posted:

Hungryhalibut posted:

No good for internet radio though. 

Yes, this is also something else to ponder on, I had not even given this a thought.

Or get an Innuos Zen Mini for £700, which is a ripper/store/server like the Core, but has iRadio, Tidal, Spotify and Roon. Plenty of cash left over for a DAC upgrade. 

Thanks for this Chris, I will need to look this up!

...my point being that I think you might get more value by investing in the best possible DAC. With Innuos, it will need to be a DAC with a USB input. 

Pcd posted:

Stephen, interesting topic I've been streaming for nearly seven years starting with a NAS and using a Core since early last year personally I've always struggled with the computer side of streaming so I find the Core so easy to use.

Initially the editing on the Core was rather iffy to say the least but numerous App and firmware updates have been made which makes editing so easy using a I Pad. I can't comment on Classical music because it's a genre of music I am not keen on.

My original Core had an intermittent problem after it was a month old whilst ripping quite a few CDs  it got very warm and cut out this happened again a couple of months later Naim and the dealer were informed on both occasions and the second time this happened Naim requested that I took it back to the dealer. The dealer checked it out but could find no fault but a quick phone call to Naim resulted in Jason ringing back to confirm a new Core would be dispatched this was installed and working within three days of my visit to the dealer.

So to me taking into account the ease of use the fact it can reside on the equipment rack and operate in total silence (Seagate Pipeline drive fitted) plus you have the legendary Naim after sales service and dealer back up this far outweighs the additional cost of the Core over a PC and NAS its a matter of personal choice.

I should mention the CD player left the premises three years ago and not missed in fact I purchase far more CDs that I have ever done so as it is so easy to rip and store plus very convenient to play via the App.

Just take your time and enjoy your journey.

 

Yes Pcd, I do not intend to be faffing around with computers, it just isn't my thing. When it comes to listening to music I want to do just that, especially after a hard day at work. I like to go home, find some music that really helps me to unwind from whatever mood i'm in at that time and relax. This is what I have found in the Naim sound all those years ago, a type of therapy is what I call it. Mind you, in those days it was more of an adrenalin rush!!

Thanks

ChrisSU posted:

Stephen Tate posted:

ChrisSU posted:

Stephen Tate posted:

Hungryhalibut posted:

No good for internet radio though. 

Yes, this is also something else to ponder on, I had not even given this a thought.

Or get an Innuos Zen Mini for £700, which is a ripper/store/server like the Core, but has iRadio, Tidal, Spotify and Roon. Plenty of cash left over for a DAC upgrade. 

Thanks for this Chris, I will need to look this up!

...my point being that I think you might get more value by investing in the best possible DAC. With Innuos, it will need to be a DAC with a USB input. 

Thanks chris, point taken.

ChrisSU posted:

Stephen Tate posted:

ChrisSU posted:

Stephen Tate posted:

Hungryhalibut posted:

No good for internet radio though. 

Yes, this is also something else to ponder on, I had not even given this a thought.

Or get an Innuos Zen Mini for £700, which is a ripper/store/server like the Core, but has iRadio, Tidal, Spotify and Roon. Plenty of cash left over for a DAC upgrade. 

Thanks for this Chris, I will need to look this up!

...my point being that I think you might get more value by investing in the best possible DAC. With Innuos, it will need to be a DAC with a USB input. 

Indeed the Innuos ZENMINI is the first of these audiophile NAS drives I've see that doesn't carry an excessive price tag.

However it does mean finding a USB DAC that has a sound signature that's not too far way from the sound of the CD5si while still being an improvement.  The ND5 XS is just that - an improvement on the CD5si whilst retaining all the Naim sound signature.

Stephen, I think auditioning both these options would be worthwhile, and it'll probably need an audition to see which best suits your auditory preferences.

Has anyone compared the Zen’s sound quality as a renderer, against things like Naim streamer rendering stages, Melco, Core etc? I believe the Zenith was considered as good or better than Melco, but I don’t recall and comparisons involving its little sibling, which certainly seems well priced. Of course, rest of system significant in assessing, and might vary in performance with different DACs according to how good it/they are at RF removal.

Huge posted:

ChrisSU posted:

Stephen Tate posted:

ChrisSU posted:

Stephen Tate posted:

Hungryhalibut posted:

No good for internet radio though. 

Yes, this is also something else to ponder on, I had not even given this a thought.

Or get an Innuos Zen Mini for £700, which is a ripper/store/server like the Core, but has iRadio, Tidal, Spotify and Roon. Plenty of cash left over for a DAC upgrade. 

Thanks for this Chris, I will need to look this up!

...my point being that I think you might get more value by investing in the best possible DAC. With Innuos, it will need to be a DAC with a USB input. 

Indeed the Innuos ZENMINI is the first of these audiophile NAS drives I've see that doesn't carry an excessive price tag.

However it does mean finding a USB DAC that has a sound signature that's not too far way from the sound of the CD5si while still being an improvement.  The ND5 XS is just that - an improvement on the CD5si whilst retaining all the Naim sound signature.

Stephen, I think auditioning both these options would be worthwhile, and it'll probably need an audition to see which best suits your auditory preferences.

Chord Hugo is the obvious DAC, provided the Zen’s output is free from RF (otherwise an isolator called for, or the Qutest, though unclear if Qutest sounds as goid as Hugo?) Hugo certainly improved ND5XS for me, but I wouldn’t have called it a different sound signature, just more natural sounding, or ‘analog-like’ many people say. Pricewise with Zen that is about spot on with the OP’s stretched budget (but no harm trying first with the irDAC)

I've just had a look at the Core on the Audio T site, I have to say it does look a very lush piece of kit, the quality of it looks absolutely stunning! 

No doubt knowing Naim, I bet it sports a proper 'meat & veg' power supply.

It's also a neat idea that you can change the internal drives too.

So, for simplicity and in my boat then, the ultimate route would be a Core/ND5 XS2. This would be double my 2k budget I know, but....

Stephen Tate posted:

I've just had a look at the Core on the Audio T site, I have to say it does look a very lush piece of kit, the quality of it looks absolutely stunning! 

No doubt knowing Naim, I bet it sports a proper 'meat & veg' power supply.

It's also a neat idea that you can change the internal drives too.

So, for simplicity and in my boat then, the ultimate route would be a Core/ND5 XS2. This would be double my 2k budget I know, but....

Or Core into a DAC, given that Core has a built-in renderer, and allowing more flexibility and potential upgrade of the DAC, which is the most critical component in digital replay? 

Edit: but just seen another thread about Core with 272 where both Phil Harris (by hearsay) and Richard Dane are putting their weight behind using via a network, which in some ways is counter-intuitive as it involves streaming across a network,  but suggests the rendered output might not be that great in their view. 

Had a look inside the Core at the factory a week or so ago...it is beautifully built and sports a transformer which would shame some amplifiers.

Innocent Bystander posted:

Stephen Tate posted:

I've just had a look at the Core on the Audio T site, I have to say it does look a very lush piece of kit, the quality of it looks absolutely stunning! 

No doubt knowing Naim, I bet it sports a proper 'meat & veg' power supply.

It's also a neat idea that you can change the internal drives too.

So, for simplicity and in my boat then, the ultimate route would be a Core/ND5 XS2. This would be double my 2k budget I know, but....

Or Core into a DAC, given that Core has a built-in renderer, and allowing more flexibility and potential upgrade of the DAC, which is the most critical component in digital replay? 

Edit: but just seen another thread about Core with 272 where both Phil Harris (by hearsay) and Richard Dane are putting their weight behind using via a network, which in some ways is counter-intuitive as it involves streaming across a network,  but suggests the rendered output might not be that great in their view. 

It more reflects the limitations of S/Pdif as a transport protocol.

Huge posted:

Innocent Bystander posted:

 

 

Or Core into a DAC, given that Core has a built-in renderer, and allowing more flexibility and potential upgrade of the DAC, which is the most critical component in digital replay? 

Edit: but just seen another thread about Core with 272 where both Phil Harris (by hearsay) and Richard Dane are putting their weight behind using via a network, which in some ways is counter-intuitive as it involves streaming across a network,  but suggests the rendered output might not be that great in their view. 

It more reflects the limitations of S/Pdif as a transport protocol.

Ah.  So out of Core, Melco, Zenith ...and posibly Zen, the Core is unique in being held back by SPDIF, the others having usb outputs and so able to maximise effectiveness of digital audio transfer without needing to use ethernet unless the user has other reasons for so doing. Harder to see benefits of Core in that case, other than for people for whom the ripping finction wins on ease.

Innocent Bystander posted:

Stephen Tate posted:

I've just had a look at the Core on the Audio T site, I have to say it does look a very lush piece of kit, the quality of it looks absolutely stunning! 

No doubt knowing Naim, I bet it sports a proper 'meat & veg' power supply.

It's also a neat idea that you can change the internal drives too.

So, for simplicity and in my boat then, the ultimate route would be a Core/ND5 XS2. This would be double my 2k budget I know, but....

Or Core into a DAC, given that Core has a built-in renderer, and allowing more flexibility and potential upgrade of the DAC, which is the most critical component in digital replay? 

Edit: but just seen another thread about Core with 272 where both Phil Harris (by hearsay) and Richard Dane are putting their weight behind using via a network, which in some ways is counter-intuitive as it involves streaming across a network,  but suggests the rendered output might not be that great in their view. 

Best not jump to conclusions here -  I use my Core in my main system into a DAC, which acts as my digital hub for a number of digital sources like CD transport, HDD recorder etc..   The Core makes for a very nice transport.

I like the Core very much but due to certain logistics here, streaming reliably with optimal performance is very difficult and relies in part on bridges and wifi. The ADSL (awful - drops every 5 minutes when the sun starts warming things up, best when it's wet out.  I blame the ancient lines and junction boxes but BT reckon it's fine...) is one end of the house, the main system the other. It's an old house that is difficult to tear apart without investing lots of money and patient planning. So, using the Core as a sort of music player works best for me and likely sounds better this way - for my circumstances.  And it still allows me to stream to other devices around the house (via wifi of course).

Innocent Bystander posted:

Ah.  So out of Core, Melco, Zenith ...and posibly Zen, the Core is unique in being held back by SPDIF, the others having usb outputs and so able to maximise effectiveness of digital audio transfer without needing to use ethernet unless the user has other reasons for so doing. Harder to see benefits of Core in that case, other than for people for whom the ripping finction wins on ease.

I think I'd rather have a good s/pdif than digital via USB.

Richard Dane posted:

Innocent Bystander posted:

Stephen Tate posted:

I've just had a look at the Core on the Audio T site, I have to say it does look a very lush piece of kit, the quality of it looks absolutely stunning! 

No doubt knowing Naim, I bet it sports a proper 'meat & veg' power supply.

It's also a neat idea that you can change the internal drives too.

So, for simplicity and in my boat then, the ultimate route would be a Core/ND5 XS2. This would be double my 2k budget I know, but....

Or Core into a DAC, given that Core has a built-in renderer, and allowing more flexibility and potential upgrade of the DAC, which is the most critical component in digital replay? 

Edit: but just seen another thread about Core with 272 where both Phil Harris (by hearsay) and Richard Dane are putting their weight behind using via a network, which in some ways is counter-intuitive as it involves streaming across a network,  but suggests the rendered output might not be that great in their view. 

Best not jump to conclusions here -  I use my Core in my main system into a DAC, which acts as my digital hub for a number of digital sources like CD transport, HDD recorder etc..   The Core makes for a very nice transport.

I like the Core very much but due to certain logistics here, streaming reliably with optimal performance is very difficult and relies in part on bridges and wifi. The ADSL (awful - drops every 5 minutes when the sun starts warming things up, best when it's wet out.  I blame the ancient lines and junction boxes but BT reckon it's fine...) is one end of the house, the main system the other. It's an old house that is difficult to tear apart without investing lots of money and patient planning. So, using the Core as a sort of music player works best for me and likely sounds better this way - for my circumstances.  And it still allows me to stream to other devices around the house (via wifi of course).

Apologies, Richard, for misconstruing your preference given on the other thread

Hi folks,

I can't help myself and i'm probably jumping the gun here (in my mind that is) but the more I think about the Core the more my eye goes on the line of sight with my finger on the trigger! 

It is feeling a bit like a Cain & Able moment - I have to keep reminding myself to keep calm & carry on!

Richard Dane posted:

Innocent Bystander posted:

Ah.  So out of Core, Melco, Zenith ...and posibly Zen, the Core is unique in being held back by SPDIF, the others having usb outputs and so able to maximise effectiveness of digital audio transfer without needing to use ethernet unless the user has other reasons for so doing. Harder to see benefits of Core in that case, other than for people for whom the ripping finction wins on ease.

I think I'd rather have a good s/pdif than digital via USB.

Indeed USB is also a compromised transport for audio use (but compromised in different ways when compared to S/Pdif).

Stephen Tate posted:

Hi folks,

I can't help myself and i'm probably jumping the gun here (in my mind that is) but the more I think about the Core the more my eye goes on the line of sight with my finger on the trigger! 

It is feeling a bit like a Cain & Able moment - I have to keep reminding myself to keep calm & carry on!

  

Stephen , I would take up the offers you have had of visits also visit your dealer to demo alternatives.

I did not purchase my Core untilI had a lengthy demo at the dealer and used it at home for a week to ensure that it suited my requirements.

Stephen Tate posted:

Hi folks,

I can't help myself and i'm probably jumping the gun here (in my mind that is) but the more I think about the Core the more my eye goes on the line of sight with my finger on the trigger! 

It is feeling a bit like a Cain & Able moment - I have to keep reminding myself to keep calm & carry on!

  

for the price of the nd5xs with the uniticore you can have the ndx2 with a nas. The later is better for sound quality.  To investigate.....

French Rooster posted:

Stephen Tate posted:

Hi folks,

I can't help myself and i'm probably jumping the gun here (in my mind that is) but the more I think about the Core the more my eye goes on the line of sight with my finger on the trigger! 

It is feeling a bit like a Cain & Able moment - I have to keep reminding myself to keep calm & carry on!

  

for the price of the nd5xs with the uniticore you can have the ndx2 with a nas. The later is better for sound quality.  To investigate.....

One could stack  up the options, pairing music store, renderer and DAC combinations at given price points, and the OP may well already have done that - but I think this particular ‘on the trigger’ thought may have been Core, starting with existing DAC, or maybe planning a modest cost DAC, like Mojo (I dont recall cost of Core)

Stephen

Here's a thought.

A used NAC-172 and NAP200 is within reach of your £2000 budget.  £1400 for the 172 and £900 for the 200.  That makes £2300.

Sell the CD player and amp and the Hi-Line and you will raise £900 to £1000 so back down to £1400,  Add a NAS for £200 and you are sorted! 

I know you didn't want to mess with the Nait but I suspect this would make a much better system.  Hopefully HH will convince you that a NAS is easy enough that you don't need to look at the Core as I think your money is better spent on the main system rather than a posh ripper/NAS good though that is.

RIchard

Huge posted

 

Secondhand ND5 XS £1600

Synology 216j or 218j £180
WD Red or Segate NAS drive 3TB £100
Netgear GS105 £25
Ethernet Cables £12
DBpoweramp (software) £25 or EAC (whatever you want to pay)

Total £1942 - i.e. in Budget!

Provided you want the NAS for Music streaming and backup/general file storage a Synology 216j (or 118 or 218) will be perfectly adequate.  The only limitations you may encounter are with transcoding, but the simple answer is to just use WAVE files, the more complex answer is to use Minim Server).  The more powerful NAS drives are intended for use with multiple concurrent users (mote than 10) or for intensive jobs like transcoding video files; for music and domestic use, they simply aren't justified.

Or if you want to go even cheaper then google for Volumio. They’ll do you a pre-built Pi based player/streamer/renderer/whatever for just over £100. use with the rest of Huge’s kit and it’ll get you started for less than a grand!

And it does internet radio as well.

Also, if you have your own DAC then Volumio will do you a digital streamer.