Fancy Ethernet Cable-Experiment with the last 1 metre

The Lindy adapter is just a simple but solidly made plastic adapter. I have only used them to reduce the strain on the Ethernet socket and avoid a tight bend in the cable, but a while ago, there was a bit of a craze for using them to tweak your sound quality, and a number of people reported positive results. They cost less than £5, so there is little to lose by trying. 

Obsydian posted:

Thanks MIKEB, I guess a no so good idea then. 

They are a very good idea if (as I was) you are concerned with more than one ground/earth point on your LAN & I needed to isolate my NAS.    One ground/earth point on a LAN is considered best practice,  but in a domestic install & with all the ethernet ends off the same supply earth, it won't be a problem to be that concerned about.       The 90 degree angle can be useful in space restricted installs.  Problem with having one on a Naim streamer,  it does not fit unless the Naim's rear end is protruding out from the rack/shelf.

Obsydian posted:

Antonio1 posted:

Obsydian posted:

Kiwi cat posted:

Thanks Antonio. It is fun. Real Music have lent me the Chord Shawline and it sounds fabulous. Definitely better than C-Stream . Early days yet but it may be a keeper. Not far off its bigger brother the SSA and a fraction of the price!

STOP. Buy the Indigo or Signature.

As i guarantee (especially given how quick you got the Shawline) you will regret not aiming higher, then waste money in selling and upgrading cables.

Indigo is very old though and the Signature its replacement(?) cheaper and will also be dependent on technological progress going on in these areas I reckon.

 

Yes - but if you talk to Chord they will advise both similar and only the Sarum T exceeds them.

It all depends if you can resist the what IF urge.

But you seem to have a good dealer, ask to borrow the AQ also.

hi Obsydian,

I 've yet to contact Chord, thanks for the hint.

At present I'm quite satisfied with what I have and listen to ,unfortunately dealer doesn't do Wodka but my wine dealer does.

Finally this is a Kiwi Cat not commercial 3D and want to know more about his impressions ,those really bother me.

Antonio1 posted:

Obsydian posted:

Antonio1 posted:

Obsydian posted:

Kiwi cat posted:

Thanks Antonio. It is fun. Real Music have lent me the Chord Shawline and it sounds fabulous. Definitely better than C-Stream . Early days yet but it may be a keeper. Not far off its bigger brother the SSA and a fraction of the price!

STOP. Buy the Indigo or Signature.

As i guarantee (especially given how quick you got the Shawline) you will regret not aiming higher, then waste money in selling and upgrading cables.

Indigo is very old though and the Signature its replacement(?) cheaper and will also be dependent on technological progress going on in these areas I reckon.

 

Yes - but if you talk to Chord they will advise both similar and only the Sarum T exceeds them.

It all depends if you can resist the what IF urge.

But you seem to have a good dealer, ask to borrow the AQ also.

hi Obsydian,

I 've yet to contact Chord, thanks for the hint.

At present I'm quite satisfied with what I have and listen to ,unfortunately dealer doesn't do Wodka but my wine dealer does.

Finally this is a Kiwi Cat not commercial 3D and want to know more about his impressions ,those really bother me.

Hi Antonio

Sorry if my impressions bother you.

The original intent of my post was to remark on how a high spec (price) ethernet patch cable could make a significant difference to music quality, even if it was on the end of over 20m of more basic ethernet cable. It was something I was initially quite sceptical about. If I had the money I would have bought the Chord SSA there and then, such was the difference over the C-stream patch cable.

Since then I have had many suggestions about alternative ethernet cables that may offer better value. I thought I would try a few to see if this was the case. Unfortunately they can be quite difficult to source. For example it is hard to get an Audioquest Vodka cable in Wellington.

The Chord Shawline would probably be around the same price as the AQ Vodka. I have had it in situ the last couple of days, and initial impressions were favorable. I  have been hoping it would be so good that there would not need to shell out the extra money on the SSA. However I agree that it really is too soon to make a judgement. When I evaluated the Chord SSA I left it in place for a 10 days so,  then switched back to the C-stream, and it was immediately apparent that the music sounded more "closed in".

As a family doctor(GP) in the middle of winter here, I have been busy as a "one armed paper hanger", and have not had enough time to evaluate the  Shawline properly. I will report back after  have had a chance to live with it for longer and then switch back to C-stream, thus hoping to avoid the "placebo" effect.  This will no doubt be of some interest to other forum members who may be in a similar position to me.

 As Obsydian has mentioned it may be more logical for me to hold fire until I can afford the SSA cable. Time will tell.

Using C-Stream here and would also be interested re impressions of the Shawline Kiwi. Cheers

Chord C-Stream vs Chord Shawline Ethernet cable evaluation

This is my report on the 2 cables, which are acting as patch cables in the last meter before the streamer.

The Shawline is a useful improvement over the C-stream in my system, 272/555DR/250DR/Ovator400/Unitiserve.

The C-stream is a lovely cable, it conveys the rhythm and dynamics well. There is however a "soft fuzz" around the voices and instruments. The sound is rounder and less nuanced with the C-stream.

Switching to the Shawline gets rid of this round softness and replaces it with a dynamic clarity. There is a higher degree of separation  between the various instruments. There is more realism in the timbres of the instruments. The decay notes of a double base are more realistic. The is a greater degree of character in the human voice, more insight into the emotional state of the singer.

 Also more "slam" in drums and percussion and attack in leading notes. Wonderful stereo imaging and space. Really good.

Overall a very worthwhile improvement over the C-stream. It is not too far off the Chord SSA which is probably about 3x more expensive. Ultimately music does not flow quite as effortlessly compared with the SSA , perhaps not as quite as much transparency with the Shawline, but I am nitpicking. 

I think the Shawline  would be a worthwhile step up in any system, from the C-stream, even if it is the last meter as a patch cable. If I had to live with it forever I would be quite happy.

I will have difficulty giving it back. For most people this will be the only cable they will ever need. I will probably wait till I have the dosh for the SSA, for the reasons above.

Guys, clearly you having fun with your twisted pair cables here, have any of you considered rolling your own.. it’s not difficult to do... you can make your twists with a hand drill, and then separate out the pairs and you can choose cable threads  to suit. This has the potential of sounding the best for your setups and costing peanuts, and having the satisfaction that you have created something really first class for your system. Further if you use only Fast Ethernet duplex, you only need two twisted pairs which you run independently with quite a space between them and wrap foil screening around each run... all those issues of ‘crosstalk’ are effectively eliminated. There is no magic for a Fast Ethernet cable... it is essentially two twisted pair serial leads. (Gig e uses four pairs)

Simon-in-Suffolk posted:

Guys, clearly you having fun with your twisted pair cables here, have any of you considered rolling your own.. it’s not difficult to do... you can make your twists with a hand drill, and then separate out the pairs and you can choose cable threads  to suit. This has the potential of sounding the best for your setups and costing peanuts, and having the satisfaction that you have created something really first class for your system. Further if you use only Fast Ethernet duplex, you only need two twisted pairs which you run independently with quite a space between them and wrap foil screening around each run... all those issues of ‘crosstalk’ are effectively eliminated. There is no magic for a Fast Ethernet cable... it is essentially two twisted pair serial leads. (Gig e uses four pairs)

That sounds interesting Simon. Is there a YouTube video on this?

KC, a quick search found this 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?...eo&feature=share

And there are plenty of videos on wiring your own Ethernet plug connectors. Fast Ethernet only uses two pairs of wires 1/2 and 3/6, So in some bought cables 50% of it lies dormant and unused, not an issue perhaps when the cable is cheap, but with some of the eye watering prices mentioned around these parts it must be a bit beguiling.

Will this follow the same pattern as mains wiring? I’m looking forward to the first person to ask how to solder 10mm2 solid core twisted pairs into an RJ45....

Now that will put a strain on the Ethernet connector. 

also you might need some sort of heavy duty lathe rather than a hand drill to make twisted pair with 10mm2.....

So, Simon, to make a new shielded cable, do you buy a cheap Ethernet cable, stip off the plastic coating to get the 8 coated wires. Entwine 1 and 2 and 3 and 6 using the drill. Then wrap each of the 2 entwined cables with foil, then somehow get a plastic coating over these cables. Then using a crimping device to get an RJ45 at each end. Seems complex, the main bottlenecks for me would be what sort of foil does one use and how does one cover the foil shielded cables with a plastic coating, or am I missing something? Thanks by the way for taking the time to talk about this cable making, as coming from the biological sciences it is all very esoteric.

KC I suggest you start with 4 reels of different coloured 22awg  Kynar cable ... perhaps try copper, then silver plated copper to experiment. Don’t bother with the shield to start with.. as you are twisting each pair and also you may have some physical separation between the two twisted runs so shielding is less of an issue (shielding each pair  is more relevant here if you have a tight bundle of different pairs.. but you will only have two here not tightly pushed together) ..... you will need an Ethernet RJ45 crimp tool, but it’s good to have on of these anyway to cut pre bought cables to length.

Image of pinouts.

https://goo.gl/images/1tpR8x

 Shielding not important and twist rate not overly sensitive either...just keep a note for consistency ... so you can compare. I have not found twist rate  that critical for between 14 and 30 MHz... these are only going to be for a short run... and it’s a case of experimenting to see if you like what you hear.. you will have some successes and failures.. but you may be gobsmacked with your successes especially when you separate out the twisted pairs... a lot of the precision here from a datapoint of view is when you need to closely pack the cables...and/or have longer distances which won’t be the case here.

Yeah but what shielding,  individually pairs & overall screen or just overall screen,  then what material, alloy or copper foil & will foil plus braid be better for overall screen.    Then what about twist ratio - twists per cm -  what is the optimum for what MHz performance.  What about optimum twist ratio % difference between each pair to minimize XT.  What is optimum conductor size, construction & material,  any advantage with solid over stranded, or silver plated or solid & what about dielectric .......

...... ho hum,  might just stick with my fully optimised ready made 4x pair UTP wires. 

Sounds like a fun experiment that I’d try if I had the time. Might do one day. Till then I’m delighted that Meicord have done all the work for me 

Exactly.. it’s what ever  floats your boat... they point is you don’t have to spend a lot of money to get an outstanding outcome ... but just invest a bit of your own time instead to experiment... which if you think about it is similar to a lot of things in life.

OMG, and I though I was a bit of a nut building my own analogue interconnect cables!

Kiwi cat posted:

Chord C-Stream vs Chord Shawline Ethernet cable evaluation

This is my report on the 2 cables, which are acting as patch cables in the last meter before the streamer.

The Shawline is a useful improvement over the C-stream in my system, 272/555DR/250DR/Ovator400/Unitiserve.

The C-stream is a lovely cable, it conveys the rhythm and dynamics well. There is however a "soft fuzz" around the voices and instruments. The sound is rounder and less nuanced with the C-stream.

Switching to the Shawline gets rid of this round softness and replaces it with a dynamic clarity. There is a higher degree of separation  between the various instruments. There is more realism in the timbres of the instruments. The decay notes of a double base are more realistic. The is a greater degree of character in the human voice, more insight into the emotional state of the singer.

 Also more "slam" in drums and percussion and attack in leading notes. Wonderful stereo imaging and space. Really good.

Overall a very worthwhile improvement over the C-stream. It is not too far off the Chord SSA which is probably about 3x more expensive. Ultimately music does not flow quite as effortlessly compared with the SSA , perhaps not as quite as much transparency with the Shawline, but I am nitpicking. 

I think the Shawline  would be a worthwhile step up in any system, from the C-stream, even if it is the last meter as a patch cable. If I had to live with it forever I would be quite happy.

I will have difficulty giving it back. For most people this will be the only cable they will ever need. I will probably wait till I have the dosh for the SSA, for the reasons above.

 

 

Nice with-up Kiwi cat.

If anything I'm already listening to dynamic explosiveness in my set-up with c-stream in place. 

Not always ,I think, coping properly with upper mids raise which may be the culprit for letting highs overlap mids,sometimes . 

And bass can improved too here, I think.

Not really convinced a streaming cable swap would improve what I reckon an issue elsewhere.

But, who knows?

My dealer did a comparison of the full Chord range of streaming cables a few months ago in a high end system. Possibly not what Kiwi Cat wants to hear, but while SSA was excellent, Sarum T sounded stupidly good.  I also briefly tried both at home with a modest Atom and Totem system and thought there were similar relative improvements.

Bryce Curdy posted:

My dealer did a comparison of the full Chord range of streaming cables a few months ago in a high end system. Possibly not what Kiwi Cat wants to hear, but while SSA was excellent, Sarum T sounded stupidly good.  I also briefly tried both at home with a modest Atom and Totem system and thought there were similar relative improvements.

I agree. I heard the Atom with the Chord Music Ethernet cable the other day with SL speaker cables into Focal bookshelf speakers. Astounding clarity and holographic imaging in a humble system. It shows how good the Atom is.But at least the SSA is a kind of realistic aspiration. Sigh.

While Music was better than Sarum T, for me the improvement was relatively modest relative to a huge price jump. And I didn't think Epic was much better than Shawline either FWIW.

Epic to Signature was a really big improvement, but I nearly burst out laughing when Signature was replaced by Sarum T it was that good.

And like you pleasantly surprised that all of the above was easily heard with an Atom too. Not bought a Chord streaming cable yet, possibly because the thought of spending the same amount of money on a 1m cable as on the source just seems a bit obscene to my head, even though my ears and heart tell me otherwise.  And of course there's affordability and other priorities, and with no kids, but inheritance, savings and a good salary I know I'm very lucky in that respect. If you have nice kids you will no doubt feel differently!

Those ethernet cable demonstrations sound interesting. The next time someone is able to attend an event, would it be possible for them to ask the demonstrator to start the music and then disconnect the cable from the back of the device? The music will continue playing from the buffer. This procedure should be repeated for each ethernet cable demonstrated. I would be interested to learn which buffer they like the sound of most.

The Chord cables (Tuned Aray) add box upgrade type performance, others are just like tone controls and in comparison subtle.

Yes they are I think way overpriced, but at least they can stay in your system, so I see them as upgrades rather than tweaks.

Obsydian posted:

The Chord cables (Tuned Aray) add box upgrade type performance, others are just like tone controls and in comparison subtle.

Yes they are I think way overpriced, but at least they can stay in your system, so I see them as upgrades rather than tweaks.

Yes, that's my opinion about Chord streaming cables, and I'm still to splash the cash.  A box upgrade absolutely.  But for the record, I'm not saying that Chord are better than the alternative 'premium' cables because I've personally heard absolutely none of them.