Power amp choice. I need your thoughts

I don’t think Option 2/3 would do what a NAP200 does particularly as the DR functionality will materially improve the NAC 202.  A NAPSC will also really improve the NAC 202 whatever way you go.  

Regards,

Lindsay

Definitely 202 with 200dr, the 200dr is nearly as good as the hicap as a preamp supply (I did the demo with a 282 preamp). I don’t think option 3 is even possible. NAPSC is optional but worth adding as soon as you can

Take a look at the Supernait 2 as well. 

S-Plade posted:

I’m looking for a new amp and a Naim has been my dream for many years.

My Current system

Turntable: Rega RP8 with Ania MC cartridge

Riaa: Rega Aria

Amp: Rega Brio

Speakers: Audiovector SR3 Signature

(Impedace 8ohm / Sensitivity in 8ohm = 91.5db)

 

My room is 5X6 m2 and I play rock and pop music

 

My Rega Brio can easy drive my speakers and i use it between 8 and 10 o’clock. 

I love my Brio but it hums too much for me when the music i quiet. 

 

I’m pretty sure I’ll choose a NAC 202

 

But when it comes to power amp I’m not sure what to choose

 

Option 1

A normal choice would be a NAP 200 DR

 

Option 2

NAP 100 and then add a HICAP power supply for the preamp.

(is this possible or do I need a NAPSC as well?)

 

Option 3

Two NAP100 used as mono blocks

 

Does Option 2 and 3 make any sense? Please let me know what You think?

Thank

S-Plade

My dream was also to own Naim!

PRAT!

Pace, Rhythm, And Time!

But by all means, before you pull the trigger, check out a dozen or so post on Naim's dreaded Hum!

Doesn't cost you one red penny!

Meanwhile, Enjoy Your Music!

Allante93!

I'm with HH. Definitely have a listen to the SuperNait2. It's a great end point. With a 202, you're starting on an upgrade path.

When you say the Brio hums too much, is that through the speakers or direct from the amp itself? If the former, have you done checks to verify it is the amp itself, not earth issue or the source, which otherwise could remain if you change amp? And if the latter, be aware that Naim amps famously can sometimes be afflicted with hum from the transformer, as alluded to by Allante93, usually caused by a mains issue (DC on the mains, possibly from something else in the home, or in the incoming supply) and conceivably that could be the cause of your present hum with no certainty of improvement in changing amp.

I would be inclined to be check out the hum before changing amp because of it. That is not saying don’t change the amp for Naim anyway, just be aware that doing so might not cure the problem that seems to be triggering your wish to change.

As for which model, general advice is definitely make sure you audition to be sure the choice is right for you.

I had a NAC202/NAPSC/NAP150/FC2X for a while, and truly loved the combination, into KEF Q50s.  Sources were CD5X and Rega Planar3/Elys/Fono. 

NAP200 DR would be great; but a 150 or 150X at the right price could be a nice surprise, and super VFM.

NAP100 would not power the NAC; so you would require a FlatCap or HiCap; NAP150 and 200, cleverly, can power the NAC, if  keeping the box count lower matters to you. Relieving a NAP from powering the NAC often sounds better, I am told.  I have not tested, as I already had the FC2X when I got the 202.

Nick

I did have hum on all of my Naim gear, until I isolated it from everything touching CATV.  Not a big deal — easy to do with a $50 isolating-cable.

Nick

S-Plade posted:

. . .  

Option 2

NAP 100 and then add a HICAP power supply for the preamp.

(is this possible or do I need a NAPSC as well?)

. . .  

With NAC 202, NAPSC is always optional, relatively inexpensive, seemingly-universally recommended.

Any NAC will require a FlatCap, HiCap, or SuperCap if paired with a NAP 100.  Of recent amps, only the 150, 155, and 200 series can, if desired, power a NAC.  Better experts can identify some older amps that will do likewise; though, you did not ask.  

Nick

I think a used 282 for the price of a new 202 will give you a much better sound.

A 200DR would power the 282 too with the benefit of the DR circuits being felt by the 282.

Enjoy the ride.

A used Olive 82/HC/250 will cost less than £2,500 and if you are planning on buying new for the cost of a 202/200 you could buy a 82/SC/250 that amp serviced and in great condition will compete with anything below 252/250 from the Classic range and will make that RP8/Ania of yours sound exceptional.                                                                                                                        

Another no brainer for 202/200DR or SN2. Eventually add HC-DR. ????

Chag -

Having had the Brio-R home and compared it to a Nait -5si, I'd say that any integrated or combination of black boxes from Naim will outperform the Rega for speaker command and control. Any one of your proposed options ought to be an improvement to the Brio-R and seems you owe it to your RP8/Ania to get better amplification.

No disrespect to the Brio-R; it's a fantastic slim-line integrated with high VFM. It just can't hang with Naim's more costly entry-level offerings.

Ten years ago I had Rega Cursa and Maia with a CD5x/FC2x and a Townshend Rock mk2 with an iso. I auditioned a SN1 against a 202/200/NAPS  and took the 202/200/PSC home. My wife thought it wasn’t enough of an upgrade and suggested we try the next level so a 282/Hicap/250 came home, this won approval but I couldn’t afford it allin one go so did it piecemeal starting with the 282 powered off the FC2x. Several years later I reached 282/Hi/250 on Fraim lite but got sidetracked by a superline and an Aro on the way the first two times I went to buy a Hicap. Beyond the Cursa/Maia I made it a rule not to buy hifi on credit which I think has kept it fun.

I'm overwhelmed by all your fine answers and have been reading them with great interest. 

Thanks!!

hungryhalibut posted:

Take a look at the Supernait 2 as well. 

The SN2 could certainly be an option. 

Hence my current Hum problem I thought I'll be more safe to separate the pre and power. 

But maybe the bigger chassis in a SN2 vs the Brio is enough? 

I could also add a HiCap to the SN2 for the same money as a 200/202 combo.

Whether the amplifier is integrated or separate makes no difference to hum. If something is causing it you should address it - see the post by Innocent Bystander above. A dedicated mains arrangement often helps. If the hum is coming from the Rega itself, rather than the speakers, try switching off everything in the house and see if it stops. If the hum is coming through the speakers it’s very likely an earthing issue. 

Innocent Bystander posted:

When you say the Brio hums too much, is that through the speakers or direct from the amp itself? If the former, have you done checks to verify it is the amp itself, not earth issue or the source, which otherwise could remain if you change amp? And if the latter, be aware that Naim amps famously can sometimes be afflicted with hum from the transformer, as alluded to by Allante93, usually caused by a mains issue (DC on the mains, possibly from something else in the home, or in the incoming supply) and conceivably that could be the cause of your present hum with no certainty of improvement in changing amp.

I would be inclined to be check out the hum before changing amp because of it. That is not saying don’t change the amp for Naim anyway, just be aware that doing so might not cure the problem that seems to be triggering your wish to change.

As for which model, general advice is definitely make sure you audition to be sure the choice is right for you.

I have been talking with my dealer about this problem and the simple things has been testet without result.

The hum is through the speakers and I'm 99% sure it comes from the tranformer. If the amp is on without music the hum is at the same level volume at 9 or 3 o'clock. The small chassis might be the problem with the Brio. I did have a Cyrus III before without any problem. Same room and everything.

I'm looking for an amp upgrade and hopefully get rid of the hum. As you said "change the amp for Naim Anyway" 

Probably ....I would go for the SN2. What is your budget? If you went secondhand ... you might get a non DR 250 (1k) and perhaps if you pushed the boat out a second hand 272 (1.8k) .......... that would be awesome.....and would give a DR upgrade possibility on the 250.

Hum through the speakers is not the transformer. The same volume regardless of volume control setting points  to either an earth loop in connection to power amp, or poor shielding of the interconnect, or a fault/poor design in the power amp itself, or a fault/poor design in the output stage of the preamp, or a source of strong alternating magnetic field too close to the preamp output stage or power amp. Your relatively efficient speakers will accentuate it compared to many.

Have you tried disconnecting the interconnect from the power amp? If that doesn’t stop it, move any source of magnetic field from close to the power amp (e.g. if preamp is sitting on/under it - if it still continues it confirms the power amo and changing it should bring the end to the hum. If it is only there with the interconnect connected then most likely would be an earth loop, which should  cease with change of amps if Naim’s connection advicevis followed, or an insufficiently shielded  interconnect in which case the answer is either changing it, or re-routing it. 

NickSeattle posted:

I did have hum on all of my Naim gear, until I isolated it from everything touching CATV.  Not a big deal — easy to do with a $50 isolating-cable.

Nick

I'm not 100% sure I know what you mean?

My TV does gets power from the same power outlet but I don't have any cable tv only a ground antenna directly into the tv. 

Do you suggest a isolating-cable to the amp or tv?

A Isotek Evos3 Corvus is on my wish list

Innocent Bystander posted:

Hum through the speakers is not the transformer. The same volume regardless of volume control setting points  to either an earth loop in connection to power amp, or poor shielding of the interconnect, or a fault/poor design in the power amp itself, or a fault/poor design in the output stage of the preamp, or a source of strong alternating magnetic field too close to the preamp output stage or power amp. Your relatively efficient speakers will accentuate it compared to many.

Have you tried disconnecting the interconnect from the power amp? If that doesn’t stop it, move any source of magnetic field from close to the power amp (e.g. if preamp is sitting on/under it - if it still continues it confirms the power amo and changing it should bring the end to the hum. If it is only there with the interconnect connected then most likely would be an earth loop, which should  cease with change of amps if Naim’s connection advicevis followed, or an insufficiently shielded  interconnect in which case the answer is either changing it, or re-routing it. 

Sorry, twigged that the Aria is just a phono stage and Brio is inregrated, so no interconnect between pr and power - I had taken the Aria to be preamp. 

The things to try are disconnecting all input cables - if the hum stops, then an earth loop so ewhere. And if not physically move the preamp a couple of feet (inputs still disconnected) , and you could do that simply holding it while on - if it doesnt change then it does rather sound like the amp itself, but if it does change it suggests an electromagnetic field being picked up by the amp, which might affect other gear simply sitting where the Brio is, depending on how well shielded the other gear may be.

A few days ago from my dealer I listened a NAP200 with the Audiovector SR3.... great synergy........ so I'm thinking to buy a SR3 Signature for my Star

I would also start with a SuperNait2, perhaps add a HiCap DR at a later stage.

joerand posted:

Having had the Brio-R home and compared it to a Nait -5si, I'd say that any integrated or combination of black boxes from Naim will outperform the Rega for speaker command and control. Any one of your proposed options ought to be an improvement to the Brio-R and seems you owe it to your RP8/Ania to get better amplification.

No disrespect to the Brio-R; it's a fantastic slim-line integrated with high VFM. It just can't hang with Naim's more costly entry-level offerings.

Agree. Although Nap 100 is only worth using with pre s that don't need powering. Also, imo, Nac 202 nap 200 is better than SN 2. 282 is obviously no contest, and if you have no problem going SH, aim for 282, psu and 250dr.