Advice on Physical placement of a turntable

surely the answer is to put the fraim lite on the other side of the room (i.e. not between the speakers) with the TT and run longer speaker cables?

I used to find a wall shelf to be the best solution. Have had it both between speakers (with some 2m to each speaker) and opposite the speaker wall. Not much difference I'd say. 

For some years I had a concrete floor and put it on top of a rack for a while. Setting up the shelf again brought also here a (very marginal) improvement. 

Today though, the LP12 isn't used much, and the aesthetics of the wall shelf (or lack of!)  made my wife strongly suggest it to be taken down and I'm back to having the LP12 on top shelf of the rack... 

Depends on the turntable and the construction of the room. Concrete floor and plasterboard walls I'd put it on the Fraim whatever it is, with the solid walls and suspended floor of a mid 20th century british house I'd use a wall shelf for something like a Linn but with a Rock MK2 and then an Artemis SA-1 in a room like that I've got away with on the Fraim between NBLs with 2' to the nearesr speaker, a visiting Manticore Mantra (a poor man's Linn according to some) in the same position was bouncing all over the place whenever you walked past it but I never noticed feedback from the speakers even then (admittedly they were Thiel CS1.6s at the time).

Thanks for the feedback 

- Can’t put Fraim Lite on opposite wall as there is a radiator then a large vinyl storage cabinet 

- House was built in 1880 so stone walls and wooden floors 

- Anyone got views on viability of running a 25’ RCA cable from Phono Stage to preamp ? 

At 25’ I’d use RG6 cable.  I do this between NAC and Qute in different rooms.  Works well.

Nick

Terry 

your house is a similar age to mine 

as a rule of thumb the TT needs to be attached to something solid, in your case like mine it’s the wall

i do have a hearth but that’s used up by all the amps and PS’s

when I leave the smoke I will buy a house with the facility for me to build a dedicated HI-FI room and once again the TT will go on a solid wall in preference to the floor 

it is on a mana reference wall shelf

lyndon

There is no doubt that having your record player a good distance from the ‘speakers makes sense. However, my LP12 is only about 20cm from mine. Even at high volume it still sounds remarkably good and better than my CDS3. 

I have no realistic way of moving it, but it is not the disaster that I thought it would be. If you can get it a few metres away I suspect you will get 99% of its performance. What TT do you use?

Stu

AFAIK, the only realistic way to run a cable that distance would be to have balanced output on the phono stage into balanced input on your pre-amp, then run XLR cable in between. Not possible with a 252, so I'd exclude that option. I see 2-m often cited as the recommended limit to RCA cables for phono stages.

The intense sound you hear between your speakers is actually in your head rather than in your room, so centred between and a little way back from the speakers is actually not a bad place with relatively low spls. 

The main place to avoid are room corners where spls tend to increase due to increasingly high acoustic impedance caused by the 4 cojoining surfaces of floor, ceiling and 2 walls. 

Racks work well on solid floors, but may bounce a lot of floorboards. A wall shelf works well on solid walls, but again will tend to vibrate a lot in sympathy with more flimsy dividing walls, where the mounting surface is a few mm thick plaster board. 

Long runs of single ended cable ala RCA is not advised due to the noise long runs of cable are likely to pick up. As others have advised, balanced cables ala XLR have the ability to cancel noise so are highly desirable for longer distance connections. 

joerand posted:

AFAIK, the only realistic way to run a cable that distance would be to have balanced output on the phono stage into balanced input on your pre-amp, then run XLR cable in between. Not possible with a 252, so I'd exclude that option. I see 2-m often cited as the recommended limit to RCA cables for phono stages.

I agree this is common wisdom and best practice; and, in fact, it may be the primary reason balanced XLR exists.  But if XLR is not an option, I can attest that RCA-terminated RG-6 wire works extremely well, to the point that it is the best source into my Qute, even compared to its built-in FM and streamer.

As cheap as RG-6 is, it is worth a try, IMHO, between the phono amp and NAC, if there is no obvious alternative.  RG-6 is a bit bulky and stiff (not as bad as NACA5), and you need a separate piece for each channel are the only down-sides.

Nick

NickSeattle posted:

joerand posted:

AFAIK, the only realistic way to run a cable that distance would be to have balanced output on the phono stage into balanced input on your pre-amp, then run XLR cable in between. Not possible with a 252, so I'd exclude that option. I see 2-m often cited as the recommended limit to RCA cables for phono stages.

I agree this is common wisdom and best practice; and, in fact, it may be the primary reason balanced XLR exists.  But if XLR is not an option, I can attest that RCA-terminated RG-6 wire works extremely well, to the point that it is the best source into my Qute, even compared to its built-in FM and streamer.

As cheap as RG-6 is, it is worth a try, IMHO, between the phono amp and NAC, if there is no obvious alternative.  RG-6 is a bit bulky and stiff (not as bad as NACA5), and you need a separate piece for each channel are the only down-sides.

Nick

I would add that I would not expect a long run between the turntable and phono pre to be as successful.  Keep that one to 2-m max.

Nick

The new Ureka puts out a digital signal, that will do the distance. 

lyndon posted:

Terry 

your house is a similar age to mine 

as a rule of thumb the TT needs to be attached to something solid, in your case like mine it’s the wall

i do have a hearth but that’s used up by all the amps and PS’s

when I leave the smoke I will buy a house with the facility for me to build a dedicated HI-FI room and once again the TT will go on a solid wall in preference to the floor 

it is on a mana reference wall shelf

 

lyndon

 

Lyndon 

Thanks for the response - wall mounted turntable it is . 

Your reference to the fact you have amps & PS's on a hearth got me thinking . There are hearths in every room in the house but the one in my music room is taken up by the grate and fireplace that is there . But given carpets are up and builders are in should I take this opportunity to put in a solid floor platform for the hi fi stand , into the wooden floor ? If so is this just a slab of concrete or does it needs something more sophisticated ? 

stuart.ashen posted:

There is no doubt that having your record player a good distance from the ‘speakers makes sense. However, my LP12 is only about 20cm from mine. Even at high volume it still sounds remarkably good and better than my CDS3. 

I have no realistic way of moving it, but it is not the disaster that I thought it would be. If you can get it a few metres away I suspect you will get 99% of its performance. What TT do you use?

Stu

Stu 

Thanks for the response. I doubt I can get to a few meters but I think I can get to 1m+ . My TT is a Michell GyroDec with a Lyra Delos Cartridge 

I think it’s worth a try even 1m away Terry, see how it goes. I accept that it is sub optimal, but by how much? I have a solid floor which I consider a bigger factor than distance from speakers. Just my opinion of course. Will put a photo below to show what I mean.

Stu