ND555 Impressions
Posted by: Bert Schurink on 26 July 2018
The Beast will arrive and will be installed tomorrow morning in my system. So I thought it was a good moment to open up a thread with the fist experiences, also giving others the possibility to share their first impressions with the beast.
I feeel a bit like a little child who has his birthday tomorrow. I assume that even while it will be nice weather during the weekend that I will be a spending a lot of hours with my system.
And as expected my car will not arrive before the ND555.
How much is enough? When is the system good enough? Where does the incremental benefit not justify the additional costs? All good questions and very dependent on circumstances, tastes, priorities etc.
ive just upgraded to a Core/Nova/Totem Forest Signatures and are very happy even before the full burn in. A notably “better” component system would be 4 to 5 times the cost, and is beyond what I would be prepared to pay, even if I could afford it.
Having said that, I’m an engineer and love this sort of stuff, so delighted that there is something for everyone to enjoy that works for them.
dave marshall posted:Alley Cat posted:(edit)
sometimes I ask myself if it's better to 'go the whole hog' without interim steps when you know that's what you aspire to.
I do tend to agree with that strategy ............. but it only holds good until such time as Naim decide to launch some new kit which eclipses one's previously "top of the range" streamer .................... "disgruntled of North Yorks." ............ owner of a now obsolete and completely "broken" NDS.
Oh, the shame of it!
I’ll take it off your hands Dave, as a purely friendly gesture to save your blushes.
Alley Cat posted:Sounsfaber posted:Here’s one from left field. I would love to A/B this new nd555 with a cds2 for share musical enjoyment/fun/pRat. I gues the nd55its going to be the winning but at a new car price difference winner? I think Naim Audio have had it very good for a very very long time.
Just in a county where £30,000 is average yearly income and these get picked like a six pack of beer.
oh I’m glad and happy such a thing exists but how much better than a cds2/555ps. Is it really worth it really?
I know people work hard to be at that level, I have no envy only respect. It blows me away to read a form thread like this.
Sorry if you feel I crashed the thread apologies.
Respect
Nice post. The cost of these things is sobering.
20 years ago with a high-specced LP12, and active SBLs I thought I'd pretty much reached the peak of my hi-fi journey. Even with inflation I suspect many of those older items are small change compared to current high-end Naim gear let alone Statement level gear.
I once recall joking the diamond on my LP12's MC cartridge probably cost more than the one I'd bought my partner! This is no longer true I am pleased to say.
I'm fairly sure I could finance an ND 555 and required power supplies, but my older ancillary equipment would probably let it down, but sometimes I ask myself if it's better to 'go the whole hog' without interim steps when you know that's what you aspire to. Equally, would I be better going for 'silly money' LP12 upgrades I'd previously dismissed, but when you have a large vinyl collection and have never really been bowled over by CD or digital audio......
I also wonder how life might have been different had I not spent so much of my disposable income on hobbies - hi-fi, cameras, computers/gadgets since I had a regular wage.
With regard to the last comment, yes the new streamer may be the price of a car, but I've never been that bothered by cars - if it gets me from A to B I'm happy (unfortunately current car is failing so even A to B is doubtful!).
So while some of us may spend our disposable income or credit allowances on dreams, as you get older you really do realise you're only here once, and if something ticks the boxes and provides unsurpassed pleasure and enjoyment perhaps it's money well spent.....
Another edit, but am I alone in wondering why music has such a profound effect on so many of us, but we are ultimately a minority who strive for excellent audio quality - do we enjoy it more or just differently?
Alley Cat, your post could have been written by me, except the part where you gladly admit it's no longer the case that an LP12 cartridge costs more than your partner's diamond ring. My Kandid cart cost way more than SWMBO's damond ring (luckily she doesn't read this forum).
I'm rather suspecting that I'm not the only one who has followed the path in life that you have done... after all, it was a very understandable one. I have to say, though, that I applaud you for committing it to the internet; the effect is that many of us who wondered about our past sanity are now relieved to learn we are not alone
rjstaines posted:Alley Cat posted:Sounsfaber posted:Here’s one from left field. I would love to A/B this new nd555 with a cds2 for share musical enjoyment/fun/pRat. I gues the nd55its going to be the winning but at a new car price difference winner? I think Naim Audio have had it very good for a very very long time.
Just in a county where £30,000 is average yearly income and these get picked like a six pack of beer.
oh I’m glad and happy such a thing exists but how much better than a cds2/555ps. Is it really worth it really?
I know people work hard to be at that level, I have no envy only respect. It blows me away to read a form thread like this.
Sorry if you feel I crashed the thread apologies.
Respect
Nice post. The cost of these things is sobering.
20 years ago with a high-specced LP12, and active SBLs I thought I'd pretty much reached the peak of my hi-fi journey. Even with inflation I suspect many of those older items are small change compared to current high-end Naim gear let alone Statement level gear.
I once recall joking the diamond on my LP12's MC cartridge probably cost more than the one I'd bought my partner! This is no longer true I am pleased to say.
I'm fairly sure I could finance an ND 555 and required power supplies, but my older ancillary equipment would probably let it down, but sometimes I ask myself if it's better to 'go the whole hog' without interim steps when you know that's what you aspire to. Equally, would I be better going for 'silly money' LP12 upgrades I'd previously dismissed, but when you have a large vinyl collection and have never really been bowled over by CD or digital audio......
I also wonder how life might have been different had I not spent so much of my disposable income on hobbies - hi-fi, cameras, computers/gadgets since I had a regular wage.
With regard to the last comment, yes the new streamer may be the price of a car, but I've never been that bothered by cars - if it gets me from A to B I'm happy (unfortunately current car is failing so even A to B is doubtful!).
So while some of us may spend our disposable income or credit allowances on dreams, as you get older you really do realise you're only here once, and if something ticks the boxes and provides unsurpassed pleasure and enjoyment perhaps it's money well spent.....
Another edit, but am I alone in wondering why music has such a profound effect on so many of us, but we are ultimately a minority who strive for excellent audio quality - do we enjoy it more or just differently?
Alley Cat, your post could have been written by me, except the part where you gladly admit it's no longer the case that an LP12 cartridge costs more than your partner's diamond ring. My Kandid cart cost way more than SWMBO's damond ring (luckily she doesn't read this forum).
I'm rather suspecting that I'm not the only one who has followed the path in life that you have done... after all, it was a very understandable one. I have to say, though, that I applaud you for committing it to the internet; the effect is that many of us who wondered about our past sanity are now relieved to learn we are not alone
I have a plan - now all I need to do is find a cheap cubic zirconia lookalike, sell the Tiffany ring and I'll have the new streamer before anyone notices
Thanks to all for your informative and helpful positive feedback. Your efforts to share it with the rest of the forum are very genuinely appreciated. However, I still hate you all ..
Good job I’m currently fully enraptured by rediscovering my Vinyl !
kevin J Carden posted:Thanks to all for your informative and helpful positive feedback. Your efforts to share it with the rest of the forum are very genuinely appreciated. However, I still hate you all ..
Good job I’m currently fully enraptured by rediscovering my Vinyl !
I'd waited a long time for a Naim streamer/digital player and thought the new Unit all in ones were the answer. Atom was great and well worth more than the outlay. Nova in a different league and probably exceptional value if you want an all-in-one, trouble is I wanted to use my old Naim gear (NAP 250's etc).
The huge change - getting all my LP12 bits out of storage - I'm hooked on vinyl in a way I've not been in the last 5-10 years and it sounds superb via the Nova's digitised analogue input.
Must say, it's getting rather lonely here in the NDS Retirement Village.
Hook posted:Must say, it's getting rather lonely here in the NDS Retirement Village.
Yes, I too am in the NDS retirement home. Indeed, I asked the nurse why she puts Viagra in our Horlicks. Apparently it stops us rolling out of bed at night.
Nighty, night.
nigelb posted:Hook posted:Must say, it's getting rather lonely here in the NDS Retirement Village.
Yes, I too am in the NDS retirement home. Indeed, I asked the nurse why she puts Viagra in our Horlicks. Apparently it stops us rolling out of bed at night.
Nighty, night.
Is there some kind of staff to stiffy ratio in operation?
All I know is that it now takes 3 viagra to stop me rolling out of bed these days.
Enough of this. Great work Bert and Dave and keep the updates coming. Thanks also to those who have had loaner ND555s for their impressions (Harry, Michael). Fascinating stuff.
Has anyone listened to an ND555 using Roon ?
I'm still happily living in the retirement village. If not for much longer.
Back with the NDS tonight, and it doesn't sound any worse than it did before I heard the ND555.
I think there is a big difference between one 555ps and two 555ps on nd555.
I’m so so curious.
ken c posted:to all those guys who have just bought an ND555, i hate you all, but please ignore me and ...
enjoy
ken
Resistance is futile! I’m listening to it right now and I’ll listen again to my NDS before making the call, but it is impossible to unhear what has already been heard.
I certainly appreciate the innovation that this level of kit brings to the market. I’m also very happy to read that the ND555 has a forward presentation, dear I say like pre DR days? I’ve found to my ears first generation DR gave more of a hifi sound (look I’m sorry if I’ve got it wrong, but that’s how I feel) I’m stuck back in the dark ages of nac52 sl2 135 cds2 oh and phased mana????I just love this old dinosaur kit. Not a power line in sight either.
I’m lucky enough to be in a position that I could get one but it would take more than 3 Viagra to persuade my wife (getting a ND555 silly)
Thanks to the OP for this thread. Isn’t it one of life’s wonderful things that we all have something to look forward to no matter how many years it may take!
I own the ND555 now for a week. I haven’t had huge running in bumps, just small ones. And it more or less sounded great from the beginning. I have no regrets whatsoever that I got. Everything sounds so much better, that I couldn’t imagine going back to the NDS, after a week of ND555 treatment it would start to sound broken....., while in real reference it doesn’t sound broken. It’s difficult to imagine that it would be possible to built a significantly better streamer than the ND555. While some of you would argue that the ND555 uses partly some old components.
New old stock valves are of great interest in some circles, now we have NOS DAC chips too. They don’t make ‘m like they used to.
Bert...this streamer is all new ... it's a development from lessons learnt with a sprinkling of the latest tech but rooted in what naim believes is currently the best approach ....ie the venerable selected ladder dac. Enjoy I am sure it will get better and better.... The boards are all new with improved earth and power supply points for max separation in one box. The next development would be NDStatement.....with 2 boxes one digital and one analogue....Ha ha wait and see....
Actually it would be 3 boxes inc 555ps or even 4 yikes....with 2 x 555ps....
Well, the ND555 was duly delivered on Friday afternoon, having been previously put through its paces and further run in by Harry and Helen. Unfortunately I didn't get to do the comparison with the LP12 as I had to remove the Radikal to make space for the ND555. The set-up was far from optimal, with the ND555 sitting directly above a PS500, but if that adversely affected the sound it wasn't at all apparent. Nor was the fact that I was unable to turn the display off as I didn't have the remote. But if I was hearing it in sub optimal conditions then things can only get better. Even from switch on, it was immediately apparent that this machine is a significant advance on the NDS.
I was able to experience it through my NAC552DR and the NAP500DR which I've had on loan from HQ for a few weeks to allow me to decide whether to do the DR upgrade or trade in the NDS for the new machine. Speakers were my trusty NBLs. (The NAP500 upgrade is now already booked in!)
I get why people are talking about the soundstage - this unit has great imagery and on many tracks the speakers just disappear. It is really easy to separate the instruments, which sound more natural than I've heard before from any digital source including the CD555. There is noticeably less background noise, suggesting that the notes decay properly to a lower level before the rise of the next. I suppose the HiFi term is lower noise floor.
Something I've noticed before with significant upgrades is how it feels as if the music is being slowed down - and that was my first impression, as though the music was being stretched to allow the rests between notes to be fully heard.
I played a variety of music from my collection (see below), generally picking favourite tracks here and there just to see how it handles them. I had expected the Mahavishnu track to throw it off balance owing to the density of the mix, but it handled it and dissected it with ease - better than I've ever heard it before. Have I ever heard it before?!
Some have mentioned brightness, which I can't say I really encountered. That said, I did find sibilance on Natalie Merchant's voice in Motherland, together with a boomy bass which I don't recall previously. I will have to check that when I swap back to the NDS. It may well be the recording.
On JC's Mr P.C. I was aware just how easy it was to follow Paul Chambers' double bass even when the leader was belting it out on tenor. And cymbals really sound like cymbals!
My concluding comment and for me the most important thing to say about this streamer is just how real it sounds. Splendid!
Music played:
Bill Evans - Waltz for Debby - My Foolish Heart, Waltz for Debby
Natalie Merchant - Motherland
Hank Mobley - Peckin' Time - I had intended only to play one track, but ended up listening to the whole album, which was sounding so realistic.
Jennifer Warnes - Famous Blue Raincoat
Mahavishnu Orchestra - Inner Mounting Flame - Noonward Race
Johnny Cash - Help Me
Pat Metheny Group - Offramp - Are You Going With Me?
Emily Remler - East to Wes - Softly as in a Morning Sunrise
Charlie Haden, Pat Metheny - Beyond the Missouri Sky - The Moon is a Harsh Mistress
Charlie Haden, John Taylor - Nightfall
Fairport Convention - Unhalfbricking - Genesis Hall, Percy's Song
Fairport Convention - Liege and Leaf - complete album
Fotheringay - Nothing More
Yes - TFTO
Norma Waterson - The Very Thought of You - Al Bowlly's In Heaven, Riverman, on Friday He's Fred Astaire
Dianne Reeves - I Remember - I Remember Sky
Chopin Piano Concerto No. 1 - Maria João Pires
Mozart Piano Concerto No. 2 in F major K280 - Mitsuko Uchida
Miles Davis - Seven Steps to Heaven - Joshua
Bessie Smith - Nobody Knows You When You're Down and Out
John Coltrane - Crescent
John Coltrane - Giant Steps - Mr P.C.
Finally, thanks to Audience for making it possible.
Most eloquent and informative Clive. Thank you.
Most of your impressions ring true here also. A remarkable player.
"Have I ever heard it before?!" Yeah, we had a bit of that on Wednesday and Thursday.
Alley Cat posted:rjstaines posted:Alley Cat posted:Alley Cat, your post could have been written by me, except the part where you gladly admit it's no longer the case that an LP12 cartridge costs more than your partner's diamond ring. My Kandid cart cost way more than SWMBO's damond ring (luckily she doesn't read this forum).
I'm rather suspecting that I'm not the only one who has followed the path in life that you have done... after all, it was a very understandable one. I have to say, though, that I applaud you for committing it to the internet; the effect is that many of us who wondered about our past sanity are now relieved to learn we are not alone
I have a plan - now all I need to do is find a cheap cubic zirconia lookalike, sell the Tiffany ring and I'll have the new streamer before anyone notices
Alley Cat, you are sooo close to home, it's scary ! This is one of the sins that will be read out to me by Saint Peter when I reach the Pearly Gates.
Just for clarification, though, this particular sin was committed a very long time ago, even before Julian became interested in electronics. My moral compass is since much improved.
rjstaines posted:Alley Cat posted:rjstaines posted:Alley Cat posted:Alley Cat, your post could have been written by me, except the part where you gladly admit it's no longer the case that an LP12 cartridge costs more than your partner's diamond ring. My Kandid cart cost way more than SWMBO's damond ring (luckily she doesn't read this forum).
I'm rather suspecting that I'm not the only one who has followed the path in life that you have done... after all, it was a very understandable one. I have to say, though, that I applaud you for committing it to the internet; the effect is that many of us who wondered about our past sanity are now relieved to learn we are not alone
I have a plan - now all I need to do is find a cheap cubic zirconia lookalike, sell the Tiffany ring and I'll have the new streamer before anyone notices
Alley Cat, you are sooo close to home, it's scary ! This is one of the sins that will be read out to me by Saint Peter when I reach the Pearly Gates.
Just for clarification, though, this particular sin was committed a very long time ago, even before Julian became interested in electronics. My moral compass is since much improved.
I'm only joking of course
Alley Cat posted:rjstaines posted:Alley Cat posted:rjstaines posted:Alley Cat posted:Alley Cat, your post could have been written by me, except the part where you gladly admit it's no longer the case that an LP12 cartridge costs more than your partner's diamond ring. My Kandid cart cost way more than SWMBO's damond ring (luckily she doesn't read this forum).
I'm rather suspecting that I'm not the only one who has followed the path in life that you have done... after all, it was a very understandable one. I have to say, though, that I applaud you for committing it to the internet; the effect is that many of us who wondered about our past sanity are now relieved to learn we are not alone
I have a plan - now all I need to do is find a cheap cubic zirconia lookalike, sell the Tiffany ring and I'll have the new streamer before anyone notices
Alley Cat, you are sooo close to home, it's scary ! This is one of the sins that will be read out to me by Saint Peter when I reach the Pearly Gates.
Just for clarification, though, this particular sin was committed a very long time ago, even before Julian became interested in electronics. My moral compass is since much improved.
I'm only joking of course
Ooops !
I can imagine the scene... the dearly beloved, keen to show an interest in our hobby takes a quick look through the forum to help her understand what drives our passions... later that evening... the 1.5 carat 'diamond' ring she's been proudly showing to her mates for years gets shoved where the sun doesn't shine!!!