Broadband contract about to expire

I’ve had reasonably good service from Sky, so have stuck with them for the last few years. I have always used my own hardware to run my LAN, though, so your own network is immune from issues with whatever useless piece of junk your ISP might supply, as long as it provides an internet connection. 

Yes, a third party router is a possibility (at extra cost though...)

Are you sure you have to pay £65 to  get the HH6?   When I upgraded to superfast or whatever they call these days it I just paid the P&P

Mike - I asked today and the department I got through to could only offer HH5. even after the ‘let me check with my manager’ rigmarole.

I might call again and tell them I’m leaving and see if another department can do better. 

I have always stuck with Sky now Fibre 70MB, Virgin had a disastrous month without any broadband as they now hire their cable channels to talk talk and guess what when installing their cable the messed up a few Virgin lines, which meant waiting 6 weeks to get a whole new cable installed (as in road to house) !!!

The HH5 should be up to the job if your only complaint with BT is them not giving you the HH6. I’ve found them very reliable in the 2years I’ve been with them - no speed reductions and no line drops (though I use a Netgear D6400, not Home Hub). You don’t say whether you use (or want to) Ethernet or Wi-Fi  for the NDX or how far from the router it or you will be (if you know).

I would advise against Talk Talk from the way they treated friends and would only recommend Sky if you want their TV. Their routers really aren’t all that good, and only have 2 Ethernet ports I believe on their new router and only 100M on their old ones - ok for streaming but file copying becomes a very slow process.

nickpeacock posted:

Mike - I asked today and the department I got through to could only offer HH5. even after the ‘let me check with my manager’ rigmarole.

I might call again and tell them I’m leaving and see if another department can do better. 

A phone call & discuss what they can do to persuade you to stay might work.   I spoke to 0800 587 7216 when I needed special deal on a cable fault,  they gave me a free engineer visit.  

Thanks Mike - will do.

TallGuy posted:

The HH5 should be up to the job if your only complaint with BT is them not giving you the HH6. I’ve found them very reliable in the 2years I’ve been with them - no speed reductions and no line drops (though I use a Netgear D6400, not Home Hub). You don’t say whether you use (or want to) Ethernet or Wi-Fi  for the NDX or how far from the router it or you will be (if you know).

I would advise against Talk Talk from the way they treated friends and would only recommend Sky if you want their TV. Their routers really aren’t all that good, and only have 2 Ethernet ports I believe on their new router and only 100M on their old ones - ok for streaming but file copying becomes a very slow process.

Thanks Tallguy.

(NDX is hardwired via a switch, so ports aren’t a problem.)

Suggest that you look at Martin Lewis website. They also include customer satisfaction and customer service in their ratings. 

In central London you are probably spoilt for choice... you know with BT your backhaul almost certainly will not be too congested it at all, where with some other ISP this may definitely not be the case.. you kind of pay for you get here (remember this is nothing to with so called Broadband ‘speed’). Also with BT you can get engineering stats against your number to stop you being fobbed off too much. Put you BT number into

https://www.btwholesale.com/in...ws_furls_adslchecker

And you can see expected sync speeds, and also your twisted pair is regaurly checked and it will show up if there is a fault affecting performance in your home wiring. For me this kind of clear service infrastructure support would be important with an ISP.

As far as HH5 or 6, if you definitely want a 6 I’m sure they, BT ,can sort something out especially if you threaten to leave... but when you say ‘fibre’ I assume you mean FTTC VDSL (Superfast) .. and from various anecdotal musings on the web, the HH5 modem performs slightly better than the HH6 in this regard .so you might get a slightly higher sync speed staying with the HH5

As Mike outlines, it doesn't seem easy to get access to BT's 'Retentions Team' (or similar). Last year (c.Nov) when I did, having been told by the initial call-centre contact their offer was the best they could do, the person in the 'RT' asked if I wanted to raise a complaint on why I didn't get referred earlier!

IIRC, it was only when I'd signed up for PlusNet and was within the 14-day 'cooling off' period (with BT advised of the intended switch), did BT open the door to the RT.

The RT couldn't offer me a new HH, even though mine is now getting on (and well-depreciated). However, they suggested I give it a month and then report a fault!  

Unfortunately, the 'deal' the RT agreed (BB/Home phone/Moby/BT Sport HD) has caused havoc through their billing system - my bill read like a double-glazing salesman's quote, with discounts applying galore. After another hour on the 'phone in February, they advance refunded the discounted elements to sort the mess out....I think the person I spoke to gave-up and we agreed some figures just to close matters off, matters not helped as the services had different contracted start dates.

..am awaiting the renewal in Nov-18 with trepidation. 

Possibly because PlusNet is BT.. and it’s not as smooth going from one part of BT to another.. as opposed to moving between different ISPs perhaps.

The HH5 is pretty good for what it is. We went to Infinity and got a HH6. After many years of patchy but OK service, BT really dropped the ball when we went to Infinity.  A classic overpromise and under deliver money making model. Like insurance, it seems that the best way of getting the best deals is to move around on a fairly regular basis. Loyalty tends to be penalised. With Plusnet now. Same speeds, less than a third of the cost. And their hardware, whilst being brittle and basic in design, does the job just fine.

SiS -

It was a very strange experience and other members of my family went to PlusNet around the same time. 'twas all very odd. I have an idea core-BT were draining customers around this time as their pricings had become disconnected to others. I had a surreal experience where I was reading & educating them of the detailing of the offers per BT's adverts in the papers of that day. Wouldn't be the first time, a marketing/sales team hadn't communicated with the client-facing teams.

What seemed to befuddle them (BT and PlusNet) the most is my BT Sports HD package via Sky, noting the pricing was set to increase in early 2018 and because of the HD element, has various pricing components in the way they bill for it - I agreed a 'cheap' fixed price 12m deal on this which, IIRC, was what was being touted to new customers per the adverts for their 'Black Friday' deals. 

One thing  -  be very mindful of any confirmation e-mail they send, as the format and language used in mind, left plenty of room for ambiguity around the precise terms and costs agreed. When I had to review the errant billing in February, I suggested they listen to the 'taped' c.45 min call in November, which they declined. 

If you are a little concerned regarding how well the HH6 performs against some other hub/routers then you may want to read the latest PC Pro magazine issue 288 (hopefully it is allowed to name the magazine just not detail the findings in detail) where there is a an article that compares quite a few both ISP provided and some 3rd party offerings.

Personally I have used a HH6 since it came out and have not been disappointed with its performance. 

BT are probably the biggest shower of sh*t on the planet.

That’s what I like about this forum, really well considered and constructive comment 

If you  and your family are in the UK you are probably dependent  on BT and I suspect probably a few other companies you might despise, for you for your familit’s health, security, ability to fly in and out of the UK, sail safely around the UK shores, much UK core internet and mobile infrastructure   and many other things  you probably have no idea of at all (there is massively more to these companies than just their consumer retail organisations).... just think about all the men and women who work tirelessly to support this for you and your fellow citizens before you slag them off....

That may be so Simon, but to most people their dealings with BT are via their Retail arm, hence the rather dim view of BT. BT may have world class infrastructure and engineering, unfortunately the same can't be said for their customer service and general unhelpful attitude (which seems to be the same with most companies these days)

JAMES N , very much agreed I was with BT for several years my private mobile was with Orange which then changed to EE.

EE offered a very attractive Broadband package and after being with them for over three years you realise how poor the Customer support from BT was in my experience dealing with EE is like a breath of fresher.

Pcd posted:

JAMES N , very much agreed I was with BT for several years my private mobile was with Orange which then changed to EE.

EE offered a very attractive Broadband package and after being with them for over three years you realise how poor the Customer support from BT was in my experience dealing with EE is like a breath of fresher.

Never had an issue with BT customer service - perhaps I've been lucky, but I suspect they wouldn't have so many customers if they were that bad.

You do know BT own EE don't you ? Do they share customer services (yet) ?

[I don't work for BT]

james n posted:

That may be so Simon, but to most people their dealings with BT are via their Retail arm, hence the rather dim view of BT. BT may have world class infrastructure and engineering, unfortunately the same can't be said for their customer service and general unhelpful attitude (which seems to be the same with most companies these days)

Sadly, I think you are right, BT generally charge more than the competition, and however much they justify that by claiming that they develop and maintain the infrastructure, that is now largely the responsibility of the separated Open Reach. When people pay a premium, they tend to expect good service, and BT have not done a good job in this area. 

TallGuy posted:

Pcd posted:

JAMES N , very much agreed I was with BT for several years my private mobile was with Orange which then changed to EE.

EE offered a very attractive Broadband package and after being with them for over three years you realise how poor the Customer support from BT was in my experience dealing with EE is like a breath of fresher.

Never had an issue with BT customer service - perhaps I've been lucky, but I suspect they wouldn't have so many customers if they were that bad.

You do know BT own EE don't you ? Do they share customer services (yet) ?

Yes, I  know BT own EE but you deal with EE direct you would have thought that being the same company that you would get the same level of customer service from both but I did not experience that.

If they do integrate customer services and it drops to the quality of the support I had from BT then I will off to pastures new.

Pcd posted:

JAMES N , very much agreed I was with BT for several years my private mobile was with Orange which then changed to EE.

EE offered a very attractive Broadband package and after being with them for over three years you realise how poor the Customer support from BT was in my experience dealing with EE is like a breath of fresher.

There's another way of realising it. Your router dies, you try everything. You roll out the back up router and start Googling. Having established  that ringing BT won't be a waste of their time, you ring. And sit through god knows how many messages and menus. You go into a queue. You get bombarded with a mixture of bloody awful muzac for 45 minutes while they tell you how important your call is and suggest you check their website for your enquiry (like you haven't already).  You then get someone who you can't understand, on a poor quality line, running through a script. Or at least, probably running through a script because you can only make out every third word.

All in, I was paying nearly £100 a month for that crap. I'm not now.

ChrisSU posted

Sadly, I think you are right, BT generally charge more than the competition, and however much they justify that by claiming that they develop and maintain the infrastructure, that is now largely the responsibility of the separated Open Reach. When people pay a premium, they tend to expect good service, and BT have not done a good job in this area. 

Chris, much of the research and development and innovation used by Openreach is of course developed by BT, as is the case for all its subsidiaries. Sure some may have had less than ideal customer experiences from that company as well as others, but I’d be surprised if that company along with any other company has not been very much addressing that. My point is there is massively  more to a core company like BT, than it’s retail consumer wings such as BT Retail, Plusnet etc, and as such some of our UK critical infrastructure is maintained by that company as well others .. as always the engineers and scientists that keep our country safe and operating in this modern world are faceless and forgotten and become the target of a lazy disparaging comment. I used to work for Sky, and I know how demoralising it can be for some when gross generealisations are made from the experiences of some from a particular part of the company. 

I guess being an engineer that has a responsibility in some small part for some of our nation’s infrastructure, please forgive my sensitivity on this, especially as I see how many people /engineers in many companies put personal commitment beyond the call of duty into looking after us all.. and moving back to consumer we in the UK have one of the best if not the best mobile data infrastructure for broadband in the world, thanks to BT, Vodafone, Telefonica and others....