Uniti Core + Netgear Powerline

Hi David - The advice you have had from Naim is good and should be heeded. Powerline adapters (Ethernet over the mains) use the mains wiring to extend your network. The way these devices work creates extra noise on the mains supply which can cause a degradation in the performance of your audio system. From a networking perspective, they can also cause issues with throughput and reliability of connection due to the signal being affected by other 'noisy' devices sitting on your mains wiring (noisy LED lights etc). 

To ensure best performance a wired Ethernet connection is preferred and is likely to cause you less problems in the long run. 

James

powerlines will probably work but they will also likely either impact SQ for the worse, or you will introduce network issues especially with streaming wirelessly.  If you are unlucky you can create many problems with the naim app not caused by the app or the Naim gear, but caused by the powerlines. You  may also be lucky and everything will work as before, but only time can tell what will happen in your system.

Claus

When I first got a UnitiQute2 I too used a Powerline a BT one I think and it worked perfectly ok but after reading this forum I bought 20 metres of cat 5 which is very cheap and ran it from my router downstairs to the Qute upstairs.

I did need a couple of holes drilled and also about a million cable clips but I did manage to hide it quite well and yes it did make a difference. So I would make the effort it is worth it.

IMO use whats suitable for your home and environment. If you cant fit cable and cant use wirleess tech then use them I did for quite some time. Only you will tell if its detrimental to your system not anybody else, so if this is your only option then try it and see they are not expensive to at least try, I would advise against the higher rate ones and stick with av500/600 f I found the av1200 to cause problems with my phono stage the others did not. But if you can, using a wireless mesh system such as the one from BT,Google or Netgear could work better overall and give you a bridged  wired connection out of them to the core and you nova. 

You will, in any case, need an Ethernet switch to give both your Core and Nova a network connection. The cheapest and best way to connect this to the router is by an Ethernet cable. Yes, it can be awkward to run the cable to a different room, but even if you pay someone to run the cable for you, it is pretty cheap. If you’re not prepared to do that, there are some pretty decent wireless options, such as the Mesh devices. Connect one to your router and another to the switch linking your audio gear, and you’re done. Powerline adapters are another option, but I too would agree with Naim’s advice and avoid them. 

Long and short is you need to get an Ethernet lead from the router to your hifi. In my experience in my own home and helping out others is there is *always* a way to achieve this.

if you do it yourself it costs pence as well, unless you believe the hype regarding hifi Ethernet leads, my advice is don’t believe the hype.

David W posted:

 

I put the above issue to the Naim Support Team and asked for advice on the use of a Netgear Powerline to resolve the issue, I received the following short and entirely unhelpful reply:

"Thank you for your email, unfortunately we do not advise to use any powerline adapters with the system." 

That advice couldn’t have been more helpful, honest and emphatic. Powerline devices work by injecting many many  RF voltages over your mains. This conducts as well as radiates and effectively screws up and undermines all the goodness and careful preciosion Naim and any other high end electronics manufacturer put into their products to allow them to sound as good as they do.

Further these devices don’t offer true Ethernet end to end connectivity but are a kludge to provide a kind of Ethernet bridge. This will almost certainly interfere with the streamers and discovery with respect to consistent reliable operation. Naim devices are designed for Ethernet or Wifi connectivity to the media servers and Naim app. If you go outside this Naim can’t really support you.

alternatives are Ethernet connections, or/and properly placed and implemented Wifi (usually multiple wired cooperating access points). You have probably paid a few thousand pounds for your Hi-Fi, you need to provide the right environment for it to operate, especially if using components that require an Ethernet or Wifi network. Paying an electrician to install Ethernet wiring won’t usually be that expensive if you are unable to do yourself.

Thank you Gentlemen, I think my only options for optimum performance are one of the following:

1. Relocate the Core and run an ethernet cable from the Router location to the equipment rack in the preferred location

2. And probably the most sensible in regards cost, efficiency and convenience….leave the bloody Core where it is and try and live with the fact that a lovely piece of equipment is not on display with the Nova. As a long time hifi buff (and luddite, this is my first step into streaming/networking) who has always proudly displayed my equipment in a prominent position in my listening room and on occasion taken pleasure from just looking at it admiringly, this goes against every fibre of my being...hey ho

SIMON-IN-SUFFOLK, in regards the Naim Support advice, my issue is that no attempt was made to explain the basis of their advice, or offer an alternative, I have had to turn to this forum for that. I am now more knowledgeable so thank you and the other contributors for that.

Is there no way you can run a wire? There is a massive range of them out there, you can get black external cable for instance if you need to go outside and back in.

The most sensible way is to run an ethernet from router to where you have the Nova,  that way you can have the Core on show alongside the Nova as you would like.     You just need to run just one ethernet into a network switch & branched to each of the Nova & Core from that.  (see diagram  NDX=Nova & NAS=Core)   The switch can be a simple consumer type such as Netgear,  it will need a power supply

Or another possibility is to have the router moved,  I had the phone cmpy move the incoming phone point & located the router where I wanted it.  

If you are able to run a single wire from the router to the stereo, you can put a switch on the end, and connect both the streamer and the core to the switch. If switches are new to you, look up Netgear GS105 Ethernet switch, which will explain what they are better than I could. That way you get to put the Core on the rack. 

Ah, I was writing this while Mike was posting his. 

Hi David,

I would add though that if you took the advice of this forum literally you would think that your Core connected via an ethernet powerline would sound like a £10 Chinese transistor radio but it wont it will still sound very, very good just not as good as it could.

If I had never read the advice on this forum I would have listened to that UnitiQute connected by a powerline  very happily it still sounded amazing but as I said the wired connection did sound marginally better.

You might want to try it for yourself to see if you are happy with the results it might be that you are,  it will not do any damage and will mean you get to stare lovingly at the Core which is something I'm guilty of too!

And I agree with you the reply from Naim did seem a bit too short and to the point and could have offered alternative routes and perhaps explained why as well.

Have you considered using a wi-fi range extender? I use a netgear AC1200 EX6150 dual band wifi range extender which has an ethernet port which would allow you to connect your uniti core by an ethernet patch cable directly or via a switch. This is the the setup I use to connect the UQ2 in my second system in an upstairs bedroom and which can stream HiRes flac files up to 24/192 without dropouts/buffering.

Please excuse my ignorance but is there any difference between a wifi extender and a powerline?

Reason for asking is I have my Core and 272 both plugged into Netgear WiFi extenders and was wondering if this impacts the response rate on the Naim app, specifically when going to the music library,  tap on artists and then it takes a while to load up my albums....

if I was to use a switch as per earlier advice in this thread what is deemed the best cable to use, standard Cat 6 or something more specific such as Audioquest?

A wifi extender is paired up to your wifi router from which it receives its signal over your wifi network. The powerline uses your household mains electricity wiring to carry data via your router to your audio gear.

Using an extender can impact the strength of your wifi signal. I only use one extender so this isn’t an issue for me. Is there a reason you are using 2 extenders rather than a single extender with a switch to link both the core and your 272 ? Are they in different rooms ?

I don’t use esoteric ethernet cables so perhaps others can give their opinion but for practical purposes cat6 or even cat5e cables are all you need.

sjbabbey posted:

 

Using an extender can impact the strength of your wifi signal. I only use one extender so this isn’t an issue for me. Is there a reason you are using 2 extenders rather than a single extender with a switch to link both the core and your 272 ? Are they in different rooms ?

Only reason for 2 is my ignorance on this topic,  shall order a switch and try it out. Thanks for your response 

Just get cat5e or cat 6 cable. 

In my experience Excel make very good quality well priced ethernet cables. They can be found on amazon

The Core has a spinning whirring hdd in it unless it’s fitted with a ssd. When I owned a UnitiServe I wanted it NOT to be in the music listening room. Now the Core is a bit prettier, but to me a server with moving parts belongs elsewhere. 

I paid my hi fi dealer a relatively small sum to run cat 5 cable in the walls and install an Ethernet wall plate behind the hi fi rack. 

Bart posted:

The Core has a spinning whirring hdd in it unless it’s fitted with a ssd. When I owned a UnitiServe I wanted it NOT to be in the music listening room. Now the Core is a bit prettier, but to me a server with moving parts belongs elsewhere. 

I paid my hi fi dealer a relatively small sum to run cat 5 cable in the walls and install an Ethernet wall plate behind the hi fi rack. 

Unless the moving parts move out of the server I see no problems having the server on the rack, but of course I have to using spdif out.