Probably daft questions, but.....

Gary,

That answers my questions perfectly - I somehow knew it couldn't be that simple! Many thanks.

Peter

No Gary. You could.

What you would need, in theory, is a cross-over cable.

Why do I say in theory? Well, modern hardware has some nice built in tricks. When I got my current laptop I found that it was clever enough to detect when a cross-over cable was needed, and just reconfigured itself - it could be that a modern NAS might pull the same trick.

M

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ethernet_crossover_cable

If you were going to go down this route (sic) you would need to assign the NAS and the renderer with IP addresses in the same range, so that they could see each other; and, you would lose some of the nice things about having a NAS, such as a common data repository that can be seen by multiple machines.

M

Thanks for the replies everyone.

Simon,

You clearly know your stuff but I confess I am struggling to get a handle on much of what you say. What I would want to do is to transfer music files to a NAS drive from a PC and then simply plug the drive into the Qute (or alternative streaming enabled hi-fi) using an ethernet type cable - so it wouldn't be connected to any network/internet, just to the Qute. I appreciate that I would be losing some of the benefits of the NAS drive, such as allowing access from multiple devices on a network, but this is unimportant to me. I want to keep it as simple as possible. So would that work, and would the Qute or similar play files from the drive as normal? Many thanks.

Peter

Many thanks for that Simon.

Cheers,

Peter

Hi Peter

I think the best answer for you would be to use a music server with built in hard disk and use a S/PDIF connection to the UQ. You could do this with a Vortexbox or you could use a Macintosh or one of the others. 

The NAS solutions really need a network as you need to have a way to navigate to which song you want to play and you need Internet access if you want iRadio through your UQ. Ethernet is a network cable so immediately you use one you have created a network and you have to network type things to make it work. Simon has explained some of these, but I still think you may find it difficult to use because of the lack of user interface for you to select what you'd like to play. 

All the best, Guy

In order to keep it as simple as possible use the NAS as it was designed on the network.

If you want to play with fire you could try a drobo which allows ethernet connection then USB connection (well at least it used to) you will have no end of trouble but its possible.

The simple way forward (And really this applies to everyone) is:

1. Purchase a decent NAS, assume you will need at least double the amount you think you are ever going to need!

2. Put the NAS well away from the HIFI, there is no reason what so ever for a NAS to even be in the same room, or even on the same floor, thats the purpose of them. In this way they can sound like an airplane taking off for all it matters.

3. Hardwire this NAS with ethernet to your home router this router needs to be good, so by definition cannot be a BT homehub. This is normally the sticking point for people. and personally I don't know why, I have 18 ports around the house, all proper wall installs, all done by myself and not expensive either.

4. Hardwire your UNiti.

5. Have a dedicated share just for music. Decide on your posion and store said music in this share. For your own sanity keep it neat. If you want to see images stick an image of the album in the album folder and call it 'folder.jpg'

6. Turn on the NASes inbuilt UPNP server, if it does not have one, you ignored point 1.

Lets put this another way. Why spend upwards of £1k,  in most cases £2k and above and piss it all up with a cheap nasty home network. A decent home network starts with the router, and preferably with a switch and the whole lot can be done, decently for less than 400 quid and in stages to ease the cost.

Gary,

Thanks for the detailed explanation. Frankly this is enough to put me off the whole thing! (not your fault of course, you are merely relaying the facts). I really don't want to involve a home network or the internet in my hi-fi. I want to keep the hi-fi as a discreet stand-alone entity.

Guy,

By a "music server" do you mean basically a PC? This was the other possibilty I was considering, using a mini PC in a similar configuration to George F's, which seems to have been remarkably successful for him. I am puzzled by your comment on the lack of a user interface for selecting tracks if using a NAS drive into a UQ. Doesn't the UQ provide this?

As I commented on another thread, I am in no hurry to ditch CD. But if the need to do this arises, I want to be prepared and to have a firm basis for making a sensible decision.

Many thanks,

Peter

PJ2,

OK how about this. 

1) Buy a six-pack of a buddy's favorite beer.  Anyone with basic computer skills will do.

2) Invite them over.

3) Have them use double sided tape to adhere a tiny router to the side or back of your NAS. 

4) Connect the NAS to the router and the router to the Qute.

5) A CD that comes with the router will most likely dial it in to 95%

6) Drink the rest of the six-pack.

If you are willing to have a NAS involved somewhere it shouldn't be a deal breaker to have a router.  It need not be connected to the internet.  It is certainly smaller than your NAS and maybe could even be jammed inside an open bay or something.

-Patrick

> Guy,

By a "music server" do you mean basically a PC? This was the other possibilty I was considering, using a mini PC in a similar configuration to George F's, which seems to have been remarkably successful for him. I am puzzled by your comment on the lack of a user interface for selecting tracks if using a NAS drive into a UQ. Doesn't the UQ provide this?

Hi Peter

The interface would be scrolling up and down on the UQ. I don't think you'd like it very much after using a PC. If you had 1000 CDs, it would be like navigating a DVD recorder with a 1000 TV channels with a very small 4-line display. 

Notice that Naim was giving away an iPad if you bought a UQ and US so they are really holding their hands up and saying you need an iPad or similar to make it all work nicely. 

Also you'd need to do anything you needed to do on the NAS without a display or you'd need to keep attaching a screen and keyboard to it. 

To get away from the need for a screen you need some form of wireless control - the iPad is superb, but not the only way. However, the wireless control needs a network. 

I can use my UQ without any networking by simply connecting a Macintosh to it (a PC will work too as long as it has a digital out). The Mac's digital out is jitter prone, which is why I always use its USB out with a USB/S-PDIF adapter. The UQ appreciates cutting back on the jitter. You can then use iTunes to organise your music exactly as George F does (or another player if you prefer). 

The other way is to put your music on USB sticks. Naim kit sounds really good playing these and no computer is necessary. Assuming you only put a few albums on a stick then navigating is OK. 

However, when all is said and done a Meridian CD transport playing through the Naim DAC/555PS produces as good a digital sound as I've heard (excluding hi-res and not heard much of that). I would think a more modest transport like the April Music Stello would work well too, but not all work well - my ageing Yamaha sounds very poor as CD player and not much better playing bit-perfect rips from its hard disk, but it is a stonkingly good CD recorder. 

All the best, Guy 

If you don't want a NAS for any other duties, and you don't have a streamer as yet, why not circumvent all of this complexity and simply buy a HDX?

Steve

> why not circumvent all of this complexity and simply buy a HDX?

Price? 

HDX list price is £4695 (or £4795 for the SSD version, but you wouldn't want that in this context). Ex-dem and used can save a good £1k or more.

agreed.  I was using "router" loosely.  I am not sure of the terminology nor the technology.

Many thanks to you all for your kind help and advice. Yes the HDX is way out of the frame on price grounds.

The thought of using a small display to navigate through a CD collection is certainly a significant factor in putting me off streaming. Also I didn't realise that using an iPad (or iPhone?) requires a network. If I use the digital out of a PC into a UQ or similar then this is presumably the equivalent of using a PC with an exterrnal DAC (USB or otherwise) into a line input, except that the UQ's on-board DAC is being used. I don't fancy USB sticks much, and again this is going back to a small display. I am beginning to think that the best option (if/when I abandon CD) will be to wait until an affordable all-in-one machine with an on-board hard-drive appears. Except then if the drive fails and is not easily replaceable the machine is a write-off! The mind boggles...... 

Thanks to you all again for your patience.

Peter

Simon,

You make a good point there. That's why , in a way, the current technology seems to me to be a hybrid or half-way house between CD and non-physical digital media. If you discount downloads of CD quality or higher, whch are certainly nowhere near the scope of material available on CD, then you are left with CD as the source material for hard disc replay. To me, it will all make far more sense when the record companies stop manufacturing CD's and digital music file downloads become the predominant method for purchasing recorded music. Until then I am happy to continue with a traditional CD player, but I do feel the need to "keep up" with what's happening on the hard disc front and to start to formulate some possible system configurations. Best to be prepared!

Peter