Am I right to be excited by Airplay?

Posted by: mfan on 23 November 2011

Folks - have read and re-read the forums on streaming, and in particular on Airplay, and I have a nasty feeling that my excitement about impending(?) Airplay compatibility may be misplaced.

 

I'm currently streaming Apple Lossless from a Mac Mini running iTunes > ethernet > aTV2 > SN > Keilidhs.  Wow - a GIANT step up from my previous Classik Movie, but a change that has left me wanting 'more of the same please'.  Also, I love the ease of use of the Remote app which, after a recent aTV & Time Capsule firmware update, works flawlessly.  Logically a £99 front end looks like the place to start improving - so I'm contemplating an NDX or ND5XS.  And probably a HiCap for the SN....

 

It looks like accepted wisdom is that currently the best streaming is UPnP Nas to Network Player - however this route has well documented complexities (and workarounds) with file type, metadata, and controllability.  BUT - does Airplay change all this?  

 

Is Airplay, effectively, the digital audio gubbins from my aTV built into the NDX/5XS - presumably with Naim standards of sound quality?  If so, and given that it also eliminates the SPDIF connection and the NAS, then I'm struggling to see why this wouldn't be audio bliss.  However posts elsewhere seem to imply that Airplay isn't top quality.  So, my question is whether or not Mini > NDX/5XS with Airplay is inherently worse than Mini > NAS > NDX/5XS.  I'm assuming (/ hoping) that both would be a step up from Mini > aTV2.

 

FYI: I don't intend to listen to lossy music sent from iPhone to Network Player - I'm just interested in getting the best out of my lossless files on the Mac Mini.

 

Can't wait till Airplay is enabled so I can listen for myself, but if in the meantime if anyone can shed any light on how this should pan out I'd be eternally grateful.

 

First post from a relatively new Naim convert, so if I'm being spectacularly dim please point it out gently! 

 

Mark

Posted on: 23 November 2011 by pcstockton

Airplay could be attractive for you if you wont use anything other than iTunes as a media player, and/or if you are Apple only and cant find a decent UPNP server for your OS.

 

Otherwise it doesn't seem to bring anything new or better to the party.  It doesn't support hi-res (i don't think).  As far as I know you cant use it to listen to your library in the car or at work, unless you do the whole Apple Cloud thing.

 

Anyway....  just my 2 cents.

 

But yes, if you are exclusively iTunes/Mac OS, you would probably like it.

 

Myself, i would simply buy a cheap ass PC and jam it in a closet with a NAS.

 

-p

Posted on: 23 November 2011 by mfan

Ah - good point about hi-res.  Not a problem now but I do want to be future proofed where possible (esp as the Network Players are enabling hi-def).

 

I'm open to alternatives to iTunes, though I am fairly heavily invested in Apple hardware and have an outside chance of troubleshooting problems with iOS/OSX - I fear PC issues would leave me floundering.  But the main objective is to build a high quality source - if Naim's implementation of Airplay is at parity with UPnP sound quality and superior to my current set up then that's all I need - job done!

 

Quite happy re-ripping - loved doing it before despite it taking 3 months @15 per day!

 

BTW: dabbled with iCloud (photos and contacts) and it's pretty good so far.  Will have a go sometime with music but it's only capable of compressed c. 256kbps so not a 'serious' music solution.

Cheers

M

Posted on: 23 November 2011 by realhifi
Originally Posted by mfan:

But the main objective is to build a high quality source - if Naim's implementation of Airplay is at parity with UPnP sound quality and superior to my current set up then that's all I need - job done!

 

 

AirPlay is not at this time as good as UPnP whether the UPnP server is streaming hires or the same resolution as AirPlay.  At least on Linn the difference is clear between the two.  Now Songcaster on the other hand.....

 

I would assume that Naim will be implementing a similar streamer solution to their updates on their networked players in the future.

Posted on: 23 November 2011 by matpip

Mark,

I would consider another way to keep mac interface and high sound quality without waiting for airplay.

You just connect you mac mini to a nDAC (via digital signal or even better with a USB-Spdif convertor like Hiface), get an Hicap (mandatory for SN as you know), and you will get the best sound for the money.

Stick to itunes and control everything with ipad/iphone, job done! 

Posted on: 23 November 2011 by Simon-in-Suffolk
Hi Mark. There need be no complexities with upnp, using upto date and good software it's is plug and play, just like AirPlay. Yes you have more choice of options  with upnp servers like Asset, but only if you want that choice as the defaults work straightaway.
AirPlay is more locked down, and in my expierience needs iTunes running in server mode somewhere to run. I also find when used with AppleTV2, AirPlay/AppleTV2  transcodes everything to 16/48kHz, which is not ideal, also Itunes can't cope with id3 metadata tags in wav files which is a bit of fundamental limitation for me. From an audiophile point of view I have yet to hear what I would call a quality AirPlay implementation, but there is still time, but because of its sonic limutations I hardly use with my hifi equipment, even though my AppleTV2 feeds my NDX via a Toslink input.
So I am curious to see Naim's AirPlay implementation, but I I don't have high expectations of top sound quality.
Simon
Posted on: 24 November 2011 by james n

Mark, you have all the bits in place not to need Airplay. Install playback UPnP server on the Mini (£10), it'll integrate fully with your iTunes library so no fiddling with metadata issues etc and will serve to an NDX / 5XS etc with control via the n-Stream app.

 

James 

Posted on: 24 November 2011 by Guido Fawkes

Airplay is wonderful in my view. It just works. No need to install things or use connectors with their own drivers. 

 

I don't really like UPnP, but beggars can't be choosers and if you like to use Naim and want to stream to a Naim renderer then you are stuck with it. At least I manage to use UPnP without being forced to use Windows. 


I guess some people feel Airplay forces them to use Apple, but I use mostly Apple and Linux products anyway so I'm happy. 

Posted on: 24 November 2011 by Tog
AirPlay has the potential but Apple have never shown much interest in catering for the relatively small audiophile demographic. Look at it this way even without offering truly hq sound quality they dominate digital music distribution through selling a range of beautifully designed and innovative products. They don't need high end hi fi but high end hi fi need AirPlay comparability and will pay the licence fee for it. Tog
Posted on: 24 November 2011 by Iver van de Zand
If I may add a question to this topic: my understanding/experience is that there are SQ limitations to Airplay when hardware like Airport Express or Apple TV is involved. They not only prevent from using HighRes, they are also producing quite some jitter through theirdigital outputs. However, when Airplay is used wirelessly (using ND5 for example) i doubt whether there is blocking of HighRes and I'd assume the jitter issue is gone too, given no Apple hardware is involved anymore, making Airplay Wireless a very strong option for streaming. Am I correct on this guys ?
Posted on: 24 November 2011 by Guido Fawkes

Am I correct on this guys ?


Yes (not sure about hi-res, but jitter will be a thing of the past or at least at level that is like to upset those who get upset by it)


All the best, Guy

 

Posted on: 24 November 2011 by mfan
Iver, Guido - that's what I was hoping to hear - that the limitations are in the Apple hardware at the player end - so Naim implementation of AirPlay should be inherently better. James - great advice re: Playback, thank you. Means an AirPlay -v- UPnP comparison will be very easy and cheap. Cheers Mark