Richard:

Thanks for the info. I will pick this up when it is released.

I am tempted to pick up the Sleeping Beauty too since I don't have one.

Jay 

Kuma,

I think you should ask Richard to change the name of this thread to reissue quality vinyl classical albums?

Stu.

some of you may be interested in this 'labelography' - Blue Note, London, Columbia Masterworks, Mercury and RCA Victor.

http://ronpenndorf.com/labelography.html

I used it recently to date some 60's Blue Notes.

Maybe Richard would give his opinion on its accuracy.

My Elvin Jones and Sam Rivers Music Matters 45 RPM Blue Notes arrived a few weeks ago and sound fantastic; especially the Elvin Jones.

Would it help if I only review Charles Munch reissues?

Cat Stevens Tea for the Tillerman by Quality Record Pressings. 

Review: not worth it. It's not terrible like some reissues but my nothing special late A&M record show pressing kicks its ass.

Jay,

What is 'A&M record show pressing'?

My friend who's a 'Tea for the Tillerman'-o-phile wants to know.

He showed up here with a regular pressing and Analogue Production pressings ( he bought two copies! that's devotion, folks. ). I think he's got like 2 or 3 other pressings including MOFI but I wasn't paying attention. :x

Graham,

I wish there were more info on the dead wax coding info which sometimes give more accurate information than the label or jacket for that matter.

Here's the Decca Metrx Info: ( so we can decode the secret info )

At 6 o'clock position:

You will see something like ZAL-6526-2E. ZAL means it is stereo. If mono, XARL. The 6526 is a recording number. The 2 of 2E means second lacquer made from that recording. "E" is the code for cutting engineer. 2E/1W means side A and B came from lacquer but by different engineers.

list of Decca Engineers from 1957 to 1972.
A= Guy Fletcher. 
B= Ronald Mason. 
C= Trevor Fletcher. 
D= Jack Law.
E= Stanley Goodall. 
F= Cyril Windebank. 
G= Ted Burket ------Good
K= Tony Hawkins.
L= George Bettyes. 
W= Harry Fisher. -----Good

At 9 o'clock position:

There will be a number like "1" or "3". That is the mother number. 

At 12 o'clock position:

There will be 2 letter code indicating what year the LP was pressed.

CT - from 1950-1951
RT - from 1959
ET - from 1960
ZT - from 1962
OT - from 1963
MT - from 1965
KT - about 1967 to 1969
JT - about 1969 to 1972
no age-codings were used after 1972" 

At 3 o'clock position:

There will be 2 letter code like "UG". That is the stamper number using the word "B U C K I N G H A M" to represent the numbers 1 through 10. UG means 27th stamper from that particular mother.

Jay, had a quick look at the labelography for Decca.  Pretty good but a few gaps and incorrect conclusions.  The label groove on the London CS issues varied for the first few years - I was told by an ex-Decca manager that it all depended on what presses were being used at any one time.  "Pancake" pressings, with no groove guard, and the groove closest to the label edge, were done on the older presses.  Seems Decca SXLs were given priority on the newer presses so pancakes are rarer here, but do exist. 

Kuma, good find on the matrix info.  Not sure Tony Hawkins or others would be pleased about not being considered "Good" though...

As for Tea For the Tillerman, I have a copy that I bought sealed NOS - it's a late '70s press by the look of it.  Immaculate on reasonably weighty vinyl.  However, it has some of the highest surface noise of any LP I own.  Weird really, because Island pressings are normally good to superb.  No amount of cleaning seems to improve matters.

Kuma

thanks for that - a 'cut out and keep'.

my wife has quite a few of the classical records being talked about here, and more besides, so nice to date them and define their provenance.

do you have any links or references for more info?

Richard:

Graham posted the labelography. Your clarification of the labelography is very helpful.

Jay

Kuma:

There is no "A&M record show pressing." It is just a copy I bought at a record show for a few dollars. It has this label (more or less):

The "good" A&M pressings of the Tea for the Tillerman have this earlier label (I think, or something close):

The point is even my later A&M pressing sounded better than the new Quality Record Pressings version.

I would think that a UK "Pink Island" (which label the Quality Record Pressings version sort of replicates) would be the best of all, but at great expense.

Jay

Richard:

I'm sorry to hear your copy of Tea for the Tillerman is noisy (agreed quite unusual for Island). Don't get the Quality Record Pressings version to replace it though.

Jay

Ricahrd,

I have a number of sealed records I've bought used that are just so noisy. ( Erroll Garner's 'Magicians' come to my mind: 70s crappy London pressing ) It is noisy as the copy I was going to replace. I'm now leary of used sealed records.

Originally Posted by Jay Coleman:
There is no "A&M record show pressing." It is just a copy I bought at a record show for a few dollars. It has this label (more or less):

The "good" A&M pressings of the Tea for the Tillerman have this earlier label (I think, or something close):

Jay,

Thanks for the clarification.

Sp, what's your beef with the reissue? Just so that we are talking about the same thing, the ones my friend bought are the Analogue Production (APP 9135 )

What is a "Pink Island" ? ( Sounds naughty )

Graham,

Wish I had more deadwax info on other labels. ( particularly RCA and Columbia )

So, no love for MOFI records around here it seems. I've my own set of prejudice from the way back when. I think tho, the new current MOFI ( owned by Music Direct US ) are generally better than their old pressings albeit, this label also are a bit of hit and miss i'm finding out.

The disappointing issues I have so far is the Stevie Wonder's 'Talking Book' and a few of Sinatra records. And overall their pressing also suffers from the same failing as Speakers Corner: i.e. over polishing and refining. Quiet backgrounds and better frequency extensions but missing midrange.

I got a bunch and some of them are very good. Are they outstanding? No.
Here's a decent sounding Sinatra and this album I could compare to the original pressing. ( even with a 'tough guy Sinatra' label )

The Concert Sinatra: Frank Sinatra/Nelson Riddle

Numbered Limited-Edition GAIN 2™ Ultra Analog 180-gram LP / MFSL 1-345 US
Re-mastering by: No production notes on this particular title. Sourced from Original Master Tapes ( altho does not say it's the first generation ) I wish they'd list the name of engineers.
Release date: 2011

Sound Quality:
This is originally recorded in 35mm film so, the original issue sounds pretty good but my copy was badly scratched in some parts and very noisy. Also, the last track didn't play well as it sounded like tracking errors.

On the MOFI reissue, Miyabi or even Adikt tracks both of last tracks in flying colour. ( it wasn't the mistracking as I thought ) Dead quiet surface and Frank's voice emerges firmly out of black bg. It's eerie as well as visual as if he's in the room as now I can hear him breathing even. 

An Improved fidelity is not going to make his 'Ol man River' any more convincing ( this tune really needs Paul Robeson ), but my favourite 'Soliloquy' takes on a much more natural feel and with all that added details, I can appreciate subtle nuances and inflection. Less distortion/stress, particularly in the upper midrange, so the whole tune sounds more relaxed easier to listen to. It seems he's singing better along with the band, too.

This issue, I feel, was worth it as it did not sacrifice the midrange to gain the dynamics and details. Also, it does not have that bright 'edging' I hear on some of their reissues.

One thing to note is that without washing, there are a few pops and clicks ( I'd reckon it's a mold release possibly ) out of the bag. I would ask for an exchange if I didn't own a RCM.

Packaging Quality: 
The same gate fold cover but no gloss laminate of the original. Gone is the large Reprise Record logo on the cover. ( strange ) Printing quality is good but I wish they would duplicate the original label rather than the MOFI black label. There is a gold foil stamped number on the back.

JT: James Taylor

Numbered Limited-Edition GAIN 2™ Ultra Analog 180-gram LP / MFSL 1-354 US
Re-mastering by: No production notes on this particular title. Sourced from Original Master Tapes ( altho does not say it's the first generation )
Release date: 2011

Sound Quality: 
I'm a sucker for this album. The US original I have ( several actually ) sound pretty decent. So there wasn't much reason I should get this but just curious to see what else could be done to this decent sounding original.

The output level is lower from the original so I had to turn up the volume a bit. James's voice is now situated bit laid back amongst other instruments. Clean and clear 'Your Smiling Face' but less get-up-'n'-go. It sounds as if someone took out half a ball. Smoother and gentler, sure. But less engaging.

But then when I listen to slower tunes like  "If I Keep My Heart Out of Sight", it's so gorgeous and his singing is just breathtaking I am dumbfounded. Seriously, some of the tunes on this record would make a nice *demo* tunes for a record player. There's something really comforting about his warm assuring voice. At least this remaster is not annoyingly squeaky clean but the whole thing sounds a bit like being on Prozac®.

Packaging Quality: 
Another annoying thing about MOFI packaging is that they do not duplicate the original inner. Instead you get a *sell sheet* of MOFI catalogue and their various items they schlep. The record itself is housed in a genuine Mofi Record sleeve. There is a gold foil stamped number on the back.

"Wish I had more deadwax info on other labels. ( particularly RCA and Columbia )"

Thanks anyhow Kuma, very useful.

Maybe Richard could share some general info on how to read/interpret the deadwax codings?

There must be some common information across labels and manufacturers?

(I'm asking even at the expense of him confusing me with Jay again!)

Apologies Graham.  I believe that there's a lot of info out there on Decca, RCA and Mercury Matrices.  Only difficulty is in coming to any firm conclusions - for every time you think there may be a rule, the exception crops up and it's back to the drawing board.

Kuma,

yes, I have suspected that some sealed NOS LPs may be re-sealed B grade copies.  At least in the US you had cut-outs to mark out the remainder or B grade stock.  Having said that, my most recent sealed NOS purchases - a bunch of early Island label releases that were just stacked on the pavement outside a local charity shop - have all, without fail, sounded superb.

None at all.

One of the MOFI pressings that everyone on the Steve Hoffman forum raves about is the Beck LP Sea Change.  It is an EXTREMELY well recorded LP.  Before buying the MOFI I decided to hunt down an original copy - which I found.  True enough it was a REVELATION.  With that said I decided to purchase the MOFI copy (claimed to be even better - hard to believe how it was possible to improve on such a great recording).  I even ordered a second copy from our local shop for Jay.

Jay was the first to play it and when we spoke he said that it was not bad - but nothing special.  Disbelieving I opened my copy and played it - for about 30 seconds.  After that I wanted to throw it through the air like a frisbee.

The following week Jay came over and we played the first 30 seconds of the MOFI followed by the first 30 seconds of the original press.  We both just laughed out loud.

I really am getting tired of buying these reissues - I think the original's beat them every time.  The only one's I have confidence in are the (sadly defunct) Classic Records.

I also share Jay's conclusion that the Acous Tech reissues by Chad at Acoustic Sounds are simply not good.

Best

Gregg

Hi Kuma,

This is a "Pink Island" label. There are various versions with and without 'eyes' (as above) and represent Island Record issues of the late '60s to 1970. After they became the 'Pink Rim' labels, which I think sounds even naughtier!

ATB 

Steve

Classic Records 200g Mono Blue Note.

Just received today. Another great BN reissue on CR. These MONO reissues have a great soundstage. Quality recording and SQ. As usual the packaging is also very good. I paid £24 for this, CR albums are still there for a reasonable price if you look.

Steve

Steve,

Thanks for the info and you reminded me to order Ella's 'Clap Hands, Here comes Charlie'. I've an original which I want to replace because it's noisy. It's a copy I bought from my neighbour who was an avid jazz record collector but unfortunately many of his records have scratches all over because he tossed all the inners! :x

You are right that some of the Classic Records titles are still available at a reasonable cost.

Graham,

Here's another link for you:
VinylBeat.com

Originally Posted by glevethan: I think the original's beat them every time.  The only one's I have confidence in are the (sadly defunct) Classic Records.

Gregg,

I think Classic Records also title dependent but maybe they average better than others. I didn't think their Peter Gabriel reissue double vinyl or Zeppelin II are that special, for instance. 

But Analogue Productions jazz reissues I have are very very good. Hancock Maiden Voyage especially because I hvae so many other reissue versions to compare. Ok. I haven't compare it to a mint original first pressing but man those things are unobtainable!

My record collecting friend was right tho. He always said 'originals are usually better'. His strategy was that keep buying a dollar bin record till you come across the one in a good shape. so you buy a dozen records at a buck. ( you're still only at 12$ ). The trouble is, these days, it is harder to find a dollar record because of this vinyl resurgence amongst main streams.

Does anyone have this from Classic Records? Its one of my favorite Dylan "albums." CD sounds quite good, but wondering if its worth springing for this on vinyl

Here's another link for you:
VinylBeat.com

Thanks again Kuma - all useful stuff, especially when buying.

Richard:

Here are more coming titles. Any really great ones?

Thanks.

Jay

Oivin Fjeldstad / Sibelius: Sibelius Song Recital  $34.98	Ernest Ansermet / Prokofiev, Glinka & Borodin Classical Symphony  $34.98	Georg Solti / Strauss: Elektra  $64.98	Joan Sutherland / The Art Of The Primadonna  $64.98
Istvan Kertesz / Dvorak: Symphony No. 8 $34.98	Ernest Ansermet / Bizet: Carmen Suite, L'Arlesienne Suite  $34.98	Ernest Ansermet / Ravel: Sheherazade / Berlioz: Les Nuits d'ete  $34.98	Willi Boskovsky / Schubert: Octet In F Major D 803  $34.98
Ernest Ansermet / Stravinsky: Symphony In Three Movements  $34.98

Rats!

No Monteux!

Jay,

my memory is a bit rusty on some of them, and really they're are no clunkers (I guess they wouldn't be reissuing them if they were)  but the ones that stand out on top of the aforementioned Ravel disc are; Ansermet's Prokofiev & Borodin on SXL2292, Schubert Octet on SXL2028, The Kirsten Flagstad Sibelius recital, Kertesz's Dvorak Symphony No.8, and the Solti Elektra.  The latter two are easily found second-hand in good condition, so you may be best off getting originals of those instead - SQ is very high.  However, note that none of them would find their way into my Decca top 10.

The Ansermet's are much harder to find, and usually expensive to buy second-hand.  Same for the Schubert Octet and the Sibelius.  As for Joan Sutherland, I'm afraid I'm just not such a great fan so hard to be totally objective...

Richard

Which are in your Decca top 5?

Thanks

Gregg

PS  I am waiting on the new Decca CD box from Amazon UK (50% cheaper than Amazon US when I ordered it).  An instant Decca collection for $2.50 per disc!