New Naim NDX
Posted by: Nigel 66 on 02 September 2010
Posted on: 02 September 2010 by jon h
Sorry for the delay in me injecting my usual nonsense to the thread, but I've only just had breakkies here in San Francisco and so am riding my first quarter gallon latte with double shot espresso
Posted on: 02 September 2010 by fixedwheel
quote:
Originally posted by jon honeyball:
Clearly I have got this wrong, but naim don't send me press releases to explain this stuff....
As you are the only poster around here designated as a "Press Member" I think you'll have to class yourself as Unique. Either that, or someone has a very special placed set aside for you....
John
Posted on: 02 September 2010 by Phil Harris
quote:
Originally posted by jon honeyball:
Clearly I have got this wrong, but naim don't send me press releases to explain this stuff....
So it's a 1300 quid unityqute minus power amps minus variable level outputs minus tuner plus fixed level output plus dinky psu upgrade option plus wide case for nearly three grand?
Only in the same way that a 282 / HiCap / NAP 250 is a £2,600 SuperNait minus the built in digital inputs for £7,590...
Phil
Posted on: 02 September 2010 by Polarbear
quote:
Yes ... It has a "classic" series designation that fits in line with the HDX / CDX / XPS etc.
Phil,
are you suggesting that performance is pitched between CDS3 and CDX2?
Regards
PB
Posted on: 02 September 2010 by Phil Harris
quote:
Originally posted by jon honeyball:
Sorry for the delay in me injecting my usual nonsense to the thread, but I've only just had breakkies here in San Francisco and so am riding my first quarter gallon latte with double shot espresso
That's OK Jon ... I thought my day was nearly over but I see it's probably only just beginning.
Phil
Posted on: 02 September 2010 by GraemeH
quote:
Originally posted by Polarbear:
quote:
Yes ... It has a "classic" series designation that fits in line with the HDX / CDX / XPS etc.
Phil,
are you suggesting that performance is pitched between CDS3 and CDX2?
Regards
PB
Phew....I can rest easy......again.
G
Posted on: 02 September 2010 by Chief Chirpa
quote:
Originally posted by Phil Harris:
As I have said before - I will not make any comments on the possible existence or otherwise of anything for which there is *NOT* an official announcement ...
Phil, That's fair enough. Of course, Naim won't answer every question about possible future products. But...
Paul/Richard, My line about the product line-up being messy wasn't in any way a comment on the performance/integration of the products themselves. Obviously, you fellas know where you're heading, but as a potential customer, seeing related products show up one by one is just confusing.
When the Naim DAC was released last year, the NDX and UnitiServe must have already been in development, so why no announcement of their impending arrival? Personally, I've held off buying a DAC because I'm probably after a one-box source (HDX? No thanks). A few months on, Qute and UnitiServe are announced together, a few more months, the NDX shows up, and so on...
I guess I just want to know where you're going with all this.
quote:
Originally posted by jon honeyball:
Sorry for the delay in me injecting my usual nonsense to the thread, but I've only just had breakkies here in San Francisco and so am riding my first quarter gallon latte with double shot espresso
Cool. I stayed at the YMCA one time in San Fran (ahem, with my gf). It was fun.
Posted on: 02 September 2010 by Hook
As a DAC/XPS2 owner, and unless I am missing something, I do not see the advantage of buying an NDX versus a UnitiQute (other than potentially reducing the box count by one, and having the casework match -- neither a real high priority for me).
If I were starting from scratch, then the NDX would have a very strong appeal.
Hook
Posted on: 02 September 2010 by Phil Harris
quote:
Originally posted by Polarbear:
Phil,
are you suggesting that performance is pitched between CDS3 and CDX2?
Regards
PB
Not at all - I don't lay claim to golden ears and so I wouldn't lay claim to being able to tell you whether I think it's better than a CDX2 or not as good as a CDS3 ... if you need that information then I'll let Doug or Paul or any of the guys that have a longer aquaintence with the CD players tell you that.
I haven't used or listened to a CD player in years as they don't fit into the way I listen to music and I try not to listen too closely if people tell me what does or doesn't sound better than A.N.Other product - to me it's all personal preference anyway ...
... I just want to make sure that what is being discussed on here is factual.
Phil
Posted on: 02 September 2010 by Polarbear
quote:
Originally posted by Phil Harris:
quote:
Originally posted by Polarbear:
Phil,
are you suggesting that performance is pitched between CDS3 and CDX2?
Regards
PB
Not at all - I don't lay claim to golden ears and so I wouldn't lay claim to being able to tell you whether I think it's better than a CDX2 or not as good as a CDS3 ... if you need that information then I'll let Doug or Paul or any of the guys that have a longer aquaintence with the CD players tell you that.
I haven't used or listened to a CD player in years as they don't fit into the way I listen to music and I try not to listen too closely if people tell me what does or doesn't sound better than A.N.Other product - to me it's all personal preference anyway ...
... I just want to make sure that what is being discussed on here is factual.
Phil
Thanks Phil, I am just trying to see where the NDX is being pitched SQ wise, I will reserve judgement for myself until I can hear one and see how it compares to my humble CD player,
Regards
PB
Posted on: 02 September 2010 by Phil Harris
quote:
Originally posted by ghook2020:
As a DAC/XPS2 owner, and unless I am missing something, I do not see the advantage of buying an NDX versus a UnitiQute (other than potentially reducing the box count by one, and having the casework match -- neither a real high priority for me).
If I were starting from scratch, then the NDX would have a very strong appeal.
Hook
Well, if you wanted something small that would go nicely in a study / kitchen or bedroom then the UnitiQute is a great single box solution.
If you wanted something to go into an existing HiFi stack to give you UPnP playback, Internet Radio, DAB/FM etc. then the NDX is a suitable source component.
For what it's worth, I can probably see me shelling out for one in the end (even though I already have an HDX-SSD, nDAC and XPS) as I don't have a tuner in my system at the moment and it provides other functionality which would be handy to have...
Phil
Posted on: 02 September 2010 by Paul Stephenson
Jon like your cars with 4 wheels and a steering wheel so much more on a vantage. Jon, MC was here representing the magazine and can fill you in. I am sure a press release is in the post
Posted on: 02 September 2010 by pcstockton
Ok, It isn't a product for me as i already have the DAC, and enjoy my current interface with the music (Foobar displayed on my HDTV, with optional iPhone control). But I dont see why everyone is so upset!
Sure for my needs, and as a DAC owner, I dont see a huge difference between a Uniserve-SSD and an NDX, but for non DAC owners how is this not very exciting???
You have the option of Serve>DAC or NDX. In both cases you can upgrade PSUs.
For Allen and others, how is it NOT being ridiculously, prohibitively expensive a bad thing? Does it need to be over $10K for you to like the music it makes? This just cracks me up.
Why is it a bad thing that it can be upgraded? Is it because the upgrade path involves more boxes? Well that gives you the chance to spend more money (and more Fraim levels) which seems to be of utmost importance to some.
Look at the bare NDX as a Majik, an NDX/555ps as a Akurate, and the NDX/NDac/555ps as the Klimax. Then the full blown 4 box version as the Klimax555 hybrid.
The method Naim is offering gives so many possible options I cant see anything wrong with it. There is something for everyone, and every existing system.
-Patrick
Posted on: 02 September 2010 by hungryhalibut
Phil
You should get a free one for having to fend off all these questions!
Which could have been avoided with a competent comms strategy but that's something else altogether.
Nigel
Posted on: 02 September 2010 by pcstockton
quote:
I do not see the advantage of buying an NDX versus a UnitiQute
Those are wildly different products. How can you compare them?
Surely anyone with a DAC is going the route of the Uniserve right?
Posted on: 02 September 2010 by Adam Meredith
I'm just going to remain grumpy until Naim release a streamer.
Posted on: 02 September 2010 by Adrian Pasciuta
If the NDX is to appeal as a streamer/DAC to users who want high quality streaming from their existing ripped collections stored on a NAS, many of which will be in FLAC format, then it is rather unlikely that those customers will also go out and buy a Naim server -- they will expect the NDX to work with their existing setup and ripping process.
I'm really interested in the NDX but not having gapless playback from my existing FLAC library is a problem. I am not going to buy an NDX client *and* a Naim server of some sort and then re-rip everything in WAV!
The NDX has to appeal as a standalone box without the need for a secondary Naim server.
Are these limitations caused by uPNP? Perhaps that is the problem.
Adrian
Posted on: 02 September 2010 by Sister E.
quote:
Originally posted by Phil Harris:
Our UPnP servers rip to WAV format and provide gapless playback and "tag" information to our UPnP clients.
When used with our servers and our servers own rips the Uniti / UnitiQute / NDX will all provide gapless playback - we can control that functionality - however generally under UPnP this is something that isn't supported so if you want to mix and match UPnP servers and other file formats from other providers with our UPnP clients then we cannot claim gapless playback in those situations. (Apple didn't support this themselves until fairly recently and that's under their own very tightly closed platform.)
Phil
I think I must be very stupid but has this got anything to do with hi-fi anymore? I can barely understand a word of this. I have a feeling that the hi-fi of the future belongs to computer boffins and not to people who just want to put a disc(of whatever format)on and relax. I just can't imagine buying one of the these new things, taking it home and plugging it in and enjoying some music.
Am I alone in thinking like this? maybe I am.
Sister xx
Posted on: 02 September 2010 by Adam Meredith
quote:
Originally posted by Adam Meredith:
I'm just going to remain grumpy until Naim release a streamer.
Posted on: 02 September 2010 by Phil Harris
quote:
Originally posted by hungryhalibut:
Phil
You should get a free one for having to fend off all these questions!
/me forwards to the M.D.
quote:
Originally posted by hungryhalibut:
Which could have been avoided with a competent comms strategy but that's something else altogether.
Nigel
/me deletes that bit from forwarded message...
Thanks HH!
Phil
Posted on: 02 September 2010 by Phil Harris
quote:
Originally posted by Adam Meredith:
I'm just going to remain grumpy until Naim release a streamer.
...and which of the dwarves will you be after that?
Phil
Posted on: 02 September 2010 by kuma
Sister E.
They are the new breed of hifi people.
FYI, I don't even know what UPnP stands for.
It's a reminder of how painful it was to set up the computer based music server 6 years ago. ( things haven't progressed in this it seems )
Posted on: 02 September 2010 by Adam Meredith
quote:
Originally posted by Phil Harris:
quote:
Originally posted by Adam Meredith:
I'm just going to remain grumpy until Naim release a steamer.
...and which of the dwarves will you be after that?
Phil
Good to see you working Phil.
Good - but weird.
Doc
Posted on: 02 September 2010 by rich46
watch this space no need to spend 1000s cambridge will have one out in a few days £400
Posted on: 02 September 2010 by Phil Harris
quote:
Originally posted by Adrian Pasciuta:
If the NDX is to appeal as a streamer/DAC to users who want high quality streaming from their existing ripped collections stored on a NAS, many of which will be in FLAC format, then it is rather unlikely that those customers will also go out and buy a Naim server -- they will expect the NDX to work with their existing setup and ripping process.
I'm really interested in the NDX but not having gapless playback from my existing FLAC library is a problem. I am not going to buy an NDX client *and* a Naim server of some sort and then re-rip everything in WAV!
If your UPnP *SERVER* transcodes those FLACs to WAVs (i.e. uncompressed audio) for sending to the NDX then *IN THEORY* the NDX will give gapless playback...
quote:
Originally posted by Adrian Pasciuta:
Are these limitations caused by uPNP? Perhaps that is the problem.
In a word - Yup!
In our own testing with numerous UPnP servers and UPnP clients we found that there is a *HUGE* disparity in what actually works correctly with what - this is one of the reasons that we had to bring out the UnitiServe to give a simple to implement (for the customer) UPnP server that we could *GUARANTEE* would work with our UPnP clients.
Basically "Universal" isn't as universal as you might expect...
Phil
