New Naim DAC at my house today - initial thoughts and experiments.
Posted by: GrahamFinch on 11 December 2009
I have been lucky enough to acquire a new Naim DAC from my dealer today. To put things into perspective for you I want to use it instead of a Dacmagic used with a SOnos wireless system to stream music from my PC to my main system (cds3\555ps\552\250-2, Allaes, powerlines and hilines etc. The digital cable is an Atlas coax cable.
Initially I played a few tracks on the existing Sonos\Dacmagic and then connected the Naim Dac. At this point I used the same Chord Cobra 3 phono to din lead that I used with the Dacmagic. Bearing in mind the Naim DAC was just out of the box it sounded pretty good but with a degree of harshness and sibilence I did not like.
As Naim recommend DIN connections I swapped the Cobra 3 for the standard Naim grey interconnect. This improved the sibilence but maybe at the expense of something else. Overall thought I thought it sounded more natural and less strident. Possibly the edginess would have eased anyway as the unit burns in but I would suggest it is something to consider.
After a while I used one of my Hilines to replace the standard interconnect and this borught about a fantastic imporvement, in the way it usually does. CLeaner, more dynamic, quieter background, better separation etc. A while later I substituted the standard mains lead with a Powerline and another huge improvement followed. This brought the overallpresentation towards the sound I get from the CDS3\555ps
I will try over the weekend to see which cable gives most benefit i.e if forced to choose only one cable whether it should be the Powerline or the Hiline.
I listened happily for ages and then the final experiment was to add the 555ps. It is worth pointing out that wHen adding an external ps the DAC itself must still be powered from its own power socket. It is not necessary to use a Powerline on the DAC at this point as it will only power the software side of the unit whilst the external ps will power the D\A conversion side of things. So at this point the Powerline was connceted to the 555ps. This took the setup to another dimension but whether the setup rivalled or beat my CDS3\555ps is hard to say at this stage. I only have one 555ps so would have needed to swap everything about. I sense the DAC\555ps was probably slightly more laid back than the CDS3 but I will hopefully try that experiment later this weekend.
My conclusions so far are that the new DAC is very good but can sound significantly better with the Hiline and Powerline added. I would suggest if you have a higher end system you really ought to consider these as a priority as this setup represents great value in my view, especially considering the significant extra cost of an external ps.
I would like to have tried a Naim DC1 digital cable instead of my Atlas as I have read that these are very good, albeit £225 each. Presumably the DAC was designed around this cable. Unfortunately my dealer did not have one to try.
The Sonos system works a treat with the DAC and is a very convenient way of listening to music.I haven't yet tried playing from a USB stick or any other digital source.
My overall conclusion based on a few hours listening is that I will not be retuning the DAC to the dealer and will be enquiring about the possibility of getting a deal on another Powerline and a Hiline.
For those of you waiting I think it will be worth it.
Initially I played a few tracks on the existing Sonos\Dacmagic and then connected the Naim Dac. At this point I used the same Chord Cobra 3 phono to din lead that I used with the Dacmagic. Bearing in mind the Naim DAC was just out of the box it sounded pretty good but with a degree of harshness and sibilence I did not like.
As Naim recommend DIN connections I swapped the Cobra 3 for the standard Naim grey interconnect. This improved the sibilence but maybe at the expense of something else. Overall thought I thought it sounded more natural and less strident. Possibly the edginess would have eased anyway as the unit burns in but I would suggest it is something to consider.
After a while I used one of my Hilines to replace the standard interconnect and this borught about a fantastic imporvement, in the way it usually does. CLeaner, more dynamic, quieter background, better separation etc. A while later I substituted the standard mains lead with a Powerline and another huge improvement followed. This brought the overallpresentation towards the sound I get from the CDS3\555ps
I will try over the weekend to see which cable gives most benefit i.e if forced to choose only one cable whether it should be the Powerline or the Hiline.
I listened happily for ages and then the final experiment was to add the 555ps. It is worth pointing out that wHen adding an external ps the DAC itself must still be powered from its own power socket. It is not necessary to use a Powerline on the DAC at this point as it will only power the software side of the unit whilst the external ps will power the D\A conversion side of things. So at this point the Powerline was connceted to the 555ps. This took the setup to another dimension but whether the setup rivalled or beat my CDS3\555ps is hard to say at this stage. I only have one 555ps so would have needed to swap everything about. I sense the DAC\555ps was probably slightly more laid back than the CDS3 but I will hopefully try that experiment later this weekend.
My conclusions so far are that the new DAC is very good but can sound significantly better with the Hiline and Powerline added. I would suggest if you have a higher end system you really ought to consider these as a priority as this setup represents great value in my view, especially considering the significant extra cost of an external ps.
I would like to have tried a Naim DC1 digital cable instead of my Atlas as I have read that these are very good, albeit £225 each. Presumably the DAC was designed around this cable. Unfortunately my dealer did not have one to try.
The Sonos system works a treat with the DAC and is a very convenient way of listening to music.I haven't yet tried playing from a USB stick or any other digital source.
My overall conclusion based on a few hours listening is that I will not be retuning the DAC to the dealer and will be enquiring about the possibility of getting a deal on another Powerline and a Hiline.
For those of you waiting I think it will be worth it.
quote:Originally posted by js:This works fine for me but have you also done the comparison with a Naim or Linn Hidef download streamed at full WAV? What are you using for rips? There's debate here but you're plenty far enough along to at least try one of the offset corrected rippers like XLD, DBpoweramp or EAC. May make differences more pronounced. You may also want to try just copying a file or 2 to a hard drive or quality high speed(only because they tend to be higher quality in general) stick and play directly for fun.quote:Originally posted by T38.45:
....even a DAC+Majik DS can not touch a LP12+Radikal/Urika....
it is simple not from this world....
I don't know why (since I am frequently at my dealer) but I briefly heard a Linn Hi Res download for the first time last week. It was played through a HDX/DAC/XPS and then through a Klimax DS (sans Dynamik). My impression - truly without words
Gregg
I don't know why (since I am frequently at my dealer) but I briefly heard a Linn Hi Res download for the first time last week. It was played through a HDX/DAC/XPS and then through a Klimax DS (sans Dynamik). My impression - truly without words
Gregg[/QUOTE]
Which one sounded best?
Gregg[/QUOTE]
Which one sounded best?
You may well be right but the oint was that perhsps you could now hear a difference. No harm in trying and don't use lossless if you decide to do another experiment. If not than just enjoy.quote:Originally posted by T38.45:
hi Jochen,
no, i will not test further sources (ATV, mac mini etc) because i have a Majik DS....the combi is perfect for me and the remote control (ipod touch with songbook) is great....
... think that the DAC will improve over time, so i will keep the DAC...
i used for ripping xld, eac, dbpoweramp, didn't hear a difference here.. i stream from qnap over wlan (works perfect!!!!)...
...reflecting now,,,, if you already have a streamer on the level of a Majik DS you don't need a DAC! the DAC will bring you a brighter, more open stage, more details and a lot more NAIM punch :-) ...point is: how much are you willing to spend for this "more"?
...my biggest sound improvement so far was 282 HC to 282 SC, this sound improvement is not that what you'll get when changing from Majik DS to/with DAC!
ralf
quote:Originally posted by Hans Vereecken:
I don't know why (since I am frequently at my dealer) but I briefly heard a Linn Hi Res download for the first time last week. It was played through a HDX/DAC/XPS and then through a Klimax DS (sans Dynamik). My impression - truly without words
Gregg
Which one sounded best?[/QUOTE]
Klimax DS I have heard many times - HDX many times - HDX/DAC/XPS only heard about 20 minutes. Preferred the Klimax - significantly so with the one Hi Res song.
quote:Originally posted by glevethan:
Klimax DS I have heard many times - HDX many times - HDX/DAC/XPS only heard about 20 minutes. Preferred the Klimax - significantly so with the one Hi Res song.
I've got a Klimax DS on loan over the Christmas period. Having fun with 24/96 music
Graham
quote:Originally posted by Graham Russell:quote:Originally posted by glevethan:
Klimax DS I have heard many times - HDX many times - HDX/DAC/XPS only heard about 20 minutes. Preferred the Klimax - significantly so with the one Hi Res song.
I've got a Klimax DS on loan over the Christmas period. Having fun with 24/96 music
Graham
Post your impressions when you are finished.
Gregg
quote:Originally posted by T38.45:
Hi Jochen,
100% agree...!
what i found as well is that the DAC needs the most time (in my naim history) for sound improvement...even my 282, 250 didn't take that long time...right now, it sound VERY good...maybe this helps....
MajikDS: church
DAC: cathedral
MajikDS: chorus (singer from "here around the corner")
DAC: Westminster chor
MajikDS: you see the singer, see her eyes
DAC: you see the colour of her eyes and smell her perfume
MajikDS: the room is there
DAC: the room "breathing" ..somehow
it is really a great gear....thank you NAIM!
regards ralf
merry christmas to all
is what you mean now, that after the burn in period the naim dac is starting to get much better then the majik ds ?
quote:Originally posted by T38.45:
Yes!but it really depends what source you use...
i see , so the above statements ( church / cathedral ) are always when you add the dac to the majik, not comparing them side by side this time ?...sorry i just want to understand