Mackerras Mahler 6

Tam

Thanks for that. Will definitely acquire.

G

Me too, thanks Tam! I'm interested in the music, the conductor, AND the orchestra (which is fairly local to me).

Cheers,

Earwicker

Same for me really, I love Mackerras and Mahler (though he's recorded precious little of it - only 1 and 5 with the RLPO on emi's classics for pleasure, as far as I'm aware). I spotted it a couple of days ago on the radio 3 message board, which was lucky since otherwise I wouldn't have looked at it - I don't generally think much of bbc music magazine.

Just glad I could point it out to a few people here.


regards,

Tam

quote:

Originally posted by Tam:
Just glad I could point it out to a few people here.


regards,

Tam

Glad you did - I've just bought a copy and had a very enjoyable listen! Warmly recommended to anyone wanting to hear this great work afresh.

All the best,

Earwicker

I got it today. Perhaps rather "light", but then I'm used to Karajan"s remarkable reading.

And the applause at the end is so intrusive. Why do they include this?

G

quote:

Originally posted by graham55:
I got it today. Perhaps rather "light", but then I'm used to Karajan"s remarkable reading.

And the applause at the end is so intrusive. Why do they include this?

G

Ah well I find Karajan a tad "stodgy" in the 6th. I quite liked Mackerras's approach with the lithe BBC Phil; a few minor mishaps but generally fine.

Why is applause at the end intrusive? Doesn't bother me, I quite like being reminded that someone was listening.

EW

I would just have liked a quiet moment for reflection at the end of this of all symphonies. (I got the Goerne/Brendel Winterreise last year. It's wonderful, but there you get applause before and after the performance, which again I find intensely intrusive.)

Anyway, I'm glad to have got the Mahler and will now have to acquire Mackerras's Mahler First and Fifth.

G

EW,

How would you rate the Mackerras Mahler 6 against the Tennstedt recording?

Regarding applause, I have to say I'm with Graham on this. I have a copy of the Shostakovich Symphony No.5 conducted by Alexander Dmitriev with the Leningrad Symphony Orchestra recorded live at the City Halls, Glasgow, on Linn records, and the applause at the end is really annoying. Admittedly, it is a magnificent performance but the audience erupts before the final notes of the symphony have faded.

Graham, just out of interest, how would you say the Goerne/Brendel Winterreise compares with the Schreier/Richter live recording apropos general audience noise, coughs and such like?
Assuming you have both, of course.

Basil

I don't have the Schreier/Richter, but I hope that that doesn't make me a bad person! Actually, I do intend to get it, as I think that it may have been re-released recently. Other than the applause alredy mentioned, the Goerne/Brendel recording seems to me remarkably good.

My own favourite recording is the 1950s EMI mono recording with Hans Hotter and Gerald Moore.

G

I don't have Tennstedt's Mahler 6th unfortunately. Much as I admired him, he is tragically underrepresented in my CD collection.

W.r.t. Winterreise, I have MANY!! The new Brendel/Goerne recording is the one that tends to get listened to these days, although I wouldn't want to be without Schreier/Schiff. (It's interesting to see how far he's come since his early Winterreise with Graham Johnson - a recording I could never get on with.) Peter Schreier is one of my all time favourite singers - if you haven't heard his Wolf recordings, you're REALLY missing something! I MUST acquire his Das Lied, there's a limit to how much longer I can live without it!!! Going back to Winterreise, the Brendel/Goerne has it for me thanks to Brendel's contribution, which offers superior sound and much greater insight compared to Schiff - great though he is. The Fischer-Dieskau/Brendel recordings too desperately need adding to my collection. I remember hearing them perform Dichterliebe on the radio a while ago, but I don't think the recordings are available in the UK.

As far as applause goes, it really doesn't bother me. In fact, it tends to irritate me when it is omitted from live recordings; it's a token of audience/performer interaction and appreciation, a reminder that music was intended to be performed to a listening audience. It also adds to the much vaunted sense of "being there".

Anyway, best wishes,

Earwicker

PS I heard Brendel and Goerne perform Schwannangesang and An die Ferne Geliebte in Edinburgh a few years ago and got autographs!! Quite a thrill, I just thought I'd share that with you!

quote:

I don't have Tennstedt's Mahler 6th unfortunately. Much as I admired him, he is tragically underrepresented in my CD collection.

Shame on you! Add this to the Das Lied and ignore the savaging Richard Osborne dishes out in the Gramophile review.

I'm slightly with other people here as far as applause is concerned (sometimes it's good, e.g. at the end of a good mahler 7 I do want to clap). I prefer what they do on Abbado's recent discs where the applause is a separate track so you could programme it out. Would rather not have had it here.

Have not heard the Tennstedt (the only Mahler of his I've heard is 8, which is good, if not the best).


regards,

Tam

quote:

Originally posted by Tam:
Have not heard the Tennstedt (the only Mahler of his I've heard is 8, which is good, if not the best).Tam

I can't get on with the 8th. Period. I'm prepared to accept that the fault may lie with me, however. Nos 2 & 9 are closest to my heart, with Das Lied above all: the REAL 9th!!

EW

quote:

Originally posted by Earwicker:

I can't get on with the 8th. Period. I'm prepared to accept that the fault may lie with me, however. Nos 2 & 9 are closest to my heart, with Das Lied above all: the REAL 9th!!

EW

You mean any 8? Period? If so, that's a shame, I love the 8th (Solti is especially fine, as is Sinopoli). I just think the scale of it is so wonderful - that opening organ blast with 'veni, creator spiritus' is something quite special (that said - it does take some holding together).

Not the biggest fan of 2. Personally, 7 is probably my favourite, though it's tough to do really well. I recently heard the Walter Das Lied, which went quite a way towards bringing me back around to the piece (until then I'd only heard Bernstein's dg one which wasn't entirely convincing).


regards,

Tam

Yeah, I meant Mahler's 8th - the symphony of a million! I can't make my peace with it (pardon the pun!).

Das Lied is one of the great masterpieces of all time, in my humble opinion, but VERY hard to get right; don't give up on it till you've heard Janet Baker. (Her definitive recording with Haitink is available at budget price now, for those of you who're Das Liedless, that's the one to have.)

Better do a bit of cooking, catch you later,

EW

I've heard good things about that Haitink recording - will have to keep an eye out for it. Like I said thought, I did like the Walter one (will have to listen to it again - though I still have a substantial backlog from my excesses in the christmas sales - but that's another story!),


regards,

Tam

quote:

Yeah, I meant Mahler's 8th - the symphony of a million! I can't make my peace with it (pardon the pun!).

They're calling it the symphony of a million now! Well there's inflation for you!

Seriously, I understand exactly what you mean about the 8th, I have problems with it too! I find it a bit of a curate’s egg, there are some parts, which are simply excellent, but there is also quite a lot that isn't. I have the Tennstedt and the Solti recordings, plus I’ve heard it live at the Royal Albert Hall with James Levine conducting. Can’t for the life of me recall the orchestra though! Anyone care to hazard a guess?

Anyone else wanting Mackerras' Mahler Six had better move fast, as the current BBC Music magazine will be replaced by the March issue within the next few days.

G

EW

I agree with your list of top Mahler favourites. However I would add the 1st and the 3rd and the 5th. The 8th is best saved for a concert hall rather than at home.

The symphony I have always struggled with is the 6th! But I bought a copy of the BBC magazine and have been working at it. I think I am beginning to understand it better.

David

quote:

Originally posted by David Sutton:
EW

The symphony I have always struggled with is the 6th! But I bought a copy of the BBC magazine and have been working at it. I think I am beginning to understand it better.

David

Yes, I had to work at it a bit. I gather Boulez has recorded it with the VPO and this is the recording to persuade all doubters; I haven't heard it, however.

Best wishes,

EW

I've struggled a bit with 6, but I think Jansons on LSO live and Abbado are both well worth hearing.

The 3rd still hasn't quite ever convinced me and while 1 is nice, I think it lacks something, depth perhaps, easier listening than mahler should be. Personally 4 and 7 are probably my favourites.


regards,

Tam

Well, there you go. Nos 4 and 7 really struggle to get anywhere with me. I have a couple of other recordings of 6 but neither are those recommended above. I will keep at it for a while, but already feel me slipping back to the comfort (!) of Das Leider Von Der Erde, the 2nd and the 9th. With the 1st and 3rd making an occasional appearance.

David

Each to his own I guess. I can understand 7 being problematic, but 4. Try Szell's classic account with the Cleveland orchestra.

As to 7, it is tough, it only reall started to make sense to me after I read a programme note which described the symphony as a long journey through the night. I always feel that the outer two movements are the strongest and I can't see how anyone could object to the fantastic final movement (even if it's ripped off from Wagner's master singers). I think where most people struggle is the difficult middle movements, however, the brilliance of the outer movement, out into the light, only really makes sense in the context of coming out of the darkness. I find it, if done well, a very draining but rewarding experience. Abbado's newest account with the BPO is well worth a try.


regards,

Tam

Thanks Tam,

Number 7 is parked as far as I am concerned. But I have the Cleveland/Szell version of 4. the symphony that I have the most versions of is the second. And that is often used as a standard for reviewing the performance of my system. That final movement............

David

I have to agree on the final movement of no.2, it really is quite something (I also like the 4th movment). Have you heard Abbado's new Lucerne recording?


regards,

Tam