What are considered be THE WORST 'round earther' amps amongst Naimies?

Audio Research.

Musical Fidelity

Cary for valve.

YBA for solid state. ( altho, there are just too many )

Easy : Vincent, Musical Fidelity, Arcam , Krell, Mark Levinson.

Rob.

Hello this too is a good one, but have you actually heard the gear you so mention,like in your house or are you just throwing darts,what have you heard compared to Naim ? be honest,Ben r

Ben,

The amps I've mentioned I've actually heard. Not in my house however.

Rob.

Based on my experience, conrad-johnson amplification is very round earth.

MBM

Where would you guys place Chord amps???? and dont say in a skip!? I mean flat vs round... Im interested because im own some Chord and im considering replacing them with Naim

Conrad Johnson seconded, they're consistently bad.

Audio Research can be pretty good (particularly their CD player), much better than Krell. Also I've never heard a Chord system that I liked. OK they look impressive, but they sound like reluctant performers.

Andrew

Andrew Randle
Linn Binn Sinner

Do you have a Stereophile?

Open to the 'Recommended Components' section.

Now look under the heading
"Class A: Electronics"

Thank you, I have enjoyed this post.

David

Wow we have some real anti tube people here,not that i agree or disagree, but what about solid state, my choice would be Spectral as round earth as it gets

Errr! ........ nobody's mentioned Audio-Lab (or TAG McClaren) have they ??

David

Audiolab 8000A.

I owned one from new for nearly a year.

Nearly a decade later, I had a temporary job as a hi-fi sales assistant, and occasionally had to sell the things. I was always pleased when someone wanted to listen to an alternative, because it meant I could potentially save them some money by introducing them to an Arcam amp for half the price. I'm not sure how many I sold of either - not many.

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Originally posted by ben r:
Wow we have some real anti tube people here,not that i agree or disagree, but what about solid state, my choice would be Spectral as round earth as it gets

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I've heard Spectral equipment on two limited occasions and thought it had some pretty decent PRaT. IMO, Spectral is much closer to flat earth than the c-j stuff I mentioned earlier.

(I guess one man's round earth is another man's ... oh, I don't know - you get the point; I just had a different opinion of Spectral gear, although my experience with it was somewhat limited.)

Regards, MBM

Hello I will update my comment on Spectral, that was on equipment i heard along time ago(in my house though) have not heard the new stuff, I have heard Mark levinson in my house....round earth all the way for me anyway...I will make a very positive comment on VTL I own a 2.5 pre and a st85 tetrode/triode amp great stuff,very musical and for the money akiller,also Luke Manley (whom I have met) is a music enthusiast and a gent's gent,just my thoughts,Ben r

Amongst the ones I have owned, it's got to be the Musical Fidelity A1 which I stupidly bought unheard after reading glowing comments from Colloms, Kessler, Gold etc. Sleep city or what?! Soundly beaten by the ancient Quad II valves that succeeded it.

Rana

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Originally posted by ben r:
I will make a very positive comment on VTL I own a 2.5 pre and a st85 tetrode/triode amp great stuff,very musical and for the money akiller,also Luke Manley (whom I have met) is a music enthusiast and a gent's gent,just my thoughts,Ben r

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As Naimed-in-NY said, one man's round earth is....

I used to own VTL 5.5 pre and thought it was slow. ( all relative, of course, as I thought it was faster than 2.5 at least )

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Originally posted by ben r:
Wow we have some real anti tube people here,not that i agree or disagree, but what about solid state, my choice would be Spectral as round earth as it gets

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...and you are surprised by that?

To Kuma, how fast do you want to go?? faster than the beat, I have found the 2.5 VTL to be one of the all time great preamps with both tube and solid state and i have heard the new vtl 7.5 preamp in my house as well as a 5.5. all great preamps but for the money the 2.5 cant be touched..he is selling it too cheap,how many products can anybody say that about....maybe a nait...like I said I have heard a fair amount of the hi end in my house not just casually here and there...including a Linn cd12, just my thoughts, Ben r

I realise everyone's reference and preference would be different.
VTL makes excellent stuff. But came to realise that they aren't for me. I would never think of 'em as particularly fast albeit they sound masculine.
In the same price point as TL2.5, Quicksilver valve linestage was more to my liking altho, it has a limited application than VTL because of its fixed higher gain and output impedance.

But I thought would be fun to see if there is any consensus amongst the round-earthed amplifiers.

So far interesting results...

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Originally posted by domfjbrown:
I dem'd the Arcam A85, NAIT5 (couldn't afford ) and the Rega Mira 2000 (which I ended up with). I can assure you that the A85 was far inferior to the 8000A and at double the cost.

Sure, the Audiodrab isn't that hot, but it's far better than dull as dishwater, overrated blooming Arcam - uuuuugh!

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I haven't heard an Arcam or Audiolab product for more than a decade. I cannot begin to imagine what Arcams sound like these days, judging by all the negative comments I've heard.

Worst round earth amps i have are, without a doubt, Musical Fidelity. Totally PRaTless.

My vote goes to the older Quads. Lifeless and with the strange ability to make some music sound out of tune. Never liked them. Haven't heard the latest models though so can't comment. Secondly all the Musical Fidelity ranges from the past 15 years or so. They appear to be designed without any consideration for rhythm at all.

Yours in Music

Syd

Based on earlier posts, there seems to be a consensus: flat = good, round = bad. I think that is over-simplifying the issue.

Sound quality is very complex and yes, PRaT is an essential element, but not the only one. There are very good "round earth" amps and, yes, very bad ones.

I have spent a great number of very enjoyable evenings listening to valve amps (Nagra VPA, Audio Research, CJ, Jolida), with their warm and natural timbres. OK, most of them are too soft for my taste and I prefer the Naim sound, but let's not assume that PRaT is the only way to go.

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Originally posted by ClaudeP:
Based on earlier posts, there seems to be a consensus: flat = good, round = bad. I think that is over-simplifying the issue.

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I agree that it is a matter of degree and a good system should balace all the elements. New Naim attempts at that. ( they do warm and natural timbre thing along with soundstage/imaging )

that's why I said 'THE WORST'. You know the kind that ignores the fun part all together. The element of PRAT is not the only thing to make up a good sound, yet it needs to have it, however subtle. How much to that degree, it differs by a listener it seems.

From the posts, Musical Fatality ( I am not familiar with their stuff ) takes the Snooz Award.

Interesting for valve, no mention of Cary. A warm and cuddly musical mess. Nagra and ARC are not bad at all if you compare to Cary.