"Alternative" Power? - Up to the challenge?
Posted by: Mark Gilbert on 02 January 2001
Please let me know of any experiences that have been tried. Thank You!.
Mark
fyi - I already run a separate circuit dedicated to my system.
I am considering this to address two issues: a) eliminating noise generated by the ignition system of my furnace (without using filtration for the stereo), and b) supporting consideration of ways to reduce my dependency upon the "grid" of commercial power production
If I was at your problem, I would ask Naim to give me a solution to power my system with a batteries (like car batteries) that should filter all the unwanted peaks out of the electric supplier and should save you an expensive solar or wind power supplier.
Arie
Give it up. I once tried using an emergency generator hooked-up via extension cord and the music sounded so bad in addition to having it sound like someone was mowing the lawn for two hours outside. Even though your electricity is full of noise, it is also smoother than anything you could devise. My power company uses a facinating method of lifting and lowering water to "smooth" and maintain proper voltage throughout the day. To duplicate this would be financially impossible. If you can get the power company to install a separate meter (as I've done) it costs about $650. Then install two circuits, one phase for the power-amp(s) and one for everything else. This reduces furnace and refrigerator noise substantially as well as sounding better. If you still feel you must create your own power, I'd suggest an exercise bike (work-out and listen to music) or if you'd like a pet, a hamster spinning a running wheel powering your hi-fi would certainly get you in the Hall of Naim-Faim.
Have Fun,
Ron The Mon
I like to be "attacked" and I may be wrong many times and it is okay with me if someone tells me I'm wrong.
If I understand Mark well, the electricity at his place is not as "clean" as should be.
Bypassing "dirty" AC power with batteris (and be ready to work with DC at the battery output) solves this problem as the battary works as a condeser and gives an excelent "flat" dc power at output.
I think that if someone has great difficulties with AC power - this is the right way to try to solve it. There is a possibility if no other solution available, to tkae the output DC power from the Battery and then convert it again to an AC power, loosing energy but getting a beatifull sinus if doing it with good equipment.
If I'm steel miising something, please tell me.
Arie
Point your browser in the direction of Home Power Magazine for a peek into the world of renewable energy for nutters. The whole magazine is available, in PDF format.
There's a delighful article on here about making bodiesel from the waste oil from my local fish and chip shop that I fancy trying, bearing in mind the current fuel prices in the UK, were it not for the risk of being found out by customs and excise, or injuring myself with some pretty unpleasant chemicals. I could probably fund a pretty high-end Naim system from the savings!
Seriously though, the problem is energy storage (which has to be through DC batteries, usually Lead-Acid), and the conversion of the DC back to AC, in a clean way that's suiable for your Naim system.
Linn seem to think they can make switch-mode supplies that are quieter and more reliable than linear ones, but it would require significant work on your part to provide mains power to the Hi-Fi. A computer UPS could be used, running from the batteries, but the cleanliness and impedance of the supply would not be very good compared to the mains.
Andy.
Andrew L. Weekes
alweekes@audiophile.com
Regards
Chris
He stated it was clearly visible on an oscilloscope, and that high noise and low bandwidth were not good attributes for an audio PSU.
Whether different cell chemistries can offer different characteristics I'm not sure, but they all work in a similar way.
Andy.
Andrew L. Weekes
alweekes@audiophile.com
If a person HAS an AC source power but it is not a good value source, he can connect the AC power through a DC charger that POWERS batteries.
In this case, the batteris are acting like a capacitor and are giving a flat DC.
Using batteries without a charger that powers it continuesly from the AC, is not a good way because the inner impedance of the battery goes higher as the battery power goes lower and this changes the ability of the battery to give a stable current to the equipment at the battery output.
Arie
I admit that I haven't been optimistic about finding successful options. I also remember reading Julian's post about batteries not providing good power source as has been mentioned. I'm not optimistic about using AC to feed the batteries and using the batteries to power my system though I'll be interested to hear from anyone who has tried. This may remove the noise from my furnace but I wouldn't expect it to reduce my power consumption and it would add complexity.
David - you're right that I am interested in reducing my dependency, even if my Naim stays connected to the power company. My desire is largely driven by environmental considerations but reduced consumption is also favorable financially.
Ron - Thanks for the feedback. I have considered the potential of running a separately metered line to the house and that would resolve the noise problem. The furnace itself must be replaced within a couple years so I can also resolve the obvious problem at that time. Naturally I'd expect a wonderful musical improvement by running the separate metered line as you have. I can't tell how much better that would be than my 30amp circuit and I'd have to invest the money before knowing that answer. My cost would be far greater than $650 and I haven't yet convinced myself that it's worth the cost/hassle. We'll see. It's too bad this wouldn't reduce my power consumption.
Thanks Andrew! - I'll be doing some browsing on the link you shared.
Thanks again for all the replies. I'll look forward to reading any more.
Mark
I remember a ("Equinox?") documentary on Channel 4 (UK) a couple of years ago about ball lightning. It featured a guy in the US who had managed to build a machine for reliably creating small-scale ball lightning by getting a DC supply to arc across some very substantial contacts. The "ball" produced was about 3" across and lasted about 5 seconds. The apparatus was in a garden shed because he had no space left in his garage.
The garage was full of ex-submarine batteries.
Makes you think, doesn't it…
(What's he building in there?)
Best;
Mark
(an imperfect
forum environment is
better than none)
quote:
i remember the comments about the noise coming from batteries. would they still be suitable for a dc motor equipped turntable as the batteries wont have to react to large changes in demmand?
It's my understanding that there can be a considerable change in current draw caused by drag of the stylus in the groove on loud passages.
cheers, Martin
I use quotation marks above because many people, but not everyone would consider the change to be an actual improvement. Once again this comes down to the perception of "musical" versus "non-musical".
EnJoy!
Mark
This weekend I put a separate line in to the hifi from my mains RCD box. I had a lot of noise in the transformers of the power supplies and my dealer, Naim and Hifi+ all stated that I would get a "BIG" improvement in sound. So I started the job on Saturday using a 32 Amp circuit breaker and 40 Amp (6mm) twin and earth cable. This was connected to three double sockets on the wall eliminating the need for a multi-socket extension block. The job took nearly two days and was a lot of hard work. I approached the listening test with some skepticism and waited for the equipment to warm up using a CD. All I can say is WOW! The biggest area of improvement was with my Linn Mimik CD player which isn't really up to the job in this system but I think I have achieved a 2X improvement here. The LP12 is just the same but the music seems to be a lot "cleaner". I wish could describe it more articulately. All I can say is that this is the best £100 I've ever spent. I'm going to try get a low impedance Earth next!
Great news!
Mark