I have waited a few weeks before posting my findings with Hutter. First impressions can be deceptive & I really wanted to get the measure of these stands.
My previous support arrangement was a bit of a mixed bag. The TT & CD were on Mana. The tuner & amps on modified Tripod & Greenline. I had always been fairly satisfied with the old setup, but guessed that latent potential in the hardware was not being realised.
After about a year of listening to different stands & also listening to peoples opinions that I respect my short list was either all Mana or all Hutter. I plumped for Hutter. Had I gone for Mana I doubt if I would be writing this now as plenty of fine words on that subject have graced this forum.
I ended up buying 2 stacks each comprising of hi fi base & 4 extra shelves. I chose to have 50mm spacers inbetween the shelves, giving a distance between shelves of 140mm, ideal for Naim boxes. Assembly was simplicity itself. Level the sub base, make sure the spikes are tight (no tuning here) & add the shelves. I also connected the 2 stacks with lateral 50mm spacers. Total cost of all this including shipping from Longtone Hifi in Vienna was just under 1100 UKP.
At this time my SNAXO & a Hicap were at Naim for service, so the system was in a somewhat smaller scale passive mode, although I was still using both 250's, a bit like a pair of 125's .
My initial reaction was quite favourable, but there was an annoying edge to the sound, a bit like when my Mana was not in tune. My instinct told me that the cause were the lateral joining bars, so I tried the 2 stands without them. Immediately the edge vanished & incredible music filled my sitting room.
I lived with the passive system for 2 weeks before the boxes came back from Salisbury. In that time the stands improved almost daily. I guess because they are made of wood a longer settling in period should be expected. I don't beleive that a quick dem in a shop will give you any idea of the stands ultimate performance.
Over these 2 weeks the bass got tighter & deeper. The top end became more open & natural. At the end of this fortnight the system had never sounded so good & was _FAR_ better than the old active one.
The CD player sounded less like a CD player. Vinyl had less surface noise & on all sources the ability to delve deeply into the mix was easy. This ability is not a virtue unless accompanied with cohesion & musical flow. The system had both these in spades. The more music I played I realised that it was now streets ahead of the old active one. Then the SNAXO & Hicap came back from Naim.....
This lifted things up another gear. To be honest probably no greater an improvement than when I went active with my old racks.
I have now lived with a fully Huttered system for only 3 weeks yet I do not have the slightest doubt that my choice of Hutter was the correct one.
The overriding feeling that I have with Hutter is that you can hear, understand & connect with the performance in front of you in a far easier & less fatiguing way than ever before.
when the Hutter first arrived my initial reaction was that the musical improvement was equal to when I got my LP12 back in '85. I felt this could be a bit of a knee jerk reaction to the new presentation. Yet 3 weeks on I still feel the same way.
If you are looking for a very serious rack I think you would be barmy not to check out Hutter.
Bob
[This message was edited by bob atherton on THURSDAY 30 November 2000 at 14:50.
[This message was edited by bob atherton on THURSDAY 30 November 2000 at 14:51.]
[This message was edited by bob atherton on THURSDAY 30 November 2000 at 14:56.]
Posted on: 04 December 2000 by Former member
Andrew,
The metal joining bars are there to join two racks together horizontally not vertiacally. I always left them out in my system because they always seemed unnecessary and as they are not loaded like the uprights they shouldn't help much. Sound wise. When I eventually tried these lateral bars my assumptions were confirmed with similar findings to Bob.
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Bob,
Congrats on the new supports, glad you recognise the musical benifits the Hutter brings over most other racks.
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Vuk,
You probably won't read this as this whjole thread doesn't agree with your carefully protected beliefs. But I would like to answer your criticism of the build quality of Hutter you made by comparing it to Ikea furniture. It is nothing of the sort. Fair enough that many will find the overall look is not to their taste and some will prefer the sound of other stands but the build quality of Hutter is beyond reproach using as it does very high quality veneers and varnishes and great care. The company has made high quality, hand-crafted, made to order furniture for 50 years in Austria and to survive at this I think you would agree they needed good quality, this has been carried over into the stands.
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On a broader note it almost seems like people can't believe a stand will sound good unless it looks like shit, happily this isn't true, you can have your cake and munch liberally upon it.
Cheers
Jason
Posted on: 04 December 2000 by bob atherton
Guys,
Sorry to have taken a bit of time to get back to you, can't drag myself away from the music.
John Channing, I bought the basic shelves in standard 600 mm width. I know I could have got 500 mm made up, but I had only heard the standard ones, & I didn't want to risk it sounding different with narrower units. I also like the proportions of the 600 with. The side & top gaps around the boxes to me seems well balanced.
John Clark, sorry the local vultures have feasted themselves on all my old stands.
Andrew Randle, Jason has kindly explained the joining bars. The odd thing with them is that they link the first level above the sub base. They would only make any sense to me if they linked the sub bases.
Jason Hector, thanks for answering the query from Andrew. Your enthusiasm for Hutter now makes perfect sense!
Arun Mehan, you don't _have_ to hear Hutter but if you can track some down I don't think you will be disappointed. As for psychiatry, I guess it's only a short step from Hutter to Nutter!
Bob.
Posted on: 05 December 2000 by Tony L
quote:
For all UK readers interested in hearing / buying (its the same once you have heard it ;-> ) Hutter:
I heard a dem recently of Hutter vs Quadraspire, and to my ears whilst it was obvious that the Hutter had far better sonic traits, the Quadraspire allowed the equipment to time noticeably better. To say this surprised me is a massive, massive understatement.
For me the strengths / weaknesses were (and remember this is my opinion - I'm not trying to start a bloody war):
Hutter: Clean, open, realistic resolution of timbre, and plenty of low level detail and acoustic space. Downside was a lack of swing, groove, and musical flow compared to the Quadraspire. Sounded like the brakes had been applied. Bottom line it sounds good but its timing is a bit sick.
Quadraspire: Very good musical flow, adequate groove. Downside from my perspective is poor timbre, dynamics, and detail resolution, obvious coloration, and a slightly shut in and mushy sound. Bottom line - it times well but sounds a bit sick.
Neither stand did anything at all to remotely shake my confidence in my own rather more ferrous purchasing decision, actually they did quite the opposite.
Tony.
Posted on: 05 December 2000 by Former member
Tony wrote ...
>>Hutter: ... Sounded like the brakes had been applied. Bottom line it sounds good but its timing is a bit sick.
I, like Bob, am very surprised you found the timing was off, I felt this was one of the areas it scored most highly over my Quadrasphire!
Really allowed you to understand what the musicians were trying to do. I think with some tracks this could sound like a slowing but in my system this was the more accurate and enjoyable result, conversely some music sounds faster with the Hutter, again I feel this was because it was supposed to. The Quadrasphire (which was my rack of choice pre-Hutter) could sometimes lose the plot with complex interaction and by smearing note edges slightly ended up reducing the variation intended in the pace, the Hutter does this less IMHO.
If you are ever in the London area drop me a line and come have a listen, you can then hear what Shahinians can do as well.
Cheers
Jason
Posted on: 08 December 2000 by Former member
>> Are you the same Jason Hector who writes for HiFi+? Is my recent less-than-favourable review of that magazine somehow related to this otherwise unprovoked insult?
I am indeed that Jason Hector, but your opinions of the magazine would not affect my comments anywhere else or on other subjects. In defence of the mag. we are improving all the time and getting a good response from people into HiFi and music and I think we do a pretty good job.
I think you gave your opinion on the mag quite a while a go and since then I have agreed with many things you have said, source first, anti-ferrous etc., of course of late we have disagreed heavily on the whole Mana thing.
>>Grasping at straws? Apart from some very obvious kidding around with Mick Parry, I don't recall making any comments about the build quality of Hutter.
I was sure you had but, I think I had taken the thread (or should that be lack of thread *!#~ software!) and the comment out of context and so please accept my apologies for missrepresenting your opinions.
Cheers
Jason
