Gaggia MDF opinions?

It's been a while since I did the research, so I can't remember all the reasons, but I ended deciding that the MDF wasn't sufficient. Although I haven't gotten around to buying one yet, my two options are Mazzer Mini or La Cimbali Junior. I would probably prefer the Cimbali, because it's shorter, but the Mazzer looks cooler. Here are a few resources:

• Great info source: www.coffeegeek.com
  
• Review: La Cimbali Junior
  
• Review: Mazzer Mini
  
• Best e-tailer: www.chriscoffee.com
  

-=> Mike Hanson <=-

Coffee news groups? Gosh.......

throb

While doing my research, it became clear that the Gaggia MDF and Ricilio Rocky grinders were considered high-end consumer devices, whereas the Mazzer Mini and La Cimbali Junior were low-end professional tools. For durability, etc., the professional products tended to win in most people's reviews.

This is purely from memory, though, and I can't remember all of the details. And if you think auditioning audio gear is a subjective thing, just dip your toe into the coffee world.

-=> Mike Hanson <=-

Dan--

I use, and have used, a Krups 203. I've had it for 12 years, use it at least once a day (twice in the winter) and it still works perfectly. ~$20 or so.

Mike is exactly right about subjectivity and coffee! Some of those folks make us look positively open-minded!

Best,

Bob

All, thanks for the info.

I've had an inexpensive Braun burr grinder for 4-5 years, but unfortunately it just isn't up to the task of grinding fine enough for espresso. Even on the finest setting I'm getting a double shot in 15 -17 seconds no matter how hard I tamp. Bob, if the Krups is a bean whacker, you really should try a burr grinder -- there's a very noticeable difference in the taste of the coffee when you have uniform grounds. Hummm, that did sound very hi-fi-speak ("you need an XPS...",etc.)

The Mazzer Mini seems overkill -- it's huge! However, I seen to recall this is Maxwellspeeds weapon of choice in achieving espresso perfection.

I get nice shots with pre-ground Illy, but Peets just opened up a store in Denver, which has me thinking...

I was hoping the MDF would be adequate but more reseach seems to be called for. I'm done obsessing about my hi-fi and bikes, so this seems like a good outlet.

Dan

Hi Dan,
I have not had a lot of experience of the MDF grinder, had an old second hand one that jammed but this is not typical of the MDF.

I now have a Rocky (doserless) and I think it is worth every extra penny over the MDF. The Rocky is classed as a “semi commercial” but in reality it would only be used in a small turnover shop for decaff say.
The Rocky looks good, it is finished in stainless steel, weighs about 18lb and differs from most grinders in its price range by having a powerful direct drive motor (same one as the professional MD40) rather that a gear reduction system, this makes it quieter, and it heats the beans and grinds up less because of the slow grinding speed. It also means that the burrs turn at a consistent speed rather than slowing and speeding under pressure, this makes for a more consistent grind (very important for espresso)
The burrs are the same size in both grinders but the Rocky’s are set in brass whereas a lot of others (including the MDF I THINK) are set in some sort of resin / plastic material. A last point is the amount of adjustment, this is important to be able to fine tune the grind. The Rocky has 55 click stop settings, the MDF 34. Obviously the Rocky’s stops are closer together allowing finer adjustment.
This is not to say the MDF is a bad grinder, it isn’t, but for a relatively small extra cost on a product that may last a lifetime you get a lot more grinder for your cash.

FWIW I chose the doserless because coffee should be ground fresh for each brew and for home use the doser is not used as a doser but as a dispenser. The doserless grinds directly into the portafilter, grinding just enough as you need at the time,.

Hope this has not been too long winded and sounding like a Rocky promotional handout, its just such a superior product and a pleasure to use,
John.

John

With doserless grinders do you just guess on the amount of coffee that goes into the basket?

Dan

Dan,
With a doserless no measure or metering of the grinds is provided. But you soon start to dose quite accurately by sight. At first I used to weigh the grinds in the porafilter but now I can grind accurately (to a gram) by using the portafilter as the measure.
The problem with dosers is that you have to fill each compartment of the doser in order to get the required full dose. The Rocky has six compartments. This means the unused grinds stay in there going stale and dry until they are next needed. Most users use the doser as a dispenser by repeatedly clicking the rotator handle, emptying each compartment as they go, until the required amount of grounds are in the portafilter and the doser empty ready for the next use, so why not cut out the middle man and grind directly into the portafilter?
IMO dosers are only useful in shops, or in dinner party situations, others may (will) disagree.

John.

PS. Just out of interest what sort of machine do you use?

John,

I see your point. I worked in a cafe for a summer as a student, and just got used to using a doser. Freshness wasn't an issue since it was in continous use. I have a Gaggia Classic -- so far it's performed flawlessly, and appears to be suprising well made for the cost. I presume a doserless Rocky would also come in handy for filling the occasional press pot (although probably when you have your grind dialed it best not to mess with the setting).

Dan

Dan--

Been there, done that, have the t-shirt. Tried a couple different grinders and although there is a SMALL difference, it is vastly overshadowed by the beans themselves. Rather like hifi--the source material rules!

Besides, I only do drip coffee at home.

I would be willing to bet you could not tell, in a blind test, the difference between coffee ground in my Krups vs. coffee ground in the Gaggia...

Best,

Bob

quote:

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Originally posted by Bob Edwards:
Besides, I only do drip coffee at home.

I would be willing to bet you could not tell, in a blind test, the difference between coffee ground in my Krups vs. coffee ground in the Gaggia...

---

Drip coffee is far more forgiving of the grind, although the coffee from my antique burr grinder does taste noticeably better than coffee ground in my old blade grinder.

When making espresso, however, it's crucial that the grind be fine and even. A blade grinder does neither, and burns the grinds in the attempt. The shot will not come off properly, the crema will not appear, and the ultimate result is dissatisfaction.

It's too bad that my antique grinder won't go fine enough for Espresso. As it is, I have to get it ground at a boutique or subsist with pre-ground Illy.

-=> Mike Hanson <=-

quote:

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As it is, I have to get it ground at a boutique or subsist with pre-ground Illy.

---

Yep, it's a tough life we lead, isn't it.

Dan

Bob,

For filter coffee your probably right -- though if you do admit there's a small difference, why not improve on something done 1-2 times a day just to save a few bucks spread over 5 years???

Mike is dead right about espresso however.

Speaking about source first, have you been to the new Peets in Cherry Creek? Peets is my favorite -- darker roasted than most, but not burnt like Starbucks. This could be urban myth, but years ago I was told the guy that started Starbucks used to work at Peets way back when.

Dan

Dan--

The reason I don't is that the difference is small and was swamped by the variations in the roast of the beans. And it wasn't always better.

And I'd agree on espresso--much more demanding of the grind.

And I have been to Peets....though for the moment I still prefer Peaberry and the now departed Java Plaza (where I learned how to roast!). Java used to be a couple of doors down from Rick in Ft. Collins.

Best,

Bob

Dan,
I also use a Classic and get good results. Yes the Rocky can easily be changed for your press pot, and put back just as it was because its click stops are numbered. As the beans age I find I have to lower the setting one or two clicks to compensate for the aging (only a week old) beans. Also different blends can be a few clicks different from each other.

When a grinder wasn’t available I used pre-ground Illy, Lavazza and some smaller brands, I found Illy was the only one ground fine enough to work with the Classic.
A blend I would like to try at the moment is “malibar gold” available in the Uk as green beans only, but you may be able to find it? Supposed to be a bit special. Perhaps one to look out for after you decide on the grinder,
John.

You may or may not find the FAQ on Expresso Coffee at Danny's Expresso FAQ interesting to read

He also distributes (or was doing recently) Malibar Gold - poke around his web site to get in contact with him.

Derek

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Dan

I have a Gaggia Classic and a Gaggia MDF grinder and both seem to work well to me. Easy to use, good for one off espressos or for a dinner party's worth.
I bought mine as a recon unit via the Gaggia UK website saving about 30% if I remember correctly.
What ever you choose finding the coffe you like, the technigue of making it exactly how you like it and getting the grind right will mke more difference that the grinder if it's a reasonable burr one.

Steve