True Genius

Chaps

I nominate Cardinal Jules Mazarin

Born of low Italian stock and died in 1661 as the Prime Minister of France and tutored Louis 14th how to run a country.

A fascinating and clever man.

Second to him...Margaret Thatcher......did more than any other peace time Prime Minister to get the nation back on its feet. She will never be forgotten.

Regards

Mick

I would nominate Ignatius Loyola as a very clever man, but not great.

Palestrina and Bach were as clever musically in their periods as Mozart was in his.

Margaret Thatcher might be competing with George W Bush for Mick Parry's choice if this thread is running in a few years time.

Deane

Mick, thats just a joke from a bleeding-heart liberal from the colonies.

My vote would go to Leonardo Da Vinci.

He managed to excel in three fields that one man struggles to make a mark in.

He was a reknowned scientist, inventor and artist.

It could be argued that the first and second achievements may be linked but seldom has one man proved successful in science and art.

A genius among genii.

"Gordon Broon" for convincing Britain that it's doing well, when in fact it's in
greater long term debt and unrecoverable financial ruin for many generations to
come, 99% of which will be paid for by the 'tax payer' barring there being
another war to put 'Company's' back on thier feet hat is, God Forbid ! Yes, More
in the red than at any other time in history, and you're all larfin, NOW THAT'S
GENIUS³

Fritz Von Tellitlikeitis !

P.S. That beautiful new bridge in France that very likely wouldn't even be
mentioned on this forum if it hadn't been designed by Foster is a snippet at
such a bargain price, please compare similar large UK projects (eg rail) and ask
yourselves WHY ? they are more than double €uropean costs +, you should;
afterall; you're payin for the stuff, innit.


I'll put Ludwig as second for leaving this Cell while still sane.

John Smith. (Although I refuse to specify which John Smith).

Hopefully not the bitter one .................

So how do we judge greatness?Selfless compassion possibly? Florence Nightingale/mother teresa comes to mind.The ability to capture a whole nation with one notion?-Adolf H.(scary) Genius in a field, then yeah mozart,bach,& the architect of stonehenge/pyramids.Multi-tasking,undoubtably leonardo da vinci.But please,politicians?Thatcher arguably did some good things, but opinion is,shall we say divided.Engineering the falklands war to get re-elected, supporting fascist/apartheid leaders, the poll tax,successfully promoting the politics of avarice & breeding her son!None of these strikes me as being a sign of genius. If thats the best humanity can come up with, we really are up shit creek (imho).OK, you can all start waving your tory membership cards at me now. Cheers, matt.

quote:

---

Originally posted by long-time-dead:
My vote would go to Leonardo Da Vinci.

He managed to excel in three fields that one man struggles to make a mark in.

He was a reknowned scientist, inventor and artist.

It could be argued that the first and second achievements may be linked but seldom has one man proved successful in science and art.

A genius among genii.

---

I hate to say this. L-T-D, but as someone who spent quite a bit of time - as an art historian - studying Leonardo's life and works, I have to say that Leonardo didn't particularly excel in anything - even painting, which is where his talents lay. Most of his works are unfinished, and many of his pictures are half-painted by followers and pupils, many off his most feted works are desperately inferior to thoose of his two great contemporaries and rivals, Michaelangelo and Raphael; most of his ideas never got off the ground or the drawing board and many of the others would never have worked anyway; most of his "inventions" were improvements n existing miltary machines and much of his thinking was rather wooly. He didn't really "invent" anything very much. He can't really be described as much of a scientist as he didn't really publish any of his ideas. Great scientists put their ideas out in the real world for discussion and dissection, which LDV never really did.

His greatest achievement is The Last Supper, which is unquestionably one of the greatest pictures in all of Western art. Unfortunately it was painted with a technique which meant that it started to rot away almost as soon as it was painted (there is some evidence that Leonardo knew this) and is now a crumbling, magnificent ruin. Other great works include the cartoon of Mary, Jesus and St Anne in the National Gallery; and some of his sketches - he was an absolutely first-rate illustrator, and it is this skill, I suspect, which accounts for much of his reputation as a scientist and inventor.

However, despite his inability to actually finish anything - he was a dilletante in the worst sense of the word - one can't deny he was a man of great imagination.

That said, I'd go for Goethe, Isaac Newton, Shakespeare, the great Jean Renoir or Albert Einstein. Modesty of course precludes me from putting forward myself.

Kevin

[This message was edited by Kevin-W on Tue 14 December 2004 at 23:20.]

Hard to pick one. If I was forced at gunpoint I'd say William Blake.

-- Ian

Hi Kevin

Maybe I am not as learned as you are so I cannot argue my opinion to the same depth.

There are many candidates, modern and historical, and there will never be a victor due to the diversity of opinions.

LDV may well have created The Last Supper in a style that meant that his genius will only decay and make later generations devise new techniques to analyse and discover it. Genius or fool ?

Cartooning - bloody hell, if he could only draw Snoopy.........

Many of the ideas and theories that he proposed required latter day genii to make them achievable. That is without doubt.

I only put forward one candidate - I hope that his spirit will be honoured to see it amongst the other greats that nature has provided mankind with.

Oh, I seem to remember Beethoven left something unfinished .......

Aristotle

It's no contest, really. He single-handedly invented most of the sciences and laid down their basic principles, including:
-Biology (Darwin called him the greatest biologist of all time)
-Logic (he invented the logic that defined western reasoning, and his logic was not surpassed until 1879)
-Ethics (he articulated one of the world's major ethical systems)
Literary Criticism (he invented it)
Physics (he invented it, and his physical principles lasted 2000 years, until Galileo and Descartes)
Political Science (he inveted it)
Astronomy (he articulated its major principles)
Metaphysics (he continues to be influential)

Aristotle was also was student of Plato, the teacher of Alexander the Great, the founder of the Lyceum (world's second major university), etc.

Aristotle's had a greater influence on the western world than anyone, Christ included.

quote:

---

Originally posted by ejl:
... Aristotle's had a greater influence on the western world than anyone, Christ included.

---

Perhaps, but wasn't he a bugger for the bottle?

Steve M

Steve, that's another point in his favor.

I'm torn between Bomber Harris, Charles Darwin and Ludwig van Beethoven... I'll have to get back to you when I've decided!

Spike Milligan´, & one reason like our Gordon is thast they are contemporary and we can see ourselves, and make informed judgement (taste is something else) unlike some of the afore-mentioned who are figments of romantic history and imagination (Nightingale & Threesa's contributions for instance, Check out the reality or live the Disney).

Frtitz Von Keepinit real

quote:

---

Originally posted by Berlin Fritz:
"Gordon Broon" for convincing Britain that it's doing well, when in fact it's in
greater long term debt and unrecoverable financial ruin for many generations to
come, 99% of which will be paid for by the 'tax payer'

---

Do you pay UK tax Fritz?

Bill Wilson

Surely David Beckham? I have heard him referred to as a genius on telly more than any of the names above

But seriously, Einstein gets my vote.

Too many candidates!

Richard Feynman this week. Next week I'll probably think of someone else.

Cheers

(hope that wasn't too serious)

Harry

Not Aristotle, 2000 years of fakery.

Archimedes has a claim though.

Paul

Stephen Hawking gets my vote, the determination and drive of the man in adversity says it all.

Regards
Clive

Jesus Christ

Was that a nomination or an exclamation?

Harry