Clavanovas
Posted by: cunningplan on 27 October 2004
Mrs CP has been pestering me for a while to get a piano and I've finally caved in, well sort of!!. 
The only downside is she can't play and wants to learn, my only fear is that the din will be unbearable during the learning process.
The cunningplan I've come up with is to get a Clavanova with headphone sockets, thus eliminating the noise altogether.
The few we've listened to have been Yamaha's
in particular the CLP-115 which sounds very good, almost as good as the real thing.
I was just wandering if any of you guys have any ideas as to what else I should be looking at for about the same price which is £800 and certainly no more than a £1000
Your input would be appreciated
Regards
Clive
The only downside is she can't play and wants to learn, my only fear is that the din will be unbearable during the learning process.
The cunningplan I've come up with is to get a Clavanova with headphone sockets, thus eliminating the noise altogether.
The few we've listened to have been Yamaha's
in particular the CLP-115 which sounds very good, almost as good as the real thing.
I was just wandering if any of you guys have any ideas as to what else I should be looking at for about the same price which is £800 and certainly no more than a £1000
Your input would be appreciated
Regards
Clive
[QUOTE]Originally posted by cunningplan:
Mrs CP has been pestering me for a while to get a piano and I've finally caved in, well sort of!!.
The only downside is she can't play and wants to learn, my only fear is that the din will be unbearable during the learning process.
The cunningplan I've come up with is to get a Clavanova with headphone sockets, thus eliminating the noise altogether.
Clive
Contact Tom for his free upright and get a outside shed, much cheaper
oldie.
Mrs CP has been pestering me for a while to get a piano and I've finally caved in, well sort of!!.
The only downside is she can't play and wants to learn, my only fear is that the din will be unbearable during the learning process.
The cunningplan I've come up with is to get a Clavanova with headphone sockets, thus eliminating the noise altogether.
Clive
Contact Tom for his free upright and get a outside shed, much cheaper
oldie.
Oldie said
I hope you mean Tom's upright Piano, and not anything else that Tom has got upright
Regards
Clive
quote:
Clive
Contact Tom for his free upright and get a outside shed, much cheaper
oldie.
I hope you mean Tom's upright Piano, and not anything else that Tom has got upright
Regards
Clive
Clive,
Naughty, Naughty, I would expect "double entendres on PFM or other such lowly sites but god dam you sir this is the Naim forum
oldie.
Naughty, Naughty, I would expect "double entendres on PFM or other such lowly sites but god dam you sir this is the Naim forum
oldie.
quote:
Originally posted by cunningplan:
As punishment I'll donate my CDX2 to charity.
And get a
turntable instead?Deane
Completely agree with the above.
Trouble is, the "plastic piano" sound is becoming ubiquitous, and it follows that the "plastic piano" sound from the keyboard that one buys will become an increasingly acurate fake of the "plastic piano" sound used on commercial recordings. The more this happens, the less people will remember what a real piano sounds like.
Furthermore, the best feature of fake pianos is the key feel, which is almost universally superb. However, if you are attempting to improvise on the instrument, a fake will not cause the "next note" to appear in your mind the way a proper piano does -- I think this is to do with the fact that it is actually providing less information than it should. As a musical insrument, it feels and "sounds" OK, but it doesn't really work, in the fullest sense of the word.
Finally: the only digital instrument which has caused me any lasting excitement was the Kurzweil. It's astonishing, but it costs over two grand and still needs an amp. Half that spent on a used proper piano would be an infinitely better idea, IMHO.
If space is an issue, don't discount the Eavestaff...
They can be magnificent -- they look and can sound terrific, and they cost relative peanuts. The overall compromise is vastly less than with a digital thing. Have fun!
Best;
Mark
Trouble is, the "plastic piano" sound is becoming ubiquitous, and it follows that the "plastic piano" sound from the keyboard that one buys will become an increasingly acurate fake of the "plastic piano" sound used on commercial recordings. The more this happens, the less people will remember what a real piano sounds like.
Furthermore, the best feature of fake pianos is the key feel, which is almost universally superb. However, if you are attempting to improvise on the instrument, a fake will not cause the "next note" to appear in your mind the way a proper piano does -- I think this is to do with the fact that it is actually providing less information than it should. As a musical insrument, it feels and "sounds" OK, but it doesn't really work, in the fullest sense of the word.
Finally: the only digital instrument which has caused me any lasting excitement was the Kurzweil. It's astonishing, but it costs over two grand and still needs an amp. Half that spent on a used proper piano would be an infinitely better idea, IMHO.
If space is an issue, don't discount the Eavestaff...
They can be magnificent -- they look and can sound terrific, and they cost relative peanuts. The overall compromise is vastly less than with a digital thing. Have fun!
Best;
Mark
Sure - not that I have much! The pic above came from an Eavestaff Minipiano ad (for sale) on http://www.thestonehouse.co.uk/, and these deco-cased models tend to change hands in various states of repair for 400 to 800 quid. Most of these are post 1930 -- there is a brief history here.
The main percieved problem with the Minipiano was "lack of musical quality", and you will see that many dealers/restorers still stick to this line. Since this seems chiefly to be inspired by the fact that since the strings are shorter, the instrument will not play as loud as a 9'6" Bosendorfer, I personally think that this is total bollocks. I have a client who has a battered Minipiano which plays superbly and cost them 350 quid. The case can be refinished any time (they regularly appear in "piano black" with deco brass kick plates around the pedals)...
...and since they are all iron-framed there is no issue with the thing becoming untuneable due to woodworm. The volume thing is usually counteracted by the fact that they tend to be housed in smaller rooms.
It may not apply in every case, but there's also something very nice about not having what amounts to a large sideboard in front of one's face when playing. The music rack is foldable/removeable, and the sensation is very conducive to good stuff being produced. There's also a nice flat surface for your drink/ashtray/plate of tapas, although of course much of this also applies to fast-depreciating digitals, and the undoubted convenience of being able to plug in headphones has value also.
I have no particular axe to grind (I'm not part of this industry) but I think much of the success of digitals stems from the fact that they are undeniably amazing when first experienced -- it's gobsmacking that all this sound emerges from something with no moving parts except the keys and the speaker cones -- but with successive generations this will become less of a dramatic selling point as digital technology gets more accepted and commonplace. Right now is the time when they will be most expensive.
I also find it astonishing that we are generally so keen on the "new and shiny" thing that we can sometimes ignore alternatives with lasting virtue. It may not be strictly relevant to you (or even interesting!), but around a grand will buy you a very playable Fender Rhodes piano (a fantastically expressive instrument good for anything from Bach to Beatles and back), and even a full-scale Hammond A, B, or C-series in great mechanical order, with Leslie box can be had for under 2.5k, complete with a nice smell of seasoned hardwood and engine oil... Now that's VFM!
Best;
Mark
The main percieved problem with the Minipiano was "lack of musical quality", and you will see that many dealers/restorers still stick to this line. Since this seems chiefly to be inspired by the fact that since the strings are shorter, the instrument will not play as loud as a 9'6" Bosendorfer, I personally think that this is total bollocks. I have a client who has a battered Minipiano which plays superbly and cost them 350 quid. The case can be refinished any time (they regularly appear in "piano black" with deco brass kick plates around the pedals)...
...and since they are all iron-framed there is no issue with the thing becoming untuneable due to woodworm. The volume thing is usually counteracted by the fact that they tend to be housed in smaller rooms.
It may not apply in every case, but there's also something very nice about not having what amounts to a large sideboard in front of one's face when playing. The music rack is foldable/removeable, and the sensation is very conducive to good stuff being produced. There's also a nice flat surface for your drink/ashtray/plate of tapas, although of course much of this also applies to fast-depreciating digitals, and the undoubted convenience of being able to plug in headphones has value also.
I have no particular axe to grind (I'm not part of this industry) but I think much of the success of digitals stems from the fact that they are undeniably amazing when first experienced -- it's gobsmacking that all this sound emerges from something with no moving parts except the keys and the speaker cones -- but with successive generations this will become less of a dramatic selling point as digital technology gets more accepted and commonplace. Right now is the time when they will be most expensive.
I also find it astonishing that we are generally so keen on the "new and shiny" thing that we can sometimes ignore alternatives with lasting virtue. It may not be strictly relevant to you (or even interesting!), but around a grand will buy you a very playable Fender Rhodes piano (a fantastically expressive instrument good for anything from Bach to Beatles and back), and even a full-scale Hammond A, B, or C-series in great mechanical order, with Leslie box can be had for under 2.5k, complete with a nice smell of seasoned hardwood and engine oil... Now that's VFM!
Best;
Mark