which surround speaker alternatives ?

Just my personal opinion here, but I wouldn't touch an M&K system unless it was the only thing handy to break the glass in order to get at an extinguisher because my bollocks were on fire!

Many many years ago when I got tooled up for 5.1 I was demmed an M&K setup by a South Croydon dealer (who has now incidentally left the retail sector, and I believe is the distributor for M&K - funny that).

What was true of them then is still true now...

They go "crash, bang, whoosh, kerpow, splat, zip, ftoomsch" etc quite happily, and have bags of dynamics, but are as much fun in the long term as an ADHT suffering 5yr old on a diet of Redbull and dextrosol.

I also don't hold with their philosophy of making the sub do all the work below 120hz.... that just isn't how 5.1 is meant to be -Dolby and DTS's websites clearly explain that!

Get a dem and ask your dealer to play you a pair of M&K's in 2 channel with no sub... then do the same with other packages he stocks... that'll tell you all you need to know!

As for recommendations..... Well I recently got rid of my old Kef K160/ Definitive C1/BP1 package and took on a Focal Chorus package 716/705/cc700

Guessing you want something cute and styled though - find a Focal dealer and see if they have something in that ilk

hi mike,
did you audition the nsats/nsub ?
cant remember saying i wanted something cute and styled !!
what i want is the best surround sound for my bucks.
regards, scotty

how many bucks are you prepared to spend

neil

Had heard n-sub/n-sat in a 2.1 stereo scenario....

Very impressive, but too much money compared to what I've ended up with, and I just don't like them enough to spend the extra.
Picked the 716s for their performance with my hicap'd 112x/150x combo, then the rest of the system to suit, and of course already had my subs from the old system

Gleaned the cute & styled from the way m&k look... but if conventional designs are good for you then I stand by the method I used.

Find a stereo pair that play music the way you like, then build the package using the centre, surrounds (and maybe) sub from the same manufacturer/range.

If possible use multiple subs....
See System Pics thread, page 69 & 70 for a description of what I'm doing, and why
Page 69
Page 70

I use N-Sats as surrounds and they're good. Currently there's an ex-dem Maple pair at Infidelity for £580, IIRC, which is a great deal vs £940 RRP.

Neil

Hello Scotty,

What centerspeaker do you use?

Regards
Bas Wolke

have you looked at the Spendor SR5's? Very nice esp if you want something wall mountable.

I will be repalcing my KEF eggs with these as soon I funds allow.

Scotty,

For the last 2 weeks, I have been using a mixed Totem/M&K solution. I still use the Mani-2s as the mains and the M&Ks for surround purposes(Xenon LCR36 as centre, Surround 26 tripoles as surrounds, MX7000SF sub). I'm still playing with balance. If it were a full M&K setup it would have been far easier to balance out. As things are I have set the stereo performance as straight through with the mains set to large, but for surround purposes they're set to small with a 120hz crossover point IIRC. The solution isn't bad at all.

Which choice of speakers you go for depends hugely on your room configuration, seating position, size. I could not accommodate standard sized speakers. The THX specification (the only one that really counts) spoecifies the surrounds (not rears) as dipoles sitting approximately 1 metre higher than you on the side walls in line with your head. It expects that the dipoles would have space behind you. I sit with the sofa against the rear wall so I do not have this luxury. We have moved the sofa a couple of inches forward from the wall and placed the tripoles on 7 inch high platforms behind the sofa aiming up! It works quite well, although I'm still playing with balance. The correct thing to buy in my situation would have been M&K's Column Surrounds and screwed them into the wall behind the sofa. I may yet do this.

The M&Ks are probably the best surround solution of their ilk. Yes, they're better on movie work but they are actually quite effective with music, if nowhere near as good as a made-for-music solution such as nSats. Naim nSats/nSub destroys any M&K solution I've heard for music. On movies I'm not sure since I haven't really had the opportunity to compare like with like. I'd hazard a guess that it would be swings and roundabouts.

As it is, I needed a small centre speaker sitting on top of my TV in order to bring the acoustic centre of the centre and mains as close as possible. The centre would have been far lower if beneath the TV which would be less than ideal. I also lacked space for it there courtesy of TiVo, VCR and potentially DVD player.

Hi all,
thanks for your replies
0cean,neil,munch,mike.
frank: when you say rears 1m higher than you do you mean in seated position or standing?
bwolk: im using a kef egg as a centre not ideal i know but i was given the package by a friend who upgraded.
neil w: im not sure how much to spend really but am prepared to pay for all naim surrounds/sub if that helps.
cheers, scotty

quote:

Originally posted by scottyhammer:
im using a kef egg as a centre not ideal i know but i was given the package by a friend who upgraded.

In that case I would buy an Axess to match your Allae speakers. Instead of a N-sub.

The center channel is the most important channel in a Home Cinema set up.

Regards
Bas Wolke

quote:

I would buy an Axess to match your Allae speakers. Instead of a N-sub.

The center channel is the most important channel in a Home Cinema set up.

I'd second that!

Bung N-SATs on the rear, and if you have some change buy a third party subwoofer with a set of speaker level inputs.

When funds permit adding the N-SUB you can then make use of the redundant sub to reinforce the N-SATS at the back of the room!

hi guys,
i already have a rel strata 5 which im happy with in 2 channel and 5.1 - just thought the nsub would be a natural partner for the allaes as fronts an axcess ctr and nsats as rears.
maybe i could keep the rel after all !!
cheers, scotty

Scotty,

I meant seated position.

The Strata 5 is a very good sub. The nSub would be a more natural partner but the Strata would be fine. If it meant you could afford the Axess instead, I would definitely stick with it since, as mentioned earlier, the centre speaker is most important in movie situations.

frank,
i was under the impression that naim have stopped making the axess or was that another model ? any idea the price of axess or equivelent center speaker.
thanks, scotty

Hmmm, I haven't heard of Naim dropping the Axess. This used to retail for about £1300 and is still on the main Naim website at http://216.149.62.210/products/axess.html so I think it's still around. It would be the perfect match to the Allaes.

If it's a bit rich, there's the nCent which is about £500. It's not as good as the Axess but it's a lot smaller, making it easier to place, and it still has the Naim presentation so it'll match better than other brands.

Scotty,

As it happens I have an Axess, Allaes and an N-Sub on the "front end" as it were of the N-Sats in my AV set-up, similar to what you're perhaps considering! IIRC rightly, full price for an Axess is around £1350, but I got an ex-dem one for about £850 as I recall.

Neil

hi neil,
i have a couple of questions for you
1, what processor are you using with your set up
2, did you always want the naim system or did you do plenty of rival gear demos
3, what size is your room
oh and how does it sound ?
must go and listen myself soon!
regards, scotty

hi neil,
forget question 1 - just read your profile
cheers

scotty

which neil

neil w

sorry, i mean neil b
p.s. IIRC ?
scotty

Scotty,

You reminded me I needed to update my profile to allow for my latest waste of money (according to my wife!). I've now got an AV2 with latest firmware, a 200 for the Allaes and a 175 for the Axess/N-Sats. This was quite recent and I've been accumulating all the necessary cables (NACA 5, Naim Sub cable etc) such that I have to admit I haven't connected it all up yet! I'm planning to this weekend. The speakers sounded good before, but obviously should be better with the Naim electronics.

I only listened to the Allaes vs Arivas, everything else was on trust ex-dem and 2nd-hand, other than hearing some of the kit at 2 Heathrow shows.

Will report back next week on the new sound!

Neil

p.s. IIRC = If I remember/recall correctly!

Oh, forgot size of room: probably about 14'x12'

Neil

hi neil 'b.
thanks for the input i would greatly appreciate your feedback when youve set up and listened properly as i will end up im sure with a very similar system to you.
regards, scotty

Finally got around to putting in the necessay 2 hours' work on the cabling. Initial result encouraging. The impact of the Sub was niticeable (didn't have one before), but need to try a greater range of DVD's. Was especially impressed by CD replay too. Not that much worse than my 2-channel set-up, bass through the Allaes was notably good. Will report further later, perhaps after playing around with the Sub set-up and position.

Neil

hi neil,
i take it youre using the nsub ? what do you think of it! im using a rel strata5 at present.
scotty