Upgrade to 552+500

I've tried room treatments in my kinda open-plan, sparsely furnished room, and while they do work, I've come to think there's nothing as effective and natural sounding as books and furniture. I've even considered buying a cabinet (despite the fact that I don't need one). My girlfriend moved in half a year ago and brought with her two large bookshelves chocabloc with books -- much better than 500 quid worth of room treatment.

Thomas

TC,

Shamed on the forum to visit;O) I am on the first shuttle to Heathrow. Up at 4am battle through the snowdrifts to find the flight is delayed/cancelled! I'll let you know if I am snowed in and you can come round(maybe?).

Sean,

Welcome to pop in and hear the NBLs. 552 is still a month or so away. I have just found out from the buyer of my SBLs that there was a sonic upgrade done on the early 552s.

Any more details anyone?

chfs911,

Something for me to look forward to then. My 552 was back at the factory for a little while, just got it back at the and of December, so hopefully they will have done any upgrades then. It certainly sounds a lot better.

Keep in touch and let me know when I can come for a visitation.

Sean.

chfs and sean

the sonic updates are cable tie positions and spring rates on suspension boards
this i know as i asked richard what was done to mine and before any one asks no i dont know the difference as i didnt own it before the updates were done

neil

Sean,

Don't give up! Room acoustics can make your life into HiFi-hell but often there are simple (and quite inexpensive) cures.

I have a system similar to yours (NBLs instead of DBLs, CDS2 instead of 3) in a concrete basement room with the following dimensions: 10.5" x 23" x 8.5". Since I wanted to avoid the clean concrete for different reasons, I decided to build a new ceiling, new inner walls and a new floor.

Ceilings are made of 12.5mm plasterboard on studs with 45mm isolation. Walls are also platsterboards (two or three rounds of 12.5 mm sheets to increase structural rigidity)on studs with 45mm isolation. The floor is a "floating" oak parquet on concrete(i.e. not sprung floor). At the same time I installed dedicated mains spurs to the hifi.

The basic acoustical properties of the new room untreated was very nasty however. A lot of eco blurring the sound field. The relatively narrow room made early reflections really a problem. However, on the positive side is a relative lack of room mode interference despite two major (theoretical) peaks at around 40 Hz and 70 Hz. Here I've learned, the plasterboard contruction is a plus as it can act as a type of "membran absorber". Naked concrete walls would have been a much bigger problem.

The room treatment process I have started has so far yielded far better results than I initially would have thought possible.

1. Positioning of speakers relative listning position for best low frequency performance. I used a simplified version of the Cara available on the net (http://www.hunecke.de/calculator/hifi/room-acoustics-hifi.htm) and ended up with the NBLs positioned 55 cm from side walls (measured from speaker cone center) and 19 cm from back walls. Moving as little as 1 cm in each direction is clearly audible.

2. Dampening the early ceiling reflection by adding a large rug (2m x 3 m) between speakers and listning position. Interestingly, by moving the carpet only +/- 5 cm back and forth, I found a clear change in sound - too close to the speaker and the sound felt too damped. I ended up with the rug 75 cm from the speaker fronts.

3. Addressing early wall reflections. This was by far the most positive treatment in my room. I used a product called Golden Horn Light (http://www.diffusor.com/golden_horn_light1.htm) which is a diffusor(80%)/absorber (20%) construction based on fractal and number theory. I ordered 6 panels (1.2 x 0.6 m each) for 400 GBP in total. The panels were placed at the first and second side wall reflection points as well as between the speakers. The idea of this product is not too damp but to diffuse the incoming sound and to preserve the sound intensity (last point very important in order not to kill the live feeling of the room). The result is amazing to say the least! The sound is much cleaner (reflections gone) and has much more ambience. The room boundries disapear despite the narrow room width. In short, the whole presentation is much more lifelike. One interesting observation: it is not enough to diffuse the first reflection (i.e. the wall reflection at the same side as the speaker). The whole presentation really snapped into focus by addressing the second reflection (i.e. the wall reflection at the opposing side of the speaker).

So there is hope even if the room is far from perfect.

Regards

Anders

I also forgot to mention that I have Soundbases under the NBLs and they work a treat for me!

Anders

Anders,

Thanks for your post. You have given me some hope that my acoustic treatments will work. Going on advice from Custom Audio Designs I have ordered two absorbant panels for either side of my speakers and one for the front wall i.e. between my speakers. I've also ordered two diffusion/absorbsion panels for the rear wall i.e. behind the listening area. As you can imagine I'm keeping my fingres crossed hopeing that they will go some way to sorting my problem out. I had a look at the Golden Horn site but unfortunately it is in Swedish. Not my 2nd language. However many thanks, I'll keep you posted as to how I get on.

Sean.

An update,

Well the panels arrived and were duely fitted. Plonked in place and with a little fiddeling/tuneing of my home made bass traps I have gone from a system that was pretty unlistenable to one that a friend described as "Redefining what Hi-Fi is capeable of". Another friend who was round at the time thought it sounded better than reality! While that may not be the case it does give an indication as to how good my system now sounds. As you can imagine this is a great relief to me, and from contemplating going back to 135s I now don't want to ever part with the 500 (sorry all you 135 owners). Far from the 'soft' sound some have spoken of, my sound is tight, dynamic and ultra fast, all of what we have come to expect from our Naim systems. All this with a ease that I never thought possible. Honestly, the rise time on piano notes is incredible and so life like with huge scale and an in room presence that I have never heard before. Yes I am a happy listener, long may it continue.

Gary, how are you getting on with your dem? Have you ordered yet?

T.C., I'm getting my Prefix updated on Tuesday so will post to tell you how it's going. Incidently I was round at Roberts for a listen the other evening and with a little repositioning of his speakers they do sound a lot better than the last time I heard them. As for them being better than my DBLs? Well, gentle readers, I for one won't be parting with any more money for new components any time soon.

"Beauty is definately in the ear of the listener".

Sean.

Sean,

Pleased to see you are sorted! 552 has arrived and NBLs are singing. Everything is run in nicely. CDI continues to stun me with its continual rise in performance. Is there no limit to the detail it can pull off the silver disk? Prefix is next update. How long does Robert take to turn them round, and how much?
I have bought a spare one to get upgraded first then swap over to keep LP12 up and running. TC might end up with the spare Prefix if he's lucky ;O) But he'll have to visit to collect it!
Your welcome any time for a listen. Make it before the golf season though as I will be playing alot this season to get my money's worth!

Charles,

Being barely able to swing a leg I've no idea when the golf season starts (that is the game with the wee ball?). I'm at home for the next two weeks then away for three and can manage pretty much any time when on terrafirma.

How much for the prefix? I don't know yet, will find out on Tuesday. Robert will do it for me on the day so if you are interested then you can always order the bits and give Montrose a visit for the day. It would also be a chance to hear what you are missing (or not) with the DBLs. You are always welcome for a visit yourself.

My number is: 01224 658512. Give me a call and we can hopefully arrange a visit down.

Yours,

Sean.

Sean

Can you let me contact info for Custom Audio Designs please?

Thank you
Steve

Steve - try here:

http://www.customaudiodesigns.co.uk/

Steve,

I sent them photos of my room as well as a description of my sound/problem on which they were able to advise. Unfortunately in my case the remedy was not cheap although they did discuss ways to save me money. Ask for Gary in technical, it was he who sorted me out. Don't give up! a terrible room can be transformed and a good room can be tweeked to sound even better.

Sean.

Sean,

Can you describe in more detail what you have done to your room like kind of panels you have fitted, where you put them and the sonical benefits?

Thanks

Anders

Anders,

In the end all my room required was a simple solution, as I know now, to my severe echo problem. The total cure was to install two absorbtion panels, either side and just in front of the speakers, to remove the reflections from the side walls and two diffusion/absorbtion panels on the rear wall behind my head to stop reflection comming off of it, hitting the front wall and then returning to me quite a while after the original sound. They did advise on an absorbtion panel between the speakers (which I bought) but to my ears did'ent really work, slowed and sucked the life out of the bass. Hey-Ho.

The sonic benefits have been quite substantial. I now have (quite) a quiet room with a relatively even volume throughout all frequencies (this was checked with a sine wave generator). This in effect allows the room to interfere less with the system and gives me a smile no end.

Anders, I am interested in looking at the Golden Horn Light but as I've said already the web site does not have an English translation. Do the ship to this country? If I do decide to purchase would I be able to do it through you. This may aid me in not having to pay excessive import tax. If possible you can always let me know, my e-mail adress is in my profile.

Yours,

Sean.