250/NBL v 300/SL2

NB,

The 300/SL2 will outperform the 250/NBL. The NBL, magnificent as it is, is more difficult to drive and the old philosophy "source first" applies here. I would also consider the B&W 804 in your shoes - they are wonderfully detailed and work well on the end of Naim gear. I think that a 300 would make them dance very nicely.

quote:

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The NBL, magnificent as it is, is more difficult to drive and the old philosophy "source first" applies here.

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Completely untrue, the NBL is very easy to drive for all Naim amps. A 180 is considered more than adequate, as famous Naim system owners will testify.

I haven't managed to hear SL2s yet, but 180, 135, 300 and 500 all work with NBLs and there's less of a difference than you'd expect.

Please consult Naim or your dealer - no question IMO, if you have room, get the NBLs!

I wouldn't assume that either combination would be a foregone conclusion without taking into account the room they would be used in. In fact, in small or difficult rooms with a tendency to emphasise bass it might turn out that that 250/SL2 works best of all.

Home dem is definitely the way to go.

Allan

Do a demo. I have heard the SL2s with 135s and NBLs with 135s. The NBLs are a significantly better! Not sure about a 250 with NBLs.

How about used 135s/NBLs vs 300/SL2s?

John

Thanks guys, my listening room is about 20 foot square. The ceilling is about 9 foot high and I have laminate flooring.

I have a sofa and two single seater chairs in the room.

I am currently using Ruark Equinox's which throw out a lot of bass for their size and its fair to say I enjoy deep bass.

I originally thought about replacing my 180 with a brace of 135's before Naim released the new range. If I can squeeze a good deal for my Ruarks I may even consider a 300/NBL combination instead.

Regards

NB

Having read previous threads on SL2's v NBL's it looks like it comes down to the bass weight and scale of the NBL's or the space and clarity of the new SL2's. Its going to be a tough call!

Regards

NB

NB

What is your sistem at the moment? It would be helpful to know since you are looking for up-grade advice.

cheers

Nigel

Nigel,

Current system is:-

CDX/XPS 82/Hi/180 Ruark Equinox's.

I have £20K to upgrade and will look towards:-

CDS3/XPS2 252/Super/250 or 300 SL2's or NBL's,

any advice would be appreciated,

Regards

NB

NB,

You have a large room - you need 250/NBL's.

regards

Dev

NB

If you think SL2s are bass light then I think Dev is right - the NBLs will do bass.

cheers

Nigel

quote:

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Originally posted by JeremyB:
the NBL is very easy to drive for all Naim amps. A 180 is considered more than adequate, as famous Naim system owners will testify.

I haven't managed to hear SL2s yet, but 180, 135, 300 and 500 all work with NBLs and there's less of a difference than you'd expect.

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Sorry Jeremy, no 180 for NBL, it lacks power and control, even an olive 250 is considered as not enough for NBL. It sounds well but when large dynamics are present, a single olive 250 can not deliver without compression. No problems with the new 250.


NB,

What about both, i mean 300+NBL:
Buy a 300 now and NBL in a few months when funds allow. Demo all combinations : 250,300,SL2,NBL. Your ears will decide quite fast.

Emmanuel

All opinions are my own, and reflect those of the organisation i work for, even if not stipulated.

Manu,

Thanks - I stand corrected. I may try it if I get a chance - my 2 x 180 setup seemed to work ok for the brief time I tried it but I never tried a single. I heard about the famous NBL/180 setup second hand from a dealer, but it could have been urban legend...

Manu,

this is mean't to be a one of once in a lifetime purchase.

I want to be happy with the system I purchase now and not be buying now with the intention of upgrading in the future.

It would be nice to think my system will last for the next ten to fifteen years,


Regards

NB

NB

You have a large room, you like bass, go for the NBLs.
But demo all you want to buy, and stay open minded, try all combos you can afford (Naim only, of course! ). Try a 552, a Fraim, an active 2*250/SL2 ...

Emmanuel

All opinions are my own, and reflect those of the organisation i work for, even if not stipulated.

Manu,

I have the feeling I am going to strech myself to a pair of NBL's driven by a 300.

I have already decided on the CDS3/XPS2 252/Super combination. Sadly I cannot strech to a 552 or that would have been first on the list!!

Regards

NB

NB

If it is of any help to you, I recently did a SL2 vs NBL home demo for a customer of mine who has a listening room about 18 foot square, with a ceiling about 10 feet high reducing to about 8 feet high at the rear.
The results using his CDX/XPS front end for the comparison were very conclusive!
To cut a long story short, having tried all manner of possible combinations during the afternoon and evening, the SL2's with the 252/Supercap/2 using his original 250 (the best amplification we could muster within the budget) won the day.
We both felt the NBL's although very good, were just too overwhelming in his room. While the SL2's never missed a beat. From Peter Gabriel to Vivaldi they were just fantastic!
The moral of this story is that you must listen to them in your own home, as prior to the demo both of us thought the NBL's would have suited him better.
Any way all he needs to complete his system in the future is the NAP300. However as and when he feels ready to make this comparison, you can rest assured I will have a CDS3/XPS2 in the boot of my car as well! I too, was at the Bristol show and I just can't wait to get my hands on one, the next 3 weeks or so are going to pass very slowly indeed.

Regards,

Peter Swain

Peter, sounds like the NBLs revealed the limitations of the CDX/XPS. A better source might of produced a different result. Those NBLs are very revealing!

John

Hi John,

Yes you are right, the NBL's are very revealing, and they were in his room.

Perhaps I should have explained more fully earlier: The budget available, meant that it was really a choice between 282/NBL and 252/SL2 using Supercap 2 in both cases, but as is often the case you wan't to see what happens when you push the boat (budget) out a bit further! So using the 252/Supercap 2/NBL combo with his 250 we were expecting great things, and it was good, but just not that good. The SL2s just sounded better, the room may well have contributed to this, and this is why one must listen at home. The fact of the matter is/was that the extra two and a half grand would be far better used by putting it towards the 300 at this stage. However it goes without saying that the most obvious upgrade to make is with the CDS3. Problem is, I ain't got one!!! and having sold my CDS2 we had to use his trusty CDX/XPS combo which he will be upgrading next time round.

So the point is, that one must listen at home and get ones hands on the best source possible to be sure, when doing this comparison. Roll on April and my first CDS3 delivery, I just can't wait!

Peter

Peter,

Did you take a 300 along with you for your comparisons?

I tend to agree with John on this one that the combination of source and power amp wasn't able to get the best out of the NBL's.

I would like to know why you thought the NBL's were overpowering in what appears to be a large room, where you can appreciate the extra power and scale of the NBL's?

It has been suggested that NBL's can be run on a 180. I find that my 180 does a very good job of powering my Ruark Equinox's but I do find that the bass is overblown and out of control. On bass heavy music like Faithless that it can be painful at times. I am trying to get more refinement into my system, more depth of sound and was very impressed with the CDS3/SL2 combination at the Bristol Hi-fi show.

Regards

NB

NB,

Sorry for the delay in my reply - life is a rather busy at present.
No,we didn't use a 300 during the comparison although I had one available.
The bass on the NBL's was just not as well controlled as with the SL2's. The sense of rhythmn was not as good and as a result of this; they were a little fatiguing in the context of this room which is a similar size to yours.
Sure, with a 300 and the long awaited CDS3 they will sound much, much better, but I am still sure the only true test for you is to listen in your own home before you make your decision. Don't make it anywhere else. Despite many ajustments to the NBL's, the SL2's just worked better in this guy's room. The decision was unanimous on this occasion!

Peter

Before I start the demming, does anyone have any suggestions to alternatives to the SL2's and the NBL's.

Budget is arround £5,000 and I am looking for a fast open sound with plenty of bass.

Regards

NB

NB

Buy yourself a mint pair of Briks and spend the money you save out of the £5k on a better front end or amp.

It will sound better.

Regards

Mick

I have to agree that th Briks were a good pair of speaker but not to my taste. I do think they are sounding a little dated now.

The 180 will be going before I purchase a new pair of speakers. I intend to buy a 252/super/300 to power the new speakers.

Regards

NB

NB

The point I am trying to make is that there are bargins to be had in good quality s/h speakers.

Buy some of these be it Brik's or oblisk's and use the money you have saved to invest at the front end.

Regards

Mick

I'm learly of 2nd-hand speakers. Don't know where they've been or how they've been treated. Coudl be a fix-er-upper. Tweeters especially can go bad even though they are not blown.

- GregB

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