First Concertos
Posted by: u5227470736789439 on 28 August 2005
Dear Friends,
I thought the piano idea was quite good so here are a few concerto recomendations.
Bach:
Brandenberg Concertos. HM Linde EMI or Virgin.
Violin Concertos, in A minor and E major and Double Concerto in D minor. Oistrack or Grumiaux on DG and Philips
Keyboard Concertos. A good start will be found in the performances of JM Pires on Erato, or the complete set with Perahia on Sony
Handel:
Organ Cocertos. I recently found a set that seems to get the measure of the music. MC Alain with Paillard Chamber Orchestra, originally on decca, but now out on Boston Skyline, which is a small USA company that re-releases grand efforts that somehow have slipped beneath the horizon, often because the material is wonderful and yet not eccentric enough to have made a real media hit. Their catalogue contains some absolute gems. [Two separate CDs].
Haydn:
Trumpet Concerto in E flat. The best records (IMO) have been done by Maurice Andre, Haakon Hardenberger, and (my favourite) Ole Edvard Antonsen.
Mozart:
Clarinet Concerto: This never seems to get a bad performance, so no reason to recomend one over another!
Piano Concerto No 23 in A. There are about 12 at this level! Start here and move out! Haskil and Solomon both made splendid recordings. Perahia is among the best in the stereo era, but rare are the performances that fail.
Horn Concertos. Start with Dennis Brain's set on EMI. Slightly less charming but just as sitisfying is Alan Civil's set with the great Otto Klemperer. One can almost hear the great man smiling at his wonderful soloist. Not sure if this is currently available, but if you see it get it!
Beethoven:
The Violin Concerto is something of a gem, and yet it only ges better with further aquaintance. Try Oistrack or Josef Suk for great musical insights, though you will go a long way to find a poor performance.
Piano Concertos; Start with Number Four. Stephen Bishop is among the best and at budget price, whilst this music has attracted the attention of the great pianist of every generation. Todd, maybe you would like to recomend your favourite. Mine is Schnabel from 1933, but then that is not an obvious recomendation to a beginer!
Mendelsohnn and Bruch: [Together because of the ususal coupling].
You will find these two composers on issues of the their two greatest Violin Concertos. Again, no amount of aquaintance will ever dull the brilliance of the music.
Dvorak:
Cello concerto in B Minor.
The conventional wisdom is that Rostropovich with Karajan is THE recording. I actually profoundly disagree with this, and R recorded it several times. The best is mono with V Tallich on Supraphon, and the best after that is with Boult in Stereo on EMI. My favourite is Fournier on EMI (out on a splendid transfer of the 1947 78s on Testamente), which is terribly faithful to the miriad of markings in the score, and manges to sound as if it was also totally spontaneous. Fournier is said to have retained an affection for this performance all his life.
Brahms:
Violin Concerto:
Oistrack, Klemperer on EMI have the measure of it. Don't think that this is going to be slow or dogged. In fact it seems that Klemperer is the one with the pulse and forward drive and Oistrack the one with the poetry! From the archives, Fritz Kreisler provides another more charming and altogether different "old world" view that may acyually be musically closer in spirirt to what Brahms had in mind. The 1927 record from Berlin are a model of musical balance if not really the last word in tonal fidelity, even if the violin sounds pretty marvelous!
Piano Concertos. Start with the D Monor (No One), and get Curzon with George Szell with the LSO on Decca. It really is the best in every department.
Sibelius:
Violin COncerto. This is not as tough as it might sound and you are bound to get a nice coupling, from someone like Tchaikowsky. My favourite is Grumiaux, but Oistrack is just as fine, but the one I have is in mono (and coupled with the Bach set, swo you might kill two birds with one stone!). The best Heifetz is the one with Beecham done in London. The LPO were probably the best Orchestra in Britain in the 1930s and Beecham was not overfaced with his temperamental soloist. This is one of those once in a lifetime type performances (on EMI).
Elgar:
Violin Concerto:
Menuhin, of course, made the famous set with the composer, but if you are going to delve into the historic, then consider Albert Sammons, who recorded it two and a half years earlier with Henry Wood. (Out on Pearl) This is what Elgar rather charmingly described as a "good" performance, while if you get past the crumbly recording, what you get is one of the greatest Elgar recording - full stop! Of the moderns, avoid Heifetz. Elgar detested his reading: "The man does not know how to cry inside, without showing it on his sleeve." In the stereo era Hilary Hahn has got a good press, but I personally think the best is Alfredo Campoli on a late 1950s recording with Boult, but it only appears occasionally at super-budget on Decca.
Again I hope other will contribute further I ideas. I have refrained froma list of all myu favourite Concertos, but tried to do a starter set of recomendations, any ONE of which would make a fine start. So the absense of something only means that I think a better start may be made elsewhere. Maybe next week I'll do Starter Symphonies, and Starter Chamber Music, or even Starter String Music. Do other feel this would be useful?
Fredrik
Posted on: 28 August 2005 by Ian G.
Welcome back Fredrik - glad you decided to stay. We need you're experience and passion.
I for one always read your threads with interest even if I don't have anything to add.
Ive been trying unsuccessfully to find the Linde Brandenburg's you mention again above with no luck at all. Could they be deleted or am I looking in the wrong place? Do you have a good internet source for classical music?
regards
Ian
Posted on: 28 August 2005 by u5227470736789439
Dear Ian,
I find that grand issues, like th Linde recrcording of the Brandenbergs come and go. And come back again. Patience is the thing with really worthwhile issues, and then speed getting them! In the meantime try the Brandenbergs from the deutche Harmonia Mundi company. Sigiswald Kuijken and La petite Band make for a fine version to run beside, but not in front of Linde. Why? Bececause in the Second Concerto the trumpet part is assigned to a Horn in Alt. It sounds an Octave low, which transposes the intervals to the other musical lines. Very much along the lines of the debate about the Art of Fugue, as played by Walcha using 16 foot pipe on the pedals. This means the lines cross each other in the wrong places and the intervals (when the lines should cross) becaome transposes (For example a fifth upwards, becomes a forth downwards!), so there isa technical issue of some importance, which is wrong. It is something to note rather than have a heart attack over, so perhaps you might consider Pinnock who at least uses the correct instruments, though I am not enthusiastic about his musical approach! If you can bear 78s, then consider Adolph Busch's set (out on Pearl) done in 1935/6, which gets an awful lot right (for the time!) and is the most humaine and fresh version I know. A piano, played by Rudolf Serkin takes the Harpsichord part, and the Gambas in the Sixth are taken by 'celli, but this is still one of the most compelling versions. As for the Baroque high trumpet in the Second. The soloist had one made specially for the recording, though it has valves, unlike its true Baroque ancestor. Again this does nothing to diminish the splendid result. The players ARE more important than the actual instrument.
As for on-line, I don't have a credit card. I am one of Miick Parry's undeserving poor, you see (look at "you cannot be serious" or something like that in the Padded Cell), so I only buy from a local very good record shop: The Outback, in Church Street in Hereford. That is not much help, I am sorry.
Fredrik
Posted on: 28 August 2005 by Tam
I'll stick to piano concertos to start with. And again (as on the solo piano thread), Beethoven is king. Kempff has two good sets of recordings (as with the sonatas 50s mono and 60s stereo), and as before the mono are superior. Kempff's 4th is quite simply the best going. The wonderful, slow opening is absolutely beautiful, and nobody can play it as well as Kempff, his cadenzas are also (in my heretical view) superior to Beethoven's. The others are excellent though his 5th is not the best around (not quite the weight that some others have). Solomon (on Testament) has some great recordings, and one of the finest 5ths around. If you want a modern digital cycle there are two good choices: Rattle/Brendel and the VPO are very good, however I recently picked up Aimard/Harnoncour/COE at the bargain price of £10 in HMV. This set is stunning, both in terms of playing and recording quality.
Mozart wrote a lot of piano concertos. At risk of generalisation the better ones are roughly from 20 onwards. Perahia's set is wonderful as is Barenboim's early set with the ECO. I recently picked up his new set with the BPO which is good (or at least the first few discs are - that's as far as I've got) and extremely cheap (around £20 for 9 discs and a bonus dvd), though the earlier set is better.
The Grieg piano concerto is also very fine, though my recording isn't very good, so if anyone had a good recommendation I'm all ears.
The Brahms piano concertos are outstanding (I especially love the first). I have to recordings, the Gilels/Jochum/BPO one is very highly regarded, and very good, but personally, I think the Fleisher/Szell/Cleveland recording is superior. Szell/Cleveland was one of the greatest orchestra/conductor combinations of all time he worked wonderfully with Fleisher. Both a coupled with various solo piano pieces.
regards,
Tam
Posted on: 28 August 2005 by u5227470736789439
quote:
Originally posted by Tam:
[...].
The Grieg piano concerto is also very fine, though my recording isn't very good, so if anyone had a good recommendation I'm all ears.
[...].
regards,
Tam
Solomon with Philharmonia under Herbert Menges is splendid! Good recording in stereo, and I think now on Testamant. Used to be a staple of the EMI stereo catalogue, and has never really been out of it for 50 years with good reason.
Fredrik
Posted on: 28 August 2005 by Tam
Thanks for that, I'll check it out.
regards,
Tam
Posted on: 28 August 2005 by Cosmoliu
quote:
Originally posted by Fredrik H:
Beethoven:
The Violin Concerto is something of a gem, and yet it only ges better with further aquaintance. Try Oistrack or Josef Suk for great musical insights, though you will go a long way to find a poor performance.
Fredrik
I just brought home the Hybrid SACD of Anne-Sophie Mutter/Kurt Masur/NY Phil recorded in 2002. It is quite lovely; Anne -Sophie takes a much more measured pace than her recording with Von Karajan 20+ years ago. In the liner interview she says "Personal maturity and humility are vitally important in the face of Beethoven's tragic character" and this certainly is a more mature interpretation. Her tone is as lush as ever. I know Anne-Sophie is not to everyone's taste, but I am a big fan of hers. Of the ten or so Beethovens I own, from Heifetz (LP) to Hilary Hahn, this one is highly recommended. Of course, as Fredrik intimated above, I have yet to buy a recording of this concerto that I dislike.
Speaking of David Oistrach: I heard him play the Brahms while in college 35 years ago and I can still feel the hair stand up on the back of my neck when I think of him launching into the third movement.
Norman
Posted on: 28 August 2005 by pe-zulu
quote:
Originally posted by Fredrik H:
I find that grand issues, like th Linde recrcording of the Brandenbergs come and go. ! In the meantime try the Brandenbergs from the deutche Harmonia Mundi company. Sigiswald Kuijken and La petite Band make for a fine version to run beside, but not in front of Linde. Why? Bececause in the Second Concerto the trumpet part is assigned to a Horn in Alt. It sounds an Octave low, which transposes the intervals to the other musical lines. so perhaps you might consider Pinnock who at least uses the correct instruments, though I am not enthusiastic about his musical approach! If you can bear 78s, then consider Adolph Busch's set (out on Pearl) done in 1935/6, which gets an awful lot right (for the time!) and is the most humaine and fresh version I know.
Regrettably H-M LINDEs Brandenburgs (Virgin Classics)are unavailable at the moment. In my opinion too the best period performances ever.
PINNOCK (Archiv) is a good alternative, but other noteworthy possibilities are
COLLEGIUM AUREUM recently rereleased by German Harmonia Mundi, (bargain) ,
GUSTAV LEONHARDT originally SEON,Philips, now rereleased by SONY (midprice), the only weak point being the trombaist Claude Rippas, who fights brave with his part, and perhaps an even better choice might be the
SUZUKI version on BIS (full price).
It is more difficult to recommend a modern (non-period) version, as most of my preferred versions are out of sale. But some good versions are:
BUSCH (Pearl) is musically satisfying but very old.
MARRINER (Philips 1979, three CDset including the suites, (with Szeryng,Bernard,Petri,Rampal and Malcolm) is still one of the best.
MÛLLER-BRÛHL on Naxos (bargain) is reliable and rather good for the price
ST.LUKES CHAMBER ENSEMBLE on Delos (full price) well recorded lively american recording
STUTTGARTER KAMMERORKESTER vith BEN HUDSON on Tacet(full price) is expertly played, effective.)
In the beginning I should go for the Pinnock or the Collegium Aureum.
Posted on: 30 August 2005 by u5227470736789439
Dear friends,
I forgot to mention the Mozart Violin Concertos. My favourite recordings are by Grumiaux on budget Philips with the LSO and Colin Davies and this containa gem of a performance (the best I have come across) of the Synfonia Concertante for Violin and Viola. Anf for the G, D and A Major concertos look out Symon Goldberg on Testamnet.The orchestra is the Philharmonia under W Susskind, a real musical hero if ever, though unheard of today, more or less. An aside is the producer was one George Martin before he was sent by Parlophone to produce Rock! Needless to say the recording is first rate as well, if only in (1954) mono!
Fredrik
Posted on: 30 August 2005 by Ian G.
Fredrik et al,
Thanks for the inputs, I've ordered the Pinnick set of Brandeburg and the Orchestral Suites.
Looking forward to some new listening.
Maybe I can add my ha'pennth worth on the 'First Concertos' theme. Almost the first classical LP I ever bought was Claudio Abbado's concerto nos 20 & 21 from Mozart (on DG). Despite not being a classical music buff then nor now this LP has stood the test of time and has been a firm refuge for me ever since. It never ceases to make me feel better at the end of a wild day or the beginning of a calm one. Really beautiful - try it.
Ian
Posted on: 30 August 2005 by u5227470736789439
quote:
Originally posted by IanGtoo:
Fredrik et al,
[...].
Maybe I can add my ha'pennth worth on the 'First Concertos' theme. Almost the first classical LP I ever bought was Claudio Abbado's concerto nos 20 & 21 from Mozart (on DG). [...],this LP has stood the test of time and has been a firm refuge for me ever since. It never ceases to make me feel better at the end of a wild day or the beginning of a calm one. Really beautiful - try it.
Ian
Your have so hit the nail on the head! To begin with don't buy lots. Just on or two, and nothing posted here above will ever leave your affection, and Ian, you chose well in my opinion. I could just as well have sent people of to get the D Minor or C Major as the A major. Personally the D Minor was MY first, on 78s, played by Edwin Fischer with the LPO, and without (correctly!) a conductor! I wore those records till they went grey! Even LPs won't stand that sort of hammer.
So glad you are going for the Bach! It really is something VERY special. All I want to do is give a lead to anyone in this, and I know EVERYONE actually would love the classics, if only they were not frighteneed by where to start. It is, for me, what it is all about, except being careful of people in general, and freinds in particular.
Enjoy that Bach. I am sure you will! Fred

Posted on: 01 September 2005 by bjorne
I second Fredriks recommendation of Händels organ concerts. There's a single CD on Naxos, cheap and very good imo. This music seems to be so "simple" but is so full of beauty.
Also worth checking out is Sibelius 6th symphony, it is very , very beautiful. Jukka-pekka Saraste conducting the Finnish SO on RCA iirc. This one I never get tired of.
Posted on: 01 September 2005 by u5227470736789439
Bjorne,
I bought Sir John Barbirolli's Halle cycle, now deleted (what are these people on?), on EMI, and it is some of finest I've come across. Just marvelous, though slightly slower than some. Bit like the tempi of Davies in the Boston set on Philips, but much better in the sense of flow and momentum. The Sixth really makes sense, which is not always the case in lesser hands.
Fredrik
Posted on: 02 September 2005 by bjorne
Fredrik, I have heard that Bernstein have made some very good recordings of Sibelius symphonies. Are you familiar with these?
Posted on: 02 September 2005 by u5227470736789439
dear Bjorne,
No I am not, but I think Sibelius would well be fantastic with the Bernstein passion! I'll try to find the recordings and give them a go! I'll get back on what they are like for me.
Fredrik
Posted on: 02 September 2005 by u5227470736789439
More Handel I missed at the top is the 12 Concerti Grossi, or Grand Concertos opus 6. I don't know how to do a link so search under Fredrik Fiske, and 12 Grand Concertos and you will find a very nice thread on them. Sorry i can't do the link.
Fredrik
Posted on: 19 October 2005 by Ian G.
Fredrik H.
Just a short update to let you know that all your hard typing in this thread was not in vain. The Pinnock arrived just as we left on holiday for a few weeks and so finding the time to listen it through more than once has taken until now. I made the 'mistake' of also buying a set of (Kovacevich) Beethoven piano sonatas recommended on another thread at the same time so that has been another (good) distraction. I've not made it through all 6 disks yet!
The Pinnock is completely different to the other Brandenburg set I've had for years (from Menuhin - chosen simply because he is a houshold name). I'm amazed actually - in my ignorance I thought the differences were really only for the in-crowd. I don't have the right language to properly discuss the ins and out - to my shame I can't read a note of music. Suffice to say it is very involving - I particularly like the way he does the slower stuff.
Anyhow thanks again and keep up the inputs - I've discovered lots of good music in all genres on this forum since becoming a fellow NAP200 owner.
regards,
Ian
Posted on: 19 October 2005 by u5227470736789439
Dear Ian,
Splendid! I hope this awakens a growing curiosity about the old music, which is definately not difficult once you start. Thanks for posting this. I used to have the old Menuhin set. I especially enjoyed the Fourth an Sixth in this recording. It shows also how Bach will survive the changes of taste of differrent generations. That says something about the music. it is very strong, as well as lovely.
Fredrik
Posted on: 20 October 2005 by kevj
quote:
Originally posted by Fredrik H:
Horn Concertos. Start with Dennis Brain's set on EMI. Slightly less charming but just as satisfying is Alan Civil's set with the great Otto Klemperer. One can almost hear the great man smiling at his wonderful soloist. Not sure if this is currently available, but if you see it get it!
Fredrik,
I actually much prefer the Civil/Klemperer to the Brain/Karajan. If I could play like anyone, I would want to play like Civil.
Still available on Amazon for about £11. Be careful anyone who wants to buy this - Civil recorded the concertos three times, with Klemperer, Kempe, and Marriner. The Klemperer set is much the best.
Kevin
Posted on: 20 October 2005 by Basil
quote:
Mozart:
Clarinet Concerto: This never seems to get a bad performance, so no reason to recomend one over another!
One performance stands out, the Jack Brymer - Thomas Beecham recording from 1960 with the Royal Philharmonic.
More recommendations.
Sibelius
Gidon Kremer
Riccardo Muti
Philharmonia Orchestra
Elgar Cello Concerto
Jacqueline Du Pré
John Barbirolli
London Symphony Orchestra
Posted on: 20 October 2005 by BobPaterso
I would like to recommend Rodrigo's Concierto Andaluz for four guitars & orchestra. This was commissioned by Celedonio Romero & dedicated to him and his sons. The recording I would recommend is the Phillips recording by the Romeros with the San Antonio Symphony Orchestra conducted by Victor Allessandro.
Bob
Posted on: 20 October 2005 by Earwicker
Think you guys would probably like the Beethoven Triple - the Szeryng, Starker, Arrau gets my vote, although the new one with Zehetmair and Aimard/Harnoncourt is supposed to be great.
EW
Posted on: 20 October 2005 by u5227470736789439
quote:
Originally posted by kevj:
quote:
Originally posted by Fredrik H:
Horn Concertos. Start with Dennis Brain's set on EMI. Slightly less charming but just as satisfying is Alan Civil's set with the great Otto Klemperer. One can almost hear the great man smiling at his wonderful soloist. Not sure if this is currently available, but if you see it get it!
Fredrik,
I actually much prefer the Civil/Klemperer to the Brain/Karajan. If I could play like anyone, I would want to play like Civil.
Still available on Amazon for about £11. Be careful anyone who wants to buy this - Civil recorded the concertos three times, with Klemperer, Kempe, and Marriner. The Klemperer set is much the best.
Kevin
Dear Kevin,
I am an absolute fan of Alan Civil. I always prefered his performance with Klemperer to the famous Brain Karajan colaboration! I had all three of those Civil records at different time! I gave the Klemperer one to a friend to get them going on the classical side! I am glad it still to be had as I shall definately try to get it myself again!!! What label? I can't use Amazon as I don't have a credit card, but my local record shop is the tops.
Do you know the one about AC in a train compartment? There was a Vicar, AC, and a Punky-style girl with a walkman, if I get it right, for I saw iit in the Telegraph obituary of him. Apparently the girl had the volume so high it was audible to all three! AC got the horn out and played some arpegios forte! She walked out and the Vicar thanked him! I like that sort of thing in a man. Wonderful!
Maybe we should just throw the odd story in now and again. I have a ggod stock of my own!
All the best Fredrik
PS: What is your band. I have a good horn-playing friend called Dan Anthony, who is abroad now, so I never get to have a drink, and chew the cud, which is a shame...
Posted on: 20 October 2005 by u5227470736789439
Dear EW,
I looked for ages for a performance of the Triple Concerto. Eventually I found the one with Fricsay, but I can only remember that Fournier is the Cellist. He is a musical hero if ever! On DG Dokumente.
Fredrik
Posted on: 20 October 2005 by u5227470736789439
quote:
Originally posted by Basil:
[...].
Elgar Cello Concerto
Jacqueline Du Pré
John Barbirolli
London Symphony Orchestra
Dear Basil,
I know many people find this just the ticket, but I always found it a bit wild, and too romantic, but that is just me. For two performances that cut a more classical line, but are of the first rank the is Tortellier with Sargeant in 1954 on Testament, and Navarra with the Halle under Barbirolli, also on Testament, which is something to behold in my view!
Fredrik
Posted on: 21 October 2005 by Earwicker
I grew out of the Elgar cello concerto quite quickly. It's not one of his better compositions - a sort of dreary, wisful dirge with a splash of pomp. The man was better than that.
Pitty really, the violin concerto shows what he could achieve. I think he sold cellists short.
EW