Naim digital amp?

Posted by: Mr_Sukebe on 25 February 2003

I was hoping that someone at Naim could offer their views on the potential for them to create an all digital amp?

This all stems from the dem I heard at Bristol of a TACT digital amp.

Before we go any further, please don't ask me about PRAT for this kind of kit. Personally I couldn't here PRAT from ANY equipment at Bristol, regardless of the manufacturer (probably just a side effect of the setting), so I've no idea how well a digital amp can deal with it.

Either way, on a "hi-fi" perspective, the TACT was simply awesome. The setup looked like it would sound rubbish, but it had completely amazing dynamics, seemingly unlimited headroom (was playing some stuff at obscene volume levels in places to show off the capabilities) etc etc.

In short, as a piece of kit you give it a digital signal and whilst it's converting it to an analogue signal, it also amplifies it. So it's a bit like a DAC with a volume control on the front and a huge power amp built in. The result is that it eliminates the need for a lot of very expensive electronics in the CDP (although I assume a decent transport helps), along with the pre/power amp sections we presently use.

Just to finish it off, it can deal with "room correction" with the right modules. In basic terms it some of the kit comes with a mic that will measure how your system sounds in the room it's in. It then allows you to tailor the sound digitally to whatever you like (both frequency and timing). The result is that you don't end up with the nasty bass humps or suckouts that some of us suffer, or weird resonances in certain areas.

Personally I was VERY impressed.
As I mentioned earlier, I've no idea if the system deals with "PRAT" or not. I'm trying to organise a home dem to prove the case either way to myself.

So, when is Naim going to look at this technology?

Bearing in mind that Sharp and Pioneer are also looking at this, would hate for them to get lost behind.
Posted on: 25 February 2003 by Richard Dane
Mr_Sukebe,

We are keeping a close watch on this interesting technology. We have listened to two types of digital amplifier here, in Salisbury, but neither did the business compared with our standard amps. We will keep investigating but our feeling is that digital amplifiers have a long way to go before they can pose a serious challenge.

Richard
Posted on: 25 February 2003 by BigH47
Richard that opens up a good thread (if not covered before) how much listeneing to the "enemies" do you guys do?

Howard
Posted on: 25 February 2003 by Thunderbird 2
quote:
Originally posted by Richard Dane:
Mr_Sukebe,

We are keeping a close watch on this interesting technology. We have listened to two types of digital amplifier here, in Salisbury, but neither did the business compared with our standard amps. We will keep investigating but our feeling is that digital amplifiers have a long way to go before they can pose a serious challenge.

Richard


Good Evening Richard,
Interesting reply sir, Did you actualy assess a Tact amplifier?, as this is the only true digital one on the market to my limited knowledge, that is truely digital one, all the way to the speakers,(althought the Meridian digital speakers are infact an amp/dac combination rolled into one I think?).
If not The maybe The Class 'd' digital with it's Much Vaulted Switch mode Power supply?, did this not bode well with the current equipment, as I know this is an issue there.
May I ask, Have the chaps in the R+D dept. tried a Class 'T' style amplifier? with it's Analogue inputs/Digital processing/Analogue output?, I use 2 of your Nap 500's which I consider to be the best at reproducing the music that I like, However I have also had a Class 'T' variant in place of the Nap's, and to say I was Surprised at the results, was an Understatement in the extreme, Bear in mind It was competing with a pair of 500's, against a single amplifier, it was far superior in bass control, depth and speed while retaining the PRaT aspects fully and giving the sounds weight and Drive, that I have never heard before, while also improving the upper end of the sound spectrum as well.
Rest assused I am not parting with my beloved Nap's,(Have now evened the odds) However I feel to dismiss this technology lightly is not a wise option, given that time waits for no man.
I attended your excellent CDS3 demostration on Sunday, and I'm pleased to say I feel the Player is a large step in the correct direction, many thanks for an interesting session, best of luck with it for the future and again congratulations on an excellent Launch.

Kind Regards David

Well Balanced Beings Promote Harmony In Music and Soul
Posted on: 25 February 2003 by Tuan
quote:
Originally posted by Thunderbird 2:
quote:
Originally posted by Richard Dane:
Mr_Sukebe,

We are keeping a close watch on this interesting technology. We have listened to two types of digital amplifier here, in Salisbury, but neither did the business compared with our standard amps. We will keep investigating but our feeling is that digital amplifiers have a long way to go before they can pose a serious challenge.

Richard


Good Evening Richard,
Interesting reply sir, Did you actualy assess a Tact amplifier?, as this is the only true digital one on the market to my limited knowledge, that is truely digital one, all the way to the speakers,(althought the Meridian digital speakers are infact an amp/dac combination rolled into one I think?).
If not The maybe The Class 'd' digital with it's Much Vaulted Switch mode Power supply?, did this not bode well with the current equipment, as I know this is an issue there.
May I ask, Have the chaps in the R+D dept. tried a Class 'T' style amplifier? with it's Analogue inputs/Digital processing/Analogue output?, I use 2 of your Nap 500's which I consider to be the best at reproducing the music that I like, However I have also had a Class 'T' variant in place of the Nap's, and to say I was Surprised at the results, was an Understatement in the extreme, Bear in mind It was competing with a pair of 500's, against a single amplifier, it was far superior in bass control, depth and speed while retaining the PRaT aspects fully and giving the sounds weight and Drive, that I have never heard before, while also improving the upper end of the sound spectrum as well.
Rest assused I am not parting with my beloved Nap's,(Have now evened the odds) However I feel to dismiss this technology lightly is not a wise option, given that time waits for no man.
I attended your excellent CDS3 demostration on Sunday, and I'm pleased to say I feel the Player is a large step in the correct direction, many thanks for an interesting session, best of luck with it for the future and again congratulations on an excellent Launch.

Kind Regards David

Well Balanced Beings Promote Harmony In Music and Soul


Very good posting.
Posted on: 25 February 2003 by Paul Ranson
There are many details that can differentiate 'digital' amps. But all those named by Thunderbird 2/WM's Brother switch their outputs between the power rails at a high frequency and vary the 'mark/space' ratio according to signal demands. This then gets fed via a low pass filter and an audio band analog signal emerges. The differences manifest themselves in how the input is processed into a mark/space variance, and I think Tact also vary their rail voltage levels as the crude steps on the volume control.

There are lots of extremely good Occamish reasons why this style of amplification is unsuitable for two channel hifi. They become plausible solutions when you need a lot of channels in a small space, or very high output levels, or cost is a serious consideration.

Paul
Posted on: 26 February 2003 by Mr_Sukebe
Well I'm going to try to get myself some dems of digital amps in surroundings that are closer to my home environment.

Personally I couldn't make out PRAT for ANY kit at the show (including the Naim dems), which I guess is just a side effect of the hotel.
Either way, under the rather difficult circumstances I thought that the TACT kit was the second best sounding gear in the Marriot, just after the VPI/Border Patrol/Living voice system. Bearing in mind that the TACT gear was at most only half the cost of the record playing system, I was mightily impressed. I'll put some results in when I do get a listen.

In short, TACT sell a digital amp, that does the equivalent of a DAC, pre and power amp. Bearing in mind it's cost, puts it in direct competition with something like the CD5/112/200 kit, so I will be trying to get a direct comparison using my Kabers if possible.