ever leave a composer behind?

quote:

Originally posted by Florestan:
Todd: I believe the earlier reference to the Preludes was referring to "Debussy's" Preludes, NOT "Preludes" as a form, in general.

i was talking about debussy's "prelude to the afternoon of a faun" for orchestra, which a number of music historians have identified as the beginning of 20th century music.

quote:

Originally posted by mikeeschman:

i made comments about the "everyman" music i remember from the fifties, but didn't identify any works. i was specifically referring to richard strauss' symphonia domestica and shostakovitch' symphony no. 5.

Interesting you should mention the concept of music for "everyman" ... Hindemith ended many, if not most, of his works with a consonant major chord, no matter how far he may have strayed earlier in the piece, as a willing concession to "everyman."

If you haven't heard his flute sonata, do give it a listen ... a gorgeous piece of music.

quote:

and about atonal music (that excludes hindemith) : right now i am just trying to comprehend it. if i said that, in general, i enjoyed it, it would be a lie. since i am taking the time now to expand my ears, i want to take another crack at this music. there's a lot of it, and in some ways i feel cheated by turning my back to it. but it's all intellectual - not because it really grabs me.

I'm pretty much with you here ... most of my time playing or listening to music is devoted to largely tonal works, not necessarily always diatonic, but usually not dodecaphonic or otherwise purely atonal.

I agree, it comes down to whether I'm moved or not, and while much atonal music can delight my intellect, not much of it moves me, let alone to tears. Jimmy Webb's Wichita Lineman can move me to tears, or John Coltrane's A Love Supreme, or the first movement of Prokofiev's G minor piano concerto, or Keith Jarrett's Lalene, or Ravel's perfect miniature Menuet sur le nom de Haydn, or Stevie Wonder's Superwoman, or the second movement of Beethoven's 7th symphony, or the first movement of Shostakovich's 11th symphony, or just about any early Joni Mitchell.

All best,
Fred

By the way, this is especially true for the music I compose: tonal yet often non-diatonic.

When I was studying composition at the university several decades ago, trying on many musical hats until I found my true voice (which has remained with me to this day), I was once asked pejoratively by a dodecaphonist if I found it "difficult to compose in such an archaic language," i.e., tonality.

I decided that marching to a different drummer, so to speak, did not preclude tonality, and that the only criterion that mattered was to stay absolutely true to oneself. I only wanted to make music that would move others as much as my favorite music moved me, and to do that I had to make music that moved me.

All best,
Fred

quote:

Originally posted by fred simon:
I was once asked pejoratively by a dodecaphonist if I found it "difficult to compose in such an archaic language," i.e., tonality.

i think i hear that attitude in lots of atonal music.

fred simon,

thanks to you i am the proud new owner of a complete set of the hindemith wind sonatas :-)

looking forward to the flute sonata, and will have to autopsy the trumpet sonata - cause old trumpet players never die, they just critique other trumpet players ...

quote:

Originally posted by Todd A:

quote:

Originally posted by mikeeschman:
well, you are the only person on earth i have heard to make the claim that in a century, there is or ever has been a single style. that is your premise, not mine.

Utter, disingenuous nonsense; I never made any such statement, nor is it my premise at all.

Todd A - i have to talk this out, because i am perplexed by your war-like demeanor.

in the american south, calling someone disingenuous is calling them a liar.

i guess i don't appreciate the level of discourse here on the forum. i assumed it was an entertainment; social contact with other people that use naim equipment and love music.

it would make a great bar ...

if someone called you a liar in a bar, that would be something here where i live.

i did not conceive the idea of 20th century music, it has been widely reported since before i was born. i didn't hold the idea of 20th century music up as a rule, but only as an interpretation.

now i'm a liar?

why are we talking to each other?

quote:

Doug, I'm a pianist and I love Hindemith, but Ludus Tonalis is difficult. Sounds too theoretical to my ears.

However, his three piano sonatas from 1936, and his flute sonata (also 1936) are wonderful ... tonal yet not diatonic, freely modulating in inventive ways, often neither major nor minor, very lyrical, soulful, bittersweet, contrapuntal, and always walking a beautiful line between consonance and dissonance. And decidedly abundant in "tone, structure, focus, direction."

Best to check them out by playing them if you're able. Or at least listen to a recording while reading the score ... better to reveal their delights.

All best,
Fred

Bingo! Thanks Fred for the advise. I'm pretty sure we are musically on the same wavelength. I'm going to give these selections a try as well as the Berg Violin Concerto mentioned earlier.

quote:

i was talking about debussy's "prelude to the afternoon of a faun" for orchestra, which a number of music historians have identified as the beginning of 20th century music.

Mike,
Whoosh ! OK, I totally missed that. I guess I have a one track mind lately, as I'm totally immersed (listening & learning) in Preludes for the piano by at least 3 different composers at the moment. Sorry about that...

Fred,

it just got thru my thick skull that you are the composer fred simon whose music can be bought from naim.

i will buy some this weekend.

slow on the uptake,
mike

quote:

Originally posted by mikeeschman:
now i'm a liar?

why are we talking to each other?

i guess this one goes unanswered ...

quote:

Originally posted by mikeeschman:
Fred,

it just got thru my thick skull that you are the composer fred simon whose music can be bought from naim.

i will buy some this weekend.

slow on the uptake,
mike

Thanks very much. Hope you enjoy it!

And if you do, be on the lookout for my new album on Naim, to be released hopefully in the first half of 2009.

All best,
Fred

I love Mahler now tho it has to be a great performance, I like the way he drifts from children's songs, to marches and then into ethereal. Earlier works are definitely fresher than the dark later works.

Wagner is a tough one for me, Once in a while I"m dazzled, other times my rump just hurts for that last half and I can't wait to get out. I'll never see the Ring all the way thru.

Poulenc and Franck are also tough for me, I listen, but not enthralled. I like Shostakovich but not all the time. Certainly he played to the bombastic taste of Stalin but he had some interesting moments.

I guess I"ve never left anyone behind unless I just feel it's too analytical and don't get it from the git go. The whole Baroque style just doesn't do it for me, shame on me for not caring for Mozart. A friend analyzed a month of music on KUSC here in LA and wrote them that they play Mozart 30% of the time. WAAAY too much Mozart, as clever as he was.

g

I'm sure I'd enjoy an afternoon listening to George's collection and having him point things out to me, but early stuff just doesn't excite me the way turn of the century does. Same with art since I come from that background. Yes there's great technique, but when artists started tearing down "reality" just excites the hell out of me. Yet my own artwork is traditional,,,,, go figure.