FOPP stores close

There is no justice in this world is there?
How do HMV and Virgin keep going selling albums around £14 and yet Fopp folds selling at competitive prices? I guess that higher profit makes all the difference. Hopefully they will eventually catch a cold when the majority of music sold is download or on-line CDs.The majors aren't even competitive on-line.

I was given £20 Virgin gift voucher for Christmas that is still in my wallet because I just can't bring myself to pay £14 for a CD when I know I can get it from Amazon for a fiver. I just don't know who buys CD's in Virgin or HMV - are they mad?
Shame about FOPP. They tried really hard and covered most genres without getting too bogged down with chart music. Maybe it is true that Virgin and HMV make their money on T-shirts, games, ipod accessories, Star Trek notebooks, Simpsons lunch-boxes - anything but music. Look out the window right now and count the number of people listening to ipods - they seem to be 50% of the population - so are they all downloading? Maybe we CD buyers really are in a minority now.
If music is going to be produced compressed for mp3 players, where is that going to leave us lot who want hi-fi quality? I wonder where this is going. Ironic that those people on the street with white wires in their ears mean that people are listening to music more than ever before, but we are facing a crisis.

Another thing - In Brighton at least, and probably most other places, parking is becoming impossible. I went into the city with some friends for the evening and we left the car in an NCP car park. We were maybe 4 hours. The parking charge for the evening was £14!! There was no-where to park on the street for miles. During the day you can just forget it. The consequence is that I haven't been into the city centre to shop for anything for probably two years now - we even get all our Christmas shopping on-line. I get my clothes mostly from the supermarket and my jeans when I am out of the country. I imagine that FOPP is the first of many retail outlets that will go as people are actively discouraged to shop in the city centre. Maybe clothes shops will survive longer, but dedicated music shops and others that can easily be challenged by on-line shopping don't stand a chance. This is as much about council policy as music trends I think.

Just saw that on the BBC web site homepage. What a shame as a lot of friends liked the store.
Personally there wasn't one near me so I didn't buy anything from them.

shame

im saddened by this news as i really liked the shop. i must also say that i find it very srange that they bought up music zone shops and opened new shops (one in tott ct rd) only very recently to announce soon after that they are to all intents going into liquidation. stinks of bad management if you ask me.

I agree with rasher. It seems to be public policy to discourage us from going into town and city centres. As a result, they will continue to wither and decline.
Books and music lend themselves to the on-line retail model. Anything which needs to be tried on or physically checked prior to purchase is still best bought from a real shop though.

quote:

Originally posted by Chris Kelly:
I agree with rasher. It seems to be public policy to discourage us from going into town and city centres. As a result, they will continue to wither and decline.
Books and music lend themselves to the on-line retail model. Anything which needs to be tried on or physically checked prior to purchase is still best bought from a real shop though.

Mind I get all my clothes from NEXT delivered as they are one of the few retailers who flog stuff for the giants in our midst. Very good for returning stuff too. Can't be doing with proper shopping

Oh dear this is sad. Over recent years Fopp had become my favourite real (as opposed to virtual) record store. Rasher makes some good points. I have long feared for the future of the record shop. I recommend checking some of the links to other reports of woes for music retailing on the BBC web site. It does not bode well for those of us who like to listen to music on proper hi-fi.

Regards,
CB

A few posts mention how good Fopp prices are compared to HMV. Perhaps those prices are so low as to be unsustainable?

My nearest Fopp is in Bath, which for some reason has 2 Fopps. I'm no retail guru, but having 2 outlets in the same (smallish) town when you're a specialist retailer seems a bit dim.

Mark S

A real effing shame. Even more so given that they seemed the one High Street retailer remotely bothered with jazz recordings.

quote:

Originally posted by cider glider:
My nearest Fopp is in Bath, which for some reason has 2 Fopps. I'm no retail guru, but having 2 outlets in the same (smallish) town when you're a specialist retailer seems a bit dim.

I suppose you may have a point there but each store was always fairly busy at the weekends, when I go into Bath.

I'll miss them greatly. I hate going into HMV - it feels so corporate <shudder>.

I hate going into HMV - it feels so corporate <shudder>.[/QUOTE]

I also hate going into HMV there is no "soul" in the place.

I am old enough to remember the original old Edinburgh Virgin store which was tiny and when you went through the shoe shop to get to Virgin upstairs in Oxford Street. Aah those were the days when there were hundreds of indepnedent retailers everywhere.

Things are not looking good really are they?

Record shops closing, quality of recordings diminishing (well mainstream ones anyway) and as many people buying 2 channel audio as there are buying cat's (or rabbit's) ears.

Luckily you lot have Gordon to sort it all out while we're stuck with Bertie.



SJB

I'm Gutted.

I loved Fopp - Bath had 2.

100% of my music buying will now be done online with a good proportion of that being shipped from the States - it's mad.

worm

As Hammerhead's Partner in Crime, this is disasterous.



I may have money left over at the end of the month

Just for your own edification, Virgin announced plans to close their Megastore in downtown Chicago–it's not just Fopp that's feeling the pain.

Thanks Dave, but unfortunately what marks Fopp out in the UK - in every branch I've visited - is that somehow they consistently employ people who overtly love music and are always worth tapping for local knowledge on bands to watch , gigs to catch and so on. Quite different from the average marketing machine.


(worm - where in Bath are you..?)

This is bad news for music in UK. The Tottenham Court Road branch was only a minute's walk from my office and whilst I enjoyed the choice, it always struck me during their brief tenure that they could have bitten off more than they could chew - that retail unit had a pretty massive floor area whose rent in central London must have been enormous (once the end of the initial rent free period lapsed). Interestingly, the previous tenant, Purves+Purves had to shut up shop because of punitive rent reviews.

That was but one store example and I imagine this problem could easily have been replicated in many other stores in what has proven to be an ill considered attempt at rapid expansion of a fragile business model.

Peter

quote:

Originally posted by Sloop John B:
as many people buying 2 channel audio as there are buying cat's ears.

Can't be so bad then - the shop where I buy my cat's ears is always busy (at least at the weekends).

quote:

Originally posted by Rasher:
I was given £20 Virgin gift voucher for Christmas that is still in my wallet because I just can't bring myself to pay £14 for a CD when I know I can get it from Amazon for a fiver.

I am sorry boys but this is the attitude that is killing bricks and mortar shops, I like going into shops to buy my CD's and Vinyl and I will put my money where my mouth is I buy all my Music from shops (Sister Ray, HMV, Rough Trade, Phonica, Sounds Of the Universe, Rays Jazz, Sounds 323). Expecting to pay less for a CD than 20 years ago is bloody lunacy to my mind. This subject pisses me off with the attitude of people "Oh its a shame that shops are closing down" and then they won't put their hands in their pockets to change the situation. If you go into HMV you can buy CD's from £5 to £25 so I suggest having a look next time and they have a selection of music that makes Fopp look pathetic. If your ever in London and want great advice on all music and be able to find the best in new music from all genre's I suggest you go to the "Independent Record Shop Of The Year" SISTER RAY in Berwick st it pisses over Fopp by a large margin.


As you can probably see I never really liked Fopp limited selection to my mind just go into a large HMV or Virgin and you'll see what I mean.Fopp have gone under because of their massive expansion in a short time and also if you read the news piece properly they are looking to their bank to help them out and say that they are still profitable so the situation might change.

Here's some good News for Indie lovers Rough Trade are opening a new store just off Brick Lane E1 soon, but are closing the Covent Garden store, the new store is supposedly quite large. I shall be checking it out soon and also there are another two independent stores over at Brick lane Beats Workin' (S/H) City 16 (Dance) in Chesire st. Also Reckless records who went under a few weeks ago their store in Bertwick st has re-opened under a new name and a great selection of S/H records and CD's can be had.


If anybody wants to know where great music can be purchased from independent shops send me email (deant@nildram.co.uk) and I'll tell you where to go in London. Or if you want I could put up a sticky in the Music section if the Mods allow it.



This subject of buying from record shop is dear to my heart and pisses me off with attitude of why should I pay more when I can get it from Amazon at "silly prices". If you want shops to stay alive PUT YOU MONEY WHERE YOUR MOUTH IS you might be surprised how "Competitive" some of the shops I've mention are.



Anyone who doesn't live in London, can they suggest shops in their areas which are great to go to.



Dean...Buys CD's and Vinyl from £5 to £20 from a BLOODY shop.

quote:

This subject of buying from record shop is dear to my heart and pisses me off with attitude of why should I pay more when I can get it from Amazon at "silly prices".

It's a shame you're pissed off, and it's a shame to see Fopp go under but the Parry-esque reality is that people will not pay 14 quid for a cd when they can get it for a fiver.

The sad thing for me was that as a CD shop FOPP seem to have got it so right. With the clearly defined music genre, racks full of CD's that were not to found in other stores and good prices.

One of our local Virgin Megastores (Bristol Cribs Causeway) has got it so wrong! For example - with Jazz/Easy/Blues/Country they mix up all the cds (keeping them alphabetical) into one section in several racks and call them 'Specialist'. How frustrating is that!!! Then they dont seem to restock very frequently, as I have seen the same half empty racks in the same state over several weeks. Ok, perhaps that is due to the way their suppliers schedule their deliveries and maybe the online sales take preference, but if they want to give buyers an incentive to go there on a regular basis then they should make an effort. The only reason I buy in Virgin or HMV these days is if they have what I want (usually in a sale) at a good price that is comparible or better than an online one.

Regards
Geoff

Dean just read your post after writing mine.

If I go to London to CD shop then yes the giant HMV and Virgin stores are top of my list to visit, because of their stock list, but the fact is locally here FOPP were the best stores for me and many others.

QUOTE "Anyone who doesn't live in London, can they suggest shops in their areas which are great to go to."

I think I just did.

Geoff who buys CD's from £5 to £20 from any shop !

quote:

Originally posted by Malky:

It's a shame you're pissed off, and it's a shame to see Fopp go under but the Parry-esque reality is that people will not pay 14 quid for a cd when they can get it for a fiver.

Here Malky


Read my post again not all Cd's are £14 they are a lot cheaper in the stores I have mentioned here's what they cost from Sister Ray. I think they'll reasonable and competitive seeing as you can play them before you buy them in the store and have S/H vinyl cleaned.


ARCTIC MONKEYS: Favourite Worst Nightmare CD 9.99 Ltd LP 11.99

BATTLES: Mirrored CD 9.99 Ltd Dbl LP 13.99

FRANK BLACK 93-03 Dbl CD 11.99

DIGITALISM: Idealism CD 9.99 Ltd LP 15.99

DIZZEE RASCAL: Maths & English CD 9.99 Dbl LP 12.99

NICK DRAKE: Pink Moon/Five Leaves Left ea Ltd LP 11..99

EDITORS:An End Has A Start CD 9.99 Ltd CD 11.99 Ltd LP 11.99

FRIDGE: The Sun CD 9.99 Ltd Dbl LP 14.99

HAPPY MONDAYS:Uncle Dysfunktional [Exclusively Signed] CD 11.99


MUSE: Black Holes & Revelations (Tour Edition) Ltd CD+DVD 11.99

NATIONAL: Boxer CD 9.99 Ltd LP 11.99

SEBADOH:Freed Man [Remaster + Extra tracks] CD 9.99 Ltd LP 13.99

JUDEE SILL: Live In London 72-73 CD 11.99

SONIC YOUTH: Daydream Nation (Expanded) Dbl CD 14.99

BRUCE SPRINGSTEEN:Transmissions [Philadelphia 75] Ltd CD + Book 11.99

JOE STRUMMER: Future Is Unwritten CD 11.99

RICHARD THOMPSON: Sweet Warrior CD 11.99

TRAVELLING WILBURYS: Collection Dbl CD+DVD 14.99

VON SUDENFED (MARK E SMITH & MOUSE ON MARS):………
……………. Tromatic Reflexxions CD 9.99 Ltd LP 11.99

WILCO: Sky Blue Sky CD 9.99 Ltd CD+DVD 13.99 Ltd Dbl 180 Gm LP 24.99

JAMES YORKSTON: Roaring The Gospel CD 9.99 Ltd Dbl 10" 12.99



I could go on and on. A lot of re-issues are even cheaper well under a tenner.

Though my point was if you really don't want shops to close pay the the premium to keep them open, thats what I'm willing to do.

Dean..

quote:

Originally posted by Geoff Cottle:
Dean just read your post after writing mine.

If I go to London to CD shop then yes the giant HMV and Virgin stores are top of my list to visit, because of their stock list, but the fact is locally here FOPP were the best stores for me and many others.

QUOTE "Anyone who doesn't live in London, can they suggest shops in their areas which are great to go to."

I think I just did.

Geoff who buys CD's from £5 to £20 from any shop !

Geoff thanks I might have been a little harsh on Fopp I suppose they are better than local HMV and Vigin. I'm just spoilt rotten working in central London.



Dean...