Pianists are getting better, and recordings too.

In "Fahrenheit 451", there are people who become books.

Performers do a good bit of that in learning their music.

Sounds like fun!

Florestan, I think you will be amazed at the sound of the Pleyel. I can't quite describe it--it of course does not have quite the power of a modern grand, but the sound is very full in the complete range from bass to treble. Give it a try.

As to Schumann, there are so many great recordings it is hard to know where to begin. One of my all-time favorites is a live recital by Michelangeli on Testament playing Carnaval and other Schumann and Chopin works. It might be hard to find and pricey but is well worth seeking out. Another favorite is Berkhard Schliessman on Bayer playing the Symphonic Etudes and Kriesleriana. Richter's classic Fantasy on EMI is also hard to beat. I also like very much Schumann's first piano sonata and there is a great rendition by Gilels on BBC Legends.

quote:

Originally posted by mikeeschman:
In "Fahrenheit 451", there are people who become books.

Performers do a good bit of that in learning their music.

Sounds like fun!

Seriously, in the quest to close the distance between performer and listener, I begin to think it makes sense for the listener to do one of the things every performer does, which is to memorize the music.

It seems like that would give much better insight into what the performer is doing.

I think the WTC might be a good place to start, as it has been listened to so much recently.

I gave another listen to the Edna Stern Bach disk. One of the difficulties in hearing a new performer play known music is that the first listen is soiled by comparison with what you already know. I was lucky this morning, as I woke up in a receptive frame of mind. I just let her play for me.

Edna Stern has a cool, reflective quality to her playing. She sorts out the melodic bits in fugues, making more sense of them. Her technique is effortless and understated, you always have the sense of complete control.

The WTC Book 1 D Minor Prelude and Fugue (track 13 and 14), dubbed "the sneaky cat" by my wife and I, is a big favorite, and Stern delivers a lovely performance that made me smile.

This disk is going to get a lot more air time.

Florestan,

I hope you enjoy the Bernard Roberts Beethoven. They have certain raw-emotion quality that makes them electrifying!

Oldnslow,

I'll search for that Chopin. Chopin is very close to my heart. I've had the pleasure of playing on an 1857 Pleyel. Wonderful experience!

Mike,

Memorising, as a listener, is a fine idea. However, it helps if the listener is a musician, i think. I have a challenge for you - try to memorize each fugue voice individually, so that you can sing it all the way through. I cannot do it!

Thanks Oldnslow for those great suggestions! Hopefully they are all still available.

quote:

Originally posted by Dan Carney:
I have a challenge for you - try to memorize each fugue voice individually, so that you can sing it all the way through. I cannot do it!

I have been trying to memorize all the themes in the WTC for about six months. Some stick in your head like glue, while others slip out your ear or ball up like a wad of gum with other themes.

But I am hopeful another six months will improve the situation :-)

As far as memorizing all the fugue voices, I think I am too much monkey, not enough human, for that!

quote:

try to memorize each fugue voice individually, so that you can sing it all the way through. I cannot do it!

I am thinking you mean while playing the piece ? I cannot do this either. It is a challenge and fun to try it though. Once one can do this feat I believe one can say they really know this music!

Mike, my question is similar to Dan's. Do you mean just getting really familiar to a piece through listening or do you mean to memorize / know the music through a score like a musician would in order to play it?

Sorry Mike, I guess you answered my question just above !

quote:

Originally posted by Florestan:
Mike, my question is similar to Dan's. Do you mean just getting really familiar to a piece through listening or do you mean to memorize / know the music through a score like a musician would in order to play it?

I would like to be able to call up the entire WTC at will from memory, and play it back in my head at will, just as if I had put the CD on.

I think the score is important to me. If I read a number of Preludes and Fugues, including the D Minor from Book 1, I can hear it clearly in my head.

That's only one step removed from doing it without the sheet music.

But here's where desire and ability have a collision. It's taking me considerable effort just to remember primary themes, so how far can I really go?

I think many people under-estimate the mental feat it is for a pianist to memorize music.

Giving it a shot is very illuminating, it is putting me in my place :-)

It is always better to know exactly what your limits are, and it leaves you more appreciative of what performers do.

Mike, I don't think it is necessarily about reaching ones limits. Patience, discipline, and focus are key. There are a small minority among us that have a photographic mind but I'm certainly not one among them. The reality is I have to build my brain muscle the hard way by repetition.

So don't get frustrated if something doesn't come quickly or within 6 months etc. as you have to start small (1 or 2 P & F's) and don't expect to have perfection with all 48 that quickly. For example, listening to Hewitt WTC today is a culmination of her whole life. I don't know her age but if she is 50 I would imagine that she has been working at it for maybe 45 years.

I read somewhere that someone did a study and came up with the fact that it takes at least 10,000 hours to become proficient at your craft.

So keep at it and remember patience is the key. If you want it all for next week you will only set yourself up for disappointment.

Regards,
Doug

Honestly Florestan, it's not frustrating. It fact, it may be the most fulfilling thing I've done for the enjoyment of music in a long time.

I have the luxury of letting it take as long as it takes.

The strangest thing is that the more I do remember, the "fresher" the WTC sounds.

Isn't that odd ...

After thinking about it for a while, it's not odd at all.

Bach is so perfect that remembering more is always going to improve things.

How many composers can you say that about?

I've just got hold of Pollini - Live from Salle Pleyel (recorded live in December 09). Not on CD, but LossLess download.

Schonberg - Drei Klavierstucke, Op. 11
Beethoven - Hammerklavier, Op. 106
Beethoven Bagatelles - Op. 126, nos 3 and 4

The HK is absolutely stunning! Pollini recorded is superb. Live, he is terrific! I'm not sure if this can be bettered... seriously!

We listened to the Edna Stern again, for a third time.

This is great stuff.

She is cool, composed, graceful, lucid and suffused with beauty.

Life is exciting! Long live "Sneaky Cat".

Mike, I think we need to know more about the 'sneaky cat' !

quote:

Originally posted by Dan Carney:
Mike, I think we need to know more about the 'sneaky cat' !

"Sneaky Cat" is my nickname for the D minor Prelude and Fugue from Book 1 of the WTC :-)

Maybe we should, between us, nickname them all!

Just listened to the Edna Stern on my new (used) speakers! A little different ...

Even better now!

quote:

Originally posted by Dan Carney:
Maybe we should, between us, nickname them all!

OK, but "sneaky cat" stays, the Book 1 D Minor is taken!

I've just found something quite interesting...

Bartok Piano Concerti, on DG. No. 1 is played by Zimerman.

Not a piece that I rate highly, but the performance, and recording/production quality is awesome! Maybe, the more I listen to it, the more I'll begin to understand it...

Are any of you familiar with the Bartok 1?

I really don't like that Bartok, the themes are "clumsy".

I think Bartok uses texture, and timbre in an interesting way... However, I'm not sure if that's enough.

I continue to listen.

Out of interest, does anyone know what piano Fred Simon is playing on the recording of 'Poetspeak' (the one based on the Schumann...).

It has a lovely 'round' tone in the middle register.

I'm sure he'll be along soon and tell you.

Dan, how's it going with the Bartok?