What we have learnt from the Naim DAC...
Posted by: PureHifi on 11 November 2009
I thought it was time that we posted a few tid-bits of our experience with the Ripping, storage and playback of music after our resent promotional event that formed a part of the New Zealand Naim roadshow.
As a Naim retailer we learned a lot from the New Zealand Naim distributor, Chris Murphy, and are finding the whole move to digital storage and playback very interesting...and a lot more involved than a lot of people might initially think.
Our roadshow kit was as follows:
CDX2 (latest with digital out)
HDX (used with digital out)
DAC (with and without a 555PS)
282/supercap, 250.2, Fraim/ Ovator S-600's
Apart from the obvious new speaker exploration we settled down to get to grips with the new CDX2 + DAC and experiment with the HDX a bit more. In particular we wanted to get a solid handle on the performance variations with ripping CD media and the storage and playback.
Ripping the software used does affect the final playback, Chris had files from the same CD Track ripped to WAV with several software packages (WMP, iTunes, EAC, DBpowerAmp, HDX, etc) and the outright winner was the HDX rip - iTunes sounded horrible - ragged & sibilant would best describe it.
Storing It became apparent that the storage medium also influences the audio performance. The simplest example was writing the same HDX ripped music file to different USB memory sticks and then playing them back via the USB input on the DAC - cheap memory sticks generally played back poorly compared to a higher priced stick from LaCie. Perhaps this reflects on Naim's choice of Hard Disk drives used in the HDX.
Playback Several things in the playback domain have cropped up recently for us, in both Naim's solutions and other brands that we stock. We have found, in terms of digital playback from PC laptops and MacBook, that the media player software has a huge impact on the music quality - WMP was poor but Winamp and Foobar were great by comparison (never got around to iTunes). The USB cable between a Cambridge DacMagic and our laptop was also a hugely variable item, we tried a range of normal looking USB cables (some with superior shielding and RF stoppers) and ran them against a Wireworld Ultraviolet USB1 cable, results were outstandingly in favour of the Wireworld item over all others tried. We could not try our Wireworld USB cable on the WD external HDD because of it's use of a mini USB connector but I am looking forward to testing it on a LaCie HDD that has the right USB connector.
The Western Digital 1TB external HDD feeding the HDX also benefited from a power supply upgrade, it might sound over the top but it made for a better result in the music (and was a good use for a spare NAPSC).
I can't explain in technical terms why a lot of these findings are the way they were, we judged everything on its sound merit and I am reporting our results.
What it highlighted most of all was the wonderful way that Naim's R & D has worked to make all those variables disappear for a customer in the HDX product - by providing Superior Ripping, storage and playback in one box.
The DAC is a wonderful device and will be a very successful product.
As a Naim retailer we learned a lot from the New Zealand Naim distributor, Chris Murphy, and are finding the whole move to digital storage and playback very interesting...and a lot more involved than a lot of people might initially think.
Our roadshow kit was as follows:
CDX2 (latest with digital out)
HDX (used with digital out)
DAC (with and without a 555PS)
282/supercap, 250.2, Fraim/ Ovator S-600's
Apart from the obvious new speaker exploration we settled down to get to grips with the new CDX2 + DAC and experiment with the HDX a bit more. In particular we wanted to get a solid handle on the performance variations with ripping CD media and the storage and playback.
Ripping the software used does affect the final playback, Chris had files from the same CD Track ripped to WAV with several software packages (WMP, iTunes, EAC, DBpowerAmp, HDX, etc) and the outright winner was the HDX rip - iTunes sounded horrible - ragged & sibilant would best describe it.
Storing It became apparent that the storage medium also influences the audio performance. The simplest example was writing the same HDX ripped music file to different USB memory sticks and then playing them back via the USB input on the DAC - cheap memory sticks generally played back poorly compared to a higher priced stick from LaCie. Perhaps this reflects on Naim's choice of Hard Disk drives used in the HDX.
Playback Several things in the playback domain have cropped up recently for us, in both Naim's solutions and other brands that we stock. We have found, in terms of digital playback from PC laptops and MacBook, that the media player software has a huge impact on the music quality - WMP was poor but Winamp and Foobar were great by comparison (never got around to iTunes). The USB cable between a Cambridge DacMagic and our laptop was also a hugely variable item, we tried a range of normal looking USB cables (some with superior shielding and RF stoppers) and ran them against a Wireworld Ultraviolet USB1 cable, results were outstandingly in favour of the Wireworld item over all others tried. We could not try our Wireworld USB cable on the WD external HDD because of it's use of a mini USB connector but I am looking forward to testing it on a LaCie HDD that has the right USB connector.
The Western Digital 1TB external HDD feeding the HDX also benefited from a power supply upgrade, it might sound over the top but it made for a better result in the music (and was a good use for a spare NAPSC).
I can't explain in technical terms why a lot of these findings are the way they were, we judged everything on its sound merit and I am reporting our results.
What it highlighted most of all was the wonderful way that Naim's R & D has worked to make all those variables disappear for a customer in the HDX product - by providing Superior Ripping, storage and playback in one box.
The DAC is a wonderful device and will be a very successful product.
I think you hit the nail on the head Joe......musics all about enjoyment not statistics. more people should try using the things on either side of their heads more! 
quote:Originally posted by scottyhammer:
I think you hit the nail on the head Joe......musics all about enjoyment not statistics. more people should try using the things on either side of their heads more!
Well it's interesting, isn't it? You can own a top flight CDP for years and not give a shiny one whether it is producing too many errors unless you can hear something.
Suddenly you transfer the same information from an optical disc to hard disc and need the emotional crutch of an error log?
Nope I don't get that, but each to his own.
I'm sure if CDP makers had realised there was such a market they could have added it as a feature.
Joe
quote:Originally posted by scottyhammer:
musics all about enjoyment not statistics.
Says the man who will ONLY use a Mac, and will never touch a "bloody PC" ever again.
Dont know what thats got to do with the price of fish and for your information nobby I have a cd player - record deck - dac - all connected to naim amps and enjoy them all....whats wrong with that ?
your the one who brought it up !
then go to bed.
then go to bed.
quote:Originally posted by scottyhammer:
your the one who brought it up !
then go to bed.
I dont know what time it is in hammerland, but its 3:25pm here. I am 9 hours (and 9 pints) from sleepytime....
IT's
oh, oh, oh, oh, oh,oh,oh!
oh, oh, oh, oh, oh,oh,oh!pc,
perhaps you will be talking more sense in the morning then ?
scotty
perhaps you will be talking more sense in the morning then ?
scotty
Can't touch this!
There again probably ....NOT! 
By the way, I don't care for studio talk either. Trust me when I say they don't generally sound special other than source and that aspect is leveling with 24/96. Itreminds me of Bose adverts with musicians and conductors. 
Studios are purpose built and very functional for their purpose but most here would much rather listen at home.PC, did you hear the DAC at Connan's?
I had loaded XMPlay in the past but after seeing the interface, dumped it without a listen. Didn't realize I had it before until I saw it again. I put it back yesterday, changed the skin and added ASIO and took the time to find a convenient way to use it. Easy to use quickly buy going to the file and just clicking a selection when set as default music player. Makes all the difference. Will play entire albums (folders) or individual selections this way. Playlists are available to make. Still bare bones but it handles WAV pretty well which is imporatant to me personally. Apparently the lowest resource player out there and an executable program, not a true install if that matters.
I'll give an idea on sound latter when used with a system and I'm hopeful after the posts by ghook2020 who seems to share some of my views on players.
Well - we have the open house this weekend and I have just been informed that the Ovators are out of commission
Gregg
Gregg
quote:Originally posted by js:
PC, did you hear the DAC at Connan's?
I had loaded XMPlay in the past but after seeing the interface, dumped it without a listen. Didn't realize I had it before until I saw it again. I put it back yesterday, changed the skin and added ASIO and took the time to find a convenient way to use it. Easy to use quickly buy going to the file and just clicking a selection when set as default music player. Makes all the difference. Will play entire albums (folders) or individual selections this way. Playlists are available to make. Still bare bones but it handles WAV pretty well which is imporatant to me personally. Apparently the lowest resource player out there and an executable program, not a true install if that matters.
I'll give an idea on sound latter when used with a system and I'm hopeful after the posts by ghook2020 who seems to share some of my views on players.
JS -
Have you tried XXHighEnd? It has gotten some positive reviews over at computeraudiophile.com.
Also, did you see the announcement by Linn today? They are exiting the CD player biz to focus on streamers.
To quote my dealer: the end is nigh.
Hook
quote:Originally posted by ghook2020:
Have you tried XXHighEnd? It has gotten some positive reviews over at computeraudiophile.com.
And on Hydrogen Audio he was completely torn to miniscule threads in the beginning of the year.
Might give it a try myself
-
aleg
No I haven't but I will try it if I can just down load it. I'll do sothe next time I have a Naim DAC on hand. Really some of these differences were pretty small in the system I used yesterday which wasn't top of the shop so a better setup is in order. I can understand why some of this isn't a big deal for some when if add format and source to mix. I'm keeping everything loaded up for a better compare with wav source and have tried to optimize buffer size and output whether Kernel, ASIO, or Direct depending on player for an easy runoff again. Straight Winamp will be tried without the MM wrapper also. I'm not assuming anything at this point.quote:Originally posted by ghook2020:quote:Originally posted by js:
PC, did you hear the DAC at Connan's?
I had loaded XMPlay in the past but after seeing the interface, dumped it without a listen. Didn't realize I had it before until I saw it again. I put it back yesterday, changed the skin and added ASIO and took the time to find a convenient way to use it. Easy to use quickly buy going to the file and just clicking a selection when set as default music player. Makes all the difference. Will play entire albums (folders) or individual selections this way. Playlists are available to make. Still bare bones but it handles WAV pretty well which is imporatant to me personally. Apparently the lowest resource player out there and an executable program, not a true install if that matters.
I'll give an idea on sound latter when used with a system and I'm hopeful after the posts by ghook2020 who seems to share some of my views on players.
JS -
Have you tried XXHighEnd? It has gotten some positive reviews over at computeraudiophile.com.
Also, did you see the announcement by Linn today? They are exiting the CD player biz to focus on streamers.
To quote my dealer: the end is nigh.
Hook
Aleg, I haven't read it but let me guess. Everybody was on him because it had to be playing the same bits but once the right guys heard it, it became more accepted. Just read this. I bet it went over well.
"On the FLAC (or ALAC) matter : This is about on the top of my prio list. The "on the fly" conversion from FLAC (etc.) also won't be all that easy, because doing that the normal way influences the soundquality, and it really shouldn't."
As for Linn's anouncement. It's probably a good marketing move for them relative to what they're actually selling. After all, they still support vinyl in a big way so they didn't do this due to CD availability. They're certainly allowed to run their bussiness as they see fit and to be judged only on what they actually produce. I do predict that CDs will still be around when firewire becomes a legacy format. http://news.zdnet.com/2100-9595_22-262047.html