Upgrading the second system

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would a 32.5+hicap be man enough for a CDX.

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It was once considered plenty good enough for an LP12/Ekos/Troika so why not.

Steve B

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Originally posted by Mick Parry:

ISo although only a temporary measure, would a 32.5+hicap be man enough for a CDX.

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Easily. The 32.5 is a damn fine pre-amp.

CDX, 32.5/Hi/250, Sara (or SBL) sounds like a pretty well balanced and fun system to me.

Regards
Steve

I saw a pair of pre used SBLs at Audio T at Chandlers Ford today - dunnow much about them - they were traded in for a pair of WB Discoveries

Derek

Of course!

When I first got my CDX, I ran it for a while in my office with 32.5/SNAPS/110/RoydMerlin. I compared it against the 3.5/Flat, and the differences were obvious. Go for it Mick!

-=> Mike Hanson <=-

Just how far from your lounge/main system is your dining room anyway?

The reason I ask is that with 135s(or 500)/Bariks in the lounge, why bother with having kit in the eatery? Surely an infrared re-transmitter of some sort from the head of the dinning table to the 'band' in the lounge would suffice. No?

Alternatively, what about a wee pair of teak Kans driven by a spare amp hanging off the side of the main systems pre (again with an infrared re-transmitter)? Would there be some way of discretely running cable from the lounge to the dining room?

Surely CD3.5+hicap(or CDX)/32.5(or 82)+hicap/250/Sara(or SBL) would be sadly wasted were it just to be used for background muzak during Parry parties.

Or have I missed the point?

Craig

You might have Craig. Two systems means a choice of program, not just sound in two rooms.

Lady Mick might want to listen to Norah Jones in the kitchen whilst ripping the foil off the pop tarts, meanwhile his nibs rocks out to Slipnot in the parlour.

Chaps

The second system is in the dining room which is interconnected to the kitchen where the wife listens to the radio or her favourite CD's at moderate level.

We do have quite a few dinner parties where the sound is more background, but one does require quality of sound and clarity even at low levels.

Also I am obtaining quotes to have the dining room extended by adding a small conservatory, so I want something that has a reasonable amount of welly.

The CD3.5 is not bad at all but it feels a bit second rate when compared to the main system.

I just wondered if the 32.5+hicap was man enough to handle the CDX.

Regards

Mick

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The CD3.5 is not bad at all but it feels a bit second rate when compared to the main system.

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Hey Mick, that's why it's the second system. Unless it really bothers you, I'd stick with what you have and be done with it. A while back I built a second system around the Nait and Linn Basik that I have. This was fine, but until very recently it was hardly used as given the choice I would listen to the main system 10 times out of 10. That's why it's my main system. Now that the main system is mainly in storage (for reasons of size and convenience whilst I have my home renovated prior to (hopefully lucrative) sale), I am listening to the second system more - although I substituted the Nait-2 out and replaced with my DNM/Crimsons as the Nait just wasn't really powerful enough to control the Shahinian's bass. But that's a story for another time.

TC '..'
"Girl, you thought he was a man, but he was a Muffin..."

The NAC 32.5 has to be one of the finest preamps ever made. I don't think there's any disagreement about that. Even running into a NAIT 1, the CDX would be a substantial and worthwhile improvement over the 3.5.

Personally, I think that are aspects of the 32.5/72's performance which are closer to the 52 than the 82, but this is obviously more contentious.

Beware the monarch's taylor! Last night I spent 4 hours listening to CDSII/552/500 both passive into SL2s and active, with 3 x 500 into NBLs (all on Fraim). It was extremely competent and articulate (esp. the passive system) but lacked the fun and tingle of LP12/Ittok/Asak/32.5/SNAPS/250/Kans.

Comparing the relative costs of assembing both systems from scratch today certainly makes you think a bit.

Best;

Mark

(an imperfect
forum environment is
better than none)

Guys

We all remember our first Mini and oh what fun it was too. Wheel on each corner, easy to maintain, low insurance etc. But there was always the one thing that we wanted. For it to go faster!

Later

Doug

Mick,

I'm sure I've mentioned this before, but why not have a cable made up to connect between the tape output on the 52 to one of the inputs on the 32.

Your second system will then be fed by the sources and pre from your main system... far better than what you currently running.

If you insist on 2 systems then:

CDX/XPS; 32.5/SC; 250; Kans.

Chuck those ridiculous Saras out forthwith and replace with Kans and if you Supercap the 32.5 you will discover that its one of the best Naim preamps there is - better than an 82/2HCs to my ears.

If you don't want to spend that money just chuck out the Saras and replace with Kans - a lovely second system, much more suitable as background music but capable of going surprisingly loud - just ask Dev.

Alex

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- a lovely second system, much more suitable as background music but capable of going surprisingly loud - just ask Dev.

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Hi there Uncle Mick,

Having visited you, enjoyed your hospitality and heard your two systems, I think that given the environment the second system is to be used in you might want to consider leaving the system well alone. It sounded OK to me and also the quality of the equipment will not be fully realised as the ambient background noise (kitchen, etc) will be much higher.

I know it's tempting to use better and better equipment but the listening environment is the biggest influence on the sound.

As an alternative, you might want to consider setting up your first system to get the maximum from it - the position of the speakers for example and then maybe consider upgrading after that.

I have a similar system to you and have used it in five different rooms and feel that you could get more from what you have but altering the room layout.

best regards

Young Dev

If you find the sound of "Kans" better than "Ridiculous SARAS", Maybe you'd better disconnect the bass cable from your amps to your bariks...This would approximate the bandwidth of Kans!

I had a chance to play around with combinations of 32.5 82 2 HCs and an SC for about a month.

There is no doubt in my mind whatsoever that the best and most cost-effective Naim upgrade path is 32.5/HC > 32.5/SC > 52, leaving out the 82 altogether.

A Supercap transforms a 32.5 (and doubtless a 72 too) into something magical. I prefered it in my system to 82/SC actually - less resolution and 'hi-fi' stuff, but also less harsh - more old-fashioned Naim - warm with lovely PR&T.

Alex

Although Kans and Briks are a bit coloured Saras are very coloured and slow to my ears. The first two are capable of magic quite often, Saras very rarely so. Also they're real pigs to drive. (But I don't actually have Briks to do as you suggest).

Alex

Doug Graham said:

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We all remember our first Mini and oh what fun it was too. Wheel on each corner, easy to maintain, low insurance etc. But there was always the one thing that we wanted. For it to go faster!

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I agree, technology has also moved on too. There has been a gradual improvement in hi-fi over the past 10 years that results in a massive step-up in performance between now and 10 years ago.

What blew our minds then may be taken for granted now.

Having said this, it is often a symptom of us old-hands that we have feelings of nostalgia and wonder what it would be like to have a cheap Planar 3/Ion Systems or Creek/Royd system again. Simple sensible fun and all that.

With some of us, the cost of our next upgrade would buy just that. The downside being a halt in the upgrade process of the main system.

Andrew

Andrew Randle
Currently in the "Linn Binn"

Chaps

I will probably go for the CDX, however I was taken up with John Gilleran's idea which was I quote..." why not have a cable made up to connect between the tape output on the 52 to one of the inputs on the 32."

I worked out that I will need about 38ft of cable to do it.

So really three questions here

1. Will 38 ft of cable kill the sound
2. Will the 32.5 sound like the 52
3. Can they both be played at the same time.

Also I still intend to flog the Saras and replace them with SBL's but I will have a look at the epos. I know they have a good reputation and I agree, the Saras are dated, bloated and slow.

Finally, to Dev, I take your point about moving the Briks in the main room so as they fire down the down rather than across the room, but Mrs Mick, she say no.

Regards

Mick

[This message was edited by Mick Parry on SATURDAY 18 May 2002 at 17:51.]

Mick P.
"I worked out that I will need about 38ft of cable to do it.

So really three questions here

1. Will 38 ft of cable kill the sound
2. Will the 32.5 sound like the 52
3. Can they both be played at the same time."

I'm using 65 ft interconnects between Three Systems. ie. [interconnect = ----> ]

Main -----> System 2 -----> System 3

In my opinion the extra long interconnect does not kill the sound. Your feeding a very high level signal via the tape output from the 52. Your second system will benefit greatly from having better sources fed into them.

I'm fairly certain the 52 has tape outputs that would allow you for example to direct the same source to the main or secondary system at the same time or in isolation to one another. You would also have the capability of playing for example the tuner on one system while listening to a record or cd on the other. This would be with all your sources connected to the 52. You could also get fancy and add a remote control repeater to your system that would allow you to control main sources from the other room if you really felt something like that was neccessary.

The only problem you may encounter by connecting the two systems together is a ground loop, but you may not if all your sources are connected to the 52. Feel free to email me if you have any other questions.

Cheers,
John

[This message was edited by John Gilleran on SUNDAY 19 May 2002 at 03:40.]

Quote: "CDS11+XPS/52+Supercap/2x135's/Linn Briks.
The system sounds good "

It does only sound good??????????????????
So sad....



Charles

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Originally posted by Mick Parry:
1. Will 38 ft of cable kill the sound

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Mick,

I run 10m of cable from the VCR to the hifi. It's really cheap and nasty stuff (cost less than £5), but it seems to work 'OK'. I've never moved the VCR close enough to try it on a short cable run, so can't say how much is down to that.

I'm sure better cable would help, though.

Apart from convenience, though, your question is really whether a 12m cable will make the CDS sound worse than a CDX. I suspect not.

On the plus side, you don't need to buy a CDX!

You should be aware that the wiring for such a plug is slightly non-standard. Use a normal DIN-DIN and you'll get nothing at all. Several of the pins need to be cross-connected, so that the 52 appears to be a CD player instead.

You should also decide whether you would want sound to go in the other direction - from 32.5 to 52. This will determine if you want just two pins connected or all four. If you do have only two pins connected then I think the cable would have a 52 end and a 32.5 end, but it might reduce the chances of any interference back into the main system. Should be cheaper, too.

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2. Will the 32.5 sound like the 52

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The 52 isn't adding anything to the sound, it just makes sure it loses as little as possible of what goes through it.

The sound will still be going through the 32.5, so this will still have all the losses you get at present.

You would also be able to play your vinyl, and this would be using the boards in the 52, so should sound good.

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3. Can they both be played at the same time.

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Yes.

There's no change to operation of the main system, use the top row of source selection & mute buttons as normal.

You select which source to play on the second system with the bottom row of buttons. The ones which light up red. This can be the same as the main system, if you want to fill the house with whatever is playing. Alternatively, you can select a different source, so you could play a record while Mrs Mick listens to a CD.

If you're going to play a CD in the lounge it would probably be best to mute the record outs (red) to make sure it's not going to come out on the SBLs as well. This should become second nature pretty quickly.

I note that both systems have tuners, so it might not be that useful to be able to play the NAT05 through the SBLs, unless you use the remote control a lot.

Might sound better, though.

In fact, you might find that you need to disconnect all the sources from the 32.5 (CD3.5 & NAT03) in order to avoid a ground loop, which might add hum to the sound, but would degrade the sound of both systems.

In order to use the remote control you will probably need a 'remote repeater'. This is either a radio or wire link between the rooms, with an 'eye' in the dining room, and a transmitter in the lounge.

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Also I still intend to flog the Saras and replace them with SBL's

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Good move.

cheers, Martin