Sad News for the London Imbiber

Sad news indeed. I just had a couple of pints of Young's Special at Clarks Ale House here in Syracuse last week. Nice brew.

Matt

Ditto.

Youngs Special is a great beer and is seconded only by the mighty Fullers ESB in London.

Dear Steve,

I missed you posting, so nice to read your words!

I think this is called progress. Capitalism has a way of steam-rollering everything good, great, or bad that stands in its way. The rule of the shareholder is paramount.

Think water companies: At one moment we are advise to reduce our water consumption, while apparently twenty five odd per cent leaks away from the pipes between the water works and our homes - we pay water rates that have exceeded any form of wages rise in inflationary terms, and then we read of the profits and returns to shareholders fron said adventure! It would be nice to see a plan to repair the mains! None such exosts or shows any sign of existing.

Nothing is immune the destructive capacity of pure capitalism.

Golly, they will think I am a Marxist next! What I ask is, 'Do I live to work or work to live?' I don't think you have to be a Marxist to get that the right way round!


All the best from Fredrik

Thanks for those kind words Frederik. Unfortunately one was not permitted to peruse hi-fi message boards during the honeymoon...

Beers never taste the same again when their production is moved to another location. One of my all-time favourite beers was Ind Coope Burton Ale. Now brewed in Leeds and tastes nothing like it.

Capitalism is always subject to manipulation by the powers that be. It's no accident that the value of domestic property - mere places to live, is so inflated compared to any other form of land use making it lucrative to raze pubs, breweries, churches, shopping centres, factories, schools, and hospitals to the ground to build houses or flats on the site where there was once economic and other activity. Soon this country will be covered with dwellings but there will be nothing to do and nowhere to work.

Shame to hear about yet another 'merger.' Our local brewery was Gales in Horndean, Hampshire, who sold out to Fuller's. Within months, they closed the Horndean brewery down and moved operations to Chiswick. One wonders how long HSB, GB and Butser will continue, bearing in mind that Fuller's have similar products...

Dear Steve,

Congratulations!

I would remove planning restrictions totally, except for design and type approval, and within three years houses would be worth what they are worth for the purpose they are intended.

I would positively encourage the building of houses on green field sites, in agricultural areas adjacent to areas of employment, and this would stop the nonesense of farmers being paid to keep land fallow. Fallow land is ugly to look at and once equilibrium had been found the housing market would be a mart providing something at a reasonable price for everyone. For once I would let pure supply and demand work its own course...

This would take a lot of pressure off building on such relatively important sites as school playing fieldsas well as sites of cultural and leasure significance in cities etc...

Fredrik

For me, the world dropped out of my bottom when Eldride Pope went as Royal Oak was always my favorite beer. Now Gales have gone too it looks very bleak.

Yes, nice one Steve

Rasher - Royal Oak was indeed a fine beer. Same goes for the sorely missed Breakspears.

Steve - It used to be that I would always go for a Fullers before a Youngs but a few years ago, shortly after Fullers long time brewmaster Reg retired, I noticed a distinct lowering of the dryhopped character, something I'm quite fond of. I suddenly found myself going for Youngs more often. Things become a bit more complicated if Adnams or Harveys are on offer.

One of the most difficult things in brewing is making a low alcohol beer with gobs of flavour that keeps going and satisfies. No one does this better than the English. Probably because tax is based on alcohol content and volume produced where most other countries it's just volume produced. Also in the U.K. malt strains are chosen with a greater emphasis on flavour rather than agronomics, as in the U.S. (there's capitalism rearing it's ugly head again). It's easy to impress with big beers but for me the art of brewing is in low gravity English bitters and the complex flavours of Belgium.

But, out of all the chaos, Fullers ESB reigns supreme. My favourite beer of all time, even though it has got me into the occasional scrape.

A great shame, though, that the Gales and Youngs breweries have closed. No need to drink their beers any more.

Graham

Ahh...Harveys! That is my local beer and I love it too. Especially at the brewery pub in Lewes on a Monday evening, as it's free jazz night.

Rasher,

Not a great fan of Harveys (I was a K&B man myself) but I do hope they stay independent as they do brew some distinctive beers. We've lost too many regional brewers in the last few years (those mentioned here and K&B of course).

There are many fine small breweries in Sussex these days (especially Dark Star, try any of their beers, they are all good to exceptionally good).

The micros are brewing some superb beers but the problem is the pubcos have the pubs tied up so their outlets are limited.

Hi all

Its not that hard to produce low gravity beers with plenty of flavour, but as mentioned malt can make a difference. As with cooking, wine and single malt, simplicity and quality of ingredients make the product. But it is only one small factor in the production of beer. As Steve mentioned, moving production to another site can alter the character of a beer considerably. Some people cite water as the main reason, but as long as water is benign, ie not too hard, the composition can be altered by adding various salts (Burton-isation) to re-create EXACTLY the water used previously.

The other factors in the production of beer, is that no brewery, even the 'factories' use the same kit. Differing kettles or boilers will dictate certain conditions and therefore flavours. The first brewery I worked in, had a fantastic open copper (circa 1900) and was originally coal fired (later gas) I couldn't for the life of me get a certain delicate hoppy note I wanted, that was so easy to replicate in other breweries, because the volatiles were purged out so easily. Steve will know what I mean with the change in Hansons mild when that was moved to Wolverhampton. The same happens in fermenters, fruity notes in beer, are known as esters. These are developed during fermentation. The shape and size of the fermenter can determine how fast a fermentation proceeds, even at the same temperature, some flavours are lost.

Economics also mean that generally, lager brewed in this country even uses RICE in with the malt, as its cheaper! Something everyone else wouldn't dream of doing (except Bud USA)


I guess what I'm trying to say, is that a beer usually dies with the brewery itself.

Sorry for the sad conclusion

Regards

Guy

Hot pubs see brewers seduced and Real ale group in a froth as Greene King moves on rival, not often you see such lurid headlines in the business section of the paper but I guess this is what happens when you mix bean counters and brewers.

Roy

The brewing industry as a whole did need huge alignment, as there was so much over capacity. Many breweries, such as the ones you mention would be running at 30% of their production capacity. It is their own fault, sadly. Investors willing to plough huge sums of money into these ventures to increase capacity, resulted in overpriced flotations (due to percieved potential). They then never achieved these business plans, resulting in pissed off shareholders that want to off-load these shares. This leaves them open to takeovers, that in effect wipe out regional competition.

There were/are still too many pubs in this country. I know there will be people who will disagree with me, especially folk who have lost their local, or seen it changed into some short-lived wine bar, but there really are not enough people drinking out to sustain the amount of pubs out there, everyones drinking habits have changed drastically over the last ten years or so.

We had a pub, on lease, that we wanted to purchase. Its turnover was in excess of £35,000/week, very few pubs can touch this figure. The pub itself was worth £750,000-£1M. the land it & its' carpark, £3.5M! Buy the pub at the previous (fair) figure and you have a viable business, at the latter.......

The solution?
Go to your local, drink more of the beer you like, about 3x your current intake, (not recommended), that will increase the share price of your favourite brewery, making it less likely for take-over. Drink less imported wine & malt(at home).

Is down to the comsumer what route these businesses take, in afraid.

Regards

Guy

I have just listened to the latest July 2nd R4 The Food Programme the subject this week is the brewing industry with contributions from the likes of the Charles Well's, Young's, St Austell and St Peter's breweries.

quote:

In this week's programme, Sheila Dillon discovers the secrets of success for small independent breweries. She visits St. Peter's Brewery in Suffolk where she meets managing director, Colin Cordy and Head Brewer, Mark Slater. The Brewery has won many awards including the Queens's Award for Enterprise (for Exports).

Reporter Simon Parkes visits St. Austell Brewery, which, by contrast, has concentrated on the regional market. It produces, amongst others, Camra's Champion Beer of Cornwall, 'Tribute'.

Sheila is joined in the studio by chef and food writer, Richard Fox and Roger Protz, editor of 'The Good Beer Guide' produced by CAMRA, the Campaign for Real Ale. Richard Fox, chef and food writer, cooks fishcakes made with polenta and served with mayonnaise made with wheat beer.

Most if not all of the points raised by Guy's rather good postings are covered and can be accessed via the Food Programme's listen again link.