Strange but true

Keep on floating

ehehhehehehehehe
Bon voyage!

Cheers Gianluigi - I'm having a ball. Good to hear from you!

Spock

Fantastic Spock. Beam me up buddy - I'll come along.

Spock

Lemsip and alcohol are a lethal combination.

A few years ago I had to give a talk to a local group of small businessmen on "how to deal with big suppliers" and I was in bed suffering from a stinking cold.

I did not want to let anyone down and I swallowed a couple of lemsips and the chaufeur collected me and off we went.

I still felt rough and a chap gave me a double whisky as it could only make me better (certainly not worse) and off I went into the room to deliver the lecture infront of 130 businessmen.

The whisky reacted with the Lemsip and I was immediately on a drug induced high.

I never suffer from nerves when speaking pubically but this combination got me super confident and I went off like shotgun so goodness knows what I said.

I got a standing ovation and 11 invitations to lecture elsewhere, so I must have gone down reasonably well.

I still can hardly recall the event but since then I have never mixed Lemsips with alcohol.

Regards

Mick

Did you not read the label about mixing alcohol with medicine?

Perhaps it was "speaking pubically" (sic) that wowed your audience!

Fraser

The active ingredient of lemsip is common or garden variety paracetamol which when bought in a bottle of 500 BP works out at around a penny for 10 tablets or some such piffling amount which makes lemsip gram for gram one of the most expensive medications in the world. Lemsip has little more than a placebo effect on a common cold and I have not bothered with it as it is IMO a huge rip off. However, as I am from time to time inflicted with stage fright I may well try it out in the future. Thanks for the advice Mick. (winking emoticon deleted out of respect to Mick)

Back to earth with a bump next day.

A quick search produced this quote re Sons of Selina (Whoever they are)

"The band turned up 10 minutes before they were due to go on to play a very loud & uncompromising set, perhaps it seemed that way because there were no breaks inbetween songs. The onlt thing an influenza ridden Neil said to the audience was that they should forget taking drugs as all you need to get high are Lemsip, flu & Guinness (patent pending)."

I rest my case.

Spock

quote:

Originally posted by erik scothron:
The active ingredient of lemsip is common or garden variety paracetamol .....

Ahem, are you sure? Check the label. I am not a chemist but it contains more than just paracetamol......hence the reason for the effects with alcohol.

Lemsip Cold and Flu contains

650mg paracetamol
10mg phenylephrine hydrochloride

Phenylephrine is a vasoconstrictor and can - on it's own - cause hallucinations or unusual behavior, so a comibination of phenylephrine and alcohol could be interesting in individuals susceptible to these effects!

Incidentally, phenylephrine can be used in the illegal maufacture of methamphetamine...more details on request <insert smiley here to show kidding...>

Erik

It's the phenylephrine in Lemsip that acts as a decongestant and helps make you feel better. All OTC medicines have big markups ....

Mick

FWIW, my cure for the cold symptoms at bedtime is a lemon flavoured Theraflu (no Lemsip available in the US but Theraflu is similar and also has an antihistamine) and a hot toddy....it doesn't cure the cold but I do sleep very well...too well most times due to that antihistamine and the dreams can be entertaining!)

Cheers

Jim

Does paracetomol actually work on ANYTHING? Seriously? I've never found a headache tablet that can get rid of headaches I get

As for Lemsip/booze - tried it once and it was, err, interesting. Doesn't do your internal organs any good at all though so be careful.

quote:

Originally posted by domfjbrown:
Does paracetomol actually work on ANYTHING? Seriously? I've never found a headache tablet that can get rid of headaches I get

As for Lemsip/booze - tried it once and it was, err, interesting. Doesn't do your internal organs any good at all though so be careful.

Solpadeine Max usually gets rid of mine PDQ but contains caffeine so that keeps me awake which is not good if I want to sleep. Paracetmol rots ones livers and kidneys and destroys brain cells or so I am told, maybe Jim could clarify? What say you exhiled highlander?

During the summer breaks from university, I worked in a second hand car dealership

One morning my boss complained of toothache, and one of the other staff suggested Neurofen to him.

He accepted this advice and all was well that day.

The following day my boss started to act strangly with some of the customers, culminating in him slagging off the car that a customer had arrived in and being really quite offensive to him - to the extent they got back in their car and left.

On questioning him on his behavior , he reponded "oh they were just tie wasting c*#$s", which they hadnt seemed like to me.

Later that day I realised the cause of the od behavior when I saw my boss take a further two ibuprofen which he washed down with a swig of Famous Grouse.

On pointing out the warning on the box to avoid alchohol when taking such medication, he admitted "well the pills were not enough for the toothache on their own, but now you mention it I have been feeling a little odd".

Sufice to say I sent him home via the dentist.

Simon

quote:

Paracetmol rots ones livers and kidneys and destroys brain cells or so I am told

The liver uses glutathione to break down paracetamol (acetaminophen if your in the USA) into two harmless chemicals, when it runs out of glutathione it uses an alternate metabolic pathway and the paracetamol is broken down into one harmless chemical and another that it toxic to liver cells.

Under normal use paracetamol is one of the safest drugs going but under overdose conditions it can easilly be fatal. Overdose occurs by taking two much at onetime (the threshold in most adults is 15g) liver damage can also occur if the standard dose (1g every 4 hours to a maximum of 4g a day) is taken over a prolonged period.

Most overdoses of paracetamol are accidental e.g. Someone takes two paracetamol and a Lem Sip and some Day/Night Nurse through the day and this uses up all the gluathione and overdose occurs. Metabolising alcohol also uses glutathione so alcohol use/abuse can reduce the above dosages significantly.

More people die from paracetamol poisoning than taking Ecstacy and yet there is no outcry. This is all the more disturbing as the antidote to paracetamol poisoning is freely available and if added to paracetamol products available over the counter would prevent these deaths.

The antidote is N-acetyl cysteine (NAC) available in most healthfood shops. This is a precursor of glutathione and if taken at the same time or just after taking paracetamol will prevent overdose. As an antidote to poisoning it should be given within 12 hours (if you suspect somone has overdosed on paracetamol get them to hospital ASAP but if you have any NAC on hand make them swallow about 4g as this will help to reduce or possibly prevent liver damage).

So why don't they make 'safe' paracetamol. Well NAC smells sulphurous (think rotting eggs) and it would add around 5p to the price of a pack of pills. And I suspect comercial rather than public interest is behind this. I believe there is one brand available in the UK that contains NAC and is coated so it does not smell but in a quick google I could not find the name or if it is still sold.

Edit - Another alternate to NAC to prevent overdose is methionine and a safe version of paracetamol is available called Paradot is available that you may wish to consider if you have young children (just in case of an accident) or drink a lot.

quote:

The antidote is N-acetyl cysteine (NAC) available in most healthfood shops.

Stuart,

Many thanks for your information. I have a friend who although being formidably bright is an alcoholic. He says he has multiple chemical allergies and is in constant pain and needs to self-medicate (I suspect this is nonesense)- he drinks horribly cheap alcohol which must be full of toxins and I suspect that it is the alcohol that cause the pain against which he self medicates. He says pain killers dont work which I think is also nonsense (?) but what do I know, Im not a doctor. He has recently been using paracetamol so I will suggest he uses NAC.

Many thanks,

Erik

Erik

quote:

Paracetmol rots ones livers and kidneys and destroys brain cells or so I am told, maybe Jim could clarify? What say you exhiled highlander?

I think gave you a pretty good summary....Liver failure through paracetamol overdose would be a horrible way to go....now if you think that paracetamol is bad for the liver you should see what Lamisil tablets can do to it....

BTW, I'm pretty sensitive to liver health issues having managed to get Hepatitis while working in India just over a year or so ago....some wonderful temples (of all religions) there Erik.

Cheers

Jim

Sorry to hear about your friend. I'm no doctor so don't take my word for it but some knowledge of the liver (I wrote this lot about hepatitis B http://www.hon.ch/Library/Theme/HepB/index.html) it's a bit out of date now with regard to the latest drugs but the info is correct.

If your friend is alcoholic you may also wish to see if he would take Milk Thistle as well as several small studies have shown than it protects there liver against alcohol damage but there are no large or long scale trials that prove this.

Unfortunately NAC and Milk Thistle don't come cheap so if he can only do one thing I'd suggest taking 500 to 600mg of NAC whenever he takes 2 paracetamol for pain.

You can get the medical facts and research via www.medscape.com (this gives free access to medline if you want to look through research papers).

quote:

Originally posted by Exiled Highlander:
Erik

[QUOTE]

BTW, I'm pretty sensitive to liver health issues having managed to get Hepatitis while working in India just over a year or so ago....some wonderful temples (of all religions) there Erik.

Cheers

Jim

Sorry about the Hepatitis Jim that can't be much fun.

I have never been to India much as I would like to. I have seen a variety of temples in Malaysia however, mosques and buddhist and hindu temples etc. The Thai temples are very beautiful.

All the best,

Erik

Erik

The Hepatitis has long passed with no lasting effects except being unable to donate blood from now on...I was a nice luminous yellow colour for a while though and it makes you appreciate your liver and how it can get screwed up.

Cheers

Jim

Is it true that in the US you can't buy paracetomol without a coating of the antidote?

Bob

No clue but doesn't seem likely since the most common "antidote" is acetylcysteine which fights hepatic poisoning. Paracetamol is acetaminophen in the US (Tylenol amongst other trade names) and is probably enteric coated (even though it does not attack the stomch lining like aspirin does...)

Cheers

Jim

Nothing that comes over the counter will cure the very rare headaches I get.

Well, except some Co-Proxamol I had for Kideny Stones, but that is Codiene and Morhpine, so I guess it cured the blues at the same time. One tablet would put me staright to sleep, I can tell you. I thought they were so strong I only took half the dose when I was poorly with the Kidney Stones and the remainder lasted for years!

When I had the Kidney Stones I actually went to work felling monumentally bad. I was taken to the doctor when I colapsed. He asked me if I was able to provide a sample? Then told me that the loo was down the corridor, but I felt so bad I just emptied into the bottle in front of him, which I think may have surprised him a bit! Like Tomato Juice with Worcester Suace! He made sure that I had not driven in, and then immediately gave me a Morphine injection where it hurts! Apparently Stones are about as painful as it gets, and I could stand, albeit more or less bent double. The Morphine fixed the pain in a few seconds...

Fredrik

quote:

Originally posted by Fredrik_Fiske:
Kidney Stones and the remainder lasted for years! Apparently Stones are about as painful as it gets, and I could stand, albeit more or less bent double. The Morphine fixed the pain in a few seconds...

Fredrik

Dear Fredrik,

My doctor told me that passing kidney stones or renal cholic was the worst pain there is when injecting me full of morphine. I woke up one morning and pissed ribena which was mildy worrying but later in the day I just dropped to the ground as if kicked in the balls, back and stomach by a horse. The pain lasted for a couple of minutes and I made a note to visit the doctor the next day. A couple of hours later three more kicks and twice and pain and it went on for 10 mins of pure hell. A few hours after that I had the third set of kickings which were the worst and I had to call an ambulance. The pain was so bad I could not say my name and address properly and the police turned up with the ambulance and scared the life out of my then girlfriends daughter. My doctor turned up at the same time with the magic nectar of Morpheus. I've never had a pain anything like as painful and I've had a few traumas (completely ruptured Achilles only last year while playing tennis was a doddle compared to the kidney stones/renal cholic). To be honest if I had my Browning with me I would have blown my brains out (not that I'm that good a shot).

The next day I was pissing more ribena and blood clots. Some time later a consultant was stuffing a bloody great tube down my knob to look inside my bladder. I asked if I could take a peek to. How many people have seen the inside of their bladder?

So you have my comisserations Fredrik, I would not wish that kind of pain on anyone.

All the best,

Erik

quote:

Originally posted by Fredrik_Fiske:
Nothing that comes over the counter will cure the very rare headaches I get.

Well, except some Co-Proxamol I had for Kideny Stones, but that is Codiene and Morhpine,Fredrik

Er, no it isn't, and you can't buy it OTC either.