Lured by the dark side of AV

Plug in a PS3 and forget all the rest, that'll save you a fortune.

It'll only clutter up your room, create agonising 'what ifs', and then you'll listen to the movie only once anyway...

PS3 is plugged in an attached to gorgeous new Panasonic 46" Freesat Plasma! It is all good.

I agree about the clutter - and her indoors keeps asking me where all the wires are going to go...we have a big room!

The Credos would make excellent surround speakers of course.

Add an n-Cent for £500.

Add an Onkyo TX-SR876 for £1000, an Onkyo TX-SR806 for around £800 or an Onkyo TX-SR706 for £600. All these cope with all the current formats. Your PS3 can't output TrueHD or DTS Master Audio. Just set it to output linear PCM through HDMI and let the AV receiver decode that instead. The only downside to the Onkyos is that they're fairly big and 'cosmetically challenged', but sonically they're very good indeed. Incidentally, if you can find an ex-demo of the outgoing TX-SR875 going for around £700 (there are still some around at some stores), that's a blinding bargain. The money saved could get you an Axess which would be a big improvement. Note: TX-SR875 - big sucker!

Pipe the sub-bass through all the speakers since they're all large and you won't need to go to a subwoofer. Add an n-Sub later. This'll improve your low level detail and weight on both stereo and AV. Don't bother with anything else since the n-Sub is a wonderful match with the SL2s and will enhance your music pleasure as well.

Of course, this solution does not need the NAPV175. If you insist on using that box as well, you can do so via the pre-outs of the AV receiver. The bigger AV receivers have prodigious power but it's not delivered in quite the same way as the Naim amp, so you might consider going to a smaller receiver. The problem there is that you lose out most in the quality of the processor section when you go down the range. Separate processors which cope with all the latest formats are few and far between - and expensive.

Hi Trout

I'd like to echo Frank's thoughts.

We bought a Onkyo TX-SR875 this last week and it's big, silver and heavy! So not a good start but, more importantly, it does sound very very good. Home Theatre is it's forte, I wouldn't pawn the 52 just yet.

We're using it with a full set of nsats, ncent and nsub. Used to have am AV2/175 but with one thing and another it just didn't suit us in the end.

The Onkyo can handle all the latest formats and has a very handy video upscaler to boot. Everything is output to our LCD at 1080p which has made a good improvement to almost all TV pictures. It's also extremely convenient.

One word of caution over integration. The Onkyo has pre-outs for connection to your 52 (if you wanted to use your 135's to power the fronts) but my experience is that it's very important to have tonal matching across the front 3 - both amplification of speakers. So that's main left and right and the centre.

You may or may not notice the difference.

There's one big tick in the box for any modern HT receiver. Almost all come with some kind of automatic set-up using a supplied microphone. The Onkyo comes with Audyssey XT which is absolutely brilliant. As with anything set up is 50% of the job!

Jay

Get a 300.

Or a 252.

For AV, if you MUST, try finding a dealer who can demo Stealth Acoustics - they really sound excellent for surround and are totally invisible.

Woman happy? Everybody happy!

Hi Jay/Frank,

your suggestions are close to where I had come to. I had thought of using an Onkyo 606 effectively as a processor feeding the 135s and 175. This would give me the 'Naim sound' in all the speakers. I would get an n-cent sub or try and find an Axess.

I think I spotted a bigger Onkyo on sale, it may be last years model though.

Thanks for your input.

Joe - if I was going that route, why stop, 552 and 500

quote:

Originally posted by SpecCled Trout:
Hi Jay/Frank,

your suggestions are close to where I had come to. I had thought of using an Onkyo 606 effectively as a processor feeding the 135s and 175. This would give me the 'Naim sound' in all the speakers. I would get an n-cent sub or try and find an Axess.

I think I spotted a bigger Onkyo on sale, it may be last years model though.

Thanks for your input.

Joe - if I was going that route, why stop, 552 and 500

I don't think the 606 has pre-outs so check that first.

I had a 605 (in fact still have) which is the previous version and it's great for the money but with the outgoing "5" series there are some real bargains out there.

Jay

Hi Trout,

What a surfeit of advice!

Mine - use your dealer if you can.

My experience is that if MUSIC is a priority with you then Naim is the way to go, by this I mean music DVDs.

If you are after audio effects then there are a number of boxes that would assist - Onkyo are well considered.

I would echo Jay's comment about the front speakers/amplification.

For rear effects you could make do with something cheap and cheerful for the moment, Credos will probably be fine - suck it and see.

Personally I would get a sub - good REL subs can be picked up for a song, such as the Strata.

What DVD / Processor are you currently using?

M

quote:

Originally posted by Mr Underhill:
Personally I would get a sub - good REL subs can be picked up for a song, such as the Strata.

It has to be an nsub! Quite simply the best I have heard but a tad pricy. Worth it though!

Jay,

My suggestions were built around Trouts '..not wanting to spend a fortune...'.

M

quote:

Originally posted by Mr Underhill:
Jay,

My suggestions were built around Trouts '..not wanting to spend a fortune...'.

M

M

No. I agree. Just expressing the pleasure I get from my nsub!

J

Hi J ,

Do you mind me asking what speaker cable you use to connect your Onkyo to the N Sats & N Cent etc .

Cheers,

Rod

Hi Rob

Naca5 of course. It's a little inconvenient though so I think I'll need to grab some of the cheaper Chord cabling.

Jay

So far I have managed to find a 175 and an Axess at good prices. Just need to find the right processor/receiver now. Going to use Chord Odyssey install under the carpet or the gear will not be allowed in the room!!

That 875 is an ugly sucker!!

Sub can come later.

quote:

Originally posted by SpecCled Trout:
That 875 is an ugly sucker!!

Beauty is in the eye of the beholder....

*cough*

It's not only ugly but it's also extremely heavy!

It looks like I will be plumping for the new Denon 2309. The 1909 is getting rave reviews and the 2309 adds a full set of pre-outs.

Should get me started!

For connection from my PS3, do I need to add an optical cable or will the HDMI cable carry the digital audio. Sorry, anything beyond the stereo gramaphone and I am a klutz!

quote:

Originally posted by SpecCled Trout:
It looks like I will be plumping for the new Denon 2309. The 1909 is getting rave reviews and the 2309 adds a full set of pre-outs.

Should get me started!

For connection from my PS3, do I need to add an optical cable or will the HDMI cable carry the digital audio. Sorry, anything beyond the stereo gramaphone and I am a klutz!

Just the HDMI is required Mr Trout

Thank you

quote:

Originally posted by joe90:
Plug in a PS3 and forget all the rest, that'll save you a fortune.

It'll only clutter up your room, create agonising 'what ifs', and then you'll listen to the movie only once anyway...

LOL. It was my setup approach from day 1.

If you use some kind of non-naim av-receiver, only over the unity-gain features of you naim stereo, I see no problem. But then you'll have to use the inferior poweramps of this device too.

What if you want to keep your naim poweramps, how does that work exactly?

You'll need adaptor-cables from your av-receiver RCA multichannel outputs to DIN or XLR inputs for the naims. I guess e.g. Chord could provide these...

But I allways thought, naim poweramps needed to be driven by a naim preamp to be in a stable state of operation? Is this an old fairy tale or still true??

Does someone actually use such a kind of setup?

happy listening
Adrian

Yes - ive done that. Chord made me some cables and a couple of 90.3's did the rear and centre channel duties with my normal Naim system handling the front stereo. No probs running the amps with an AV receiver.

James

All set up now. I am embarrassed to say I am currently watching Transformers (for the effects!).

Speakers: SL2 fronts, Axess centre, Credo rears
Amplifiers: NAC52, NAP135s, NAPV175
AV: PS3, Denon 2309
Cables, custom Chord interconnects from Denon to NAC52 and NAPV175, Odyssey install for rear speakers

Rough manual set up to calibrate NAC52 setting (I had better not switch straight to CD otherwise the SL2s will be toast).

Set the Denon to auto set up with Audyssey. Interesting it decided the Axess and Credos were small and only the SL2s were large.

The speakers were all within 3db at the listing position!

Overall the sound is well defined, suitably deep for effects even without a subwoofer. The opening scene of Star Wars III is fantastic. There is real scale and power in amongst all those space ships. The tonal quality across the mix of speakers and amps is surprisingly good and consistent. Easily good enough for cinema given the limited source that the PS3 is. I may be tempted to get a decent BluRay player with TrueHD.

Output is multi-channel PCM.

Total spend around £2,400 including (expensive) cables. Overbudget and no subwoofer.

I think the latter is not needed, even with the large room I have and the SL2s producing the bass on their own there is plenty of power.

Is it worth it? Probably yes, there is much better definition on voice, and the separation of voice, effects and music is distinctive.

Also, in the context of the two channel base system this is a relatively modest addition in terms of cost.

Overall a seven out of ten (compared to say replacing the CDX with CDS II a 10/10!).

Thanks for the hints and tips on the way.

Trout

Having watched a few more blu ray discs as opposed to DVDs the set up us a lot more impressive. Incredible Hulk has amazing impact, really utilising the full system.

Also I have no sub and yet the whole room was full of sound that you really could feel.

I have moved to a 9/10 now and a big smile.

Oh, and games such as Race Driver Grid are fantastic, you can hear the cars drive up behind you ;-)

How good is the Denon 2309 as a processor and have you tried the Audyssey dynamic volume for low level listening yet by chance ?

Does it retain the dynamics of the sound at moderate levels, rather than using the midnight (compressed) mode ?

Thanks,

Rod