Shot Policewoman suspect

So stop with the black thing and and discuss the issues of policing this country which by the way is still one of the safest places to live in the world. Let's just treat each other reasonable with an open mind then we may all get along [/QUOTE]

You are correct. I did not think before I wrote those words - it's just that ive seen so many blacks selling and never a white person but of course there are whites selling so it is of course stupid to use the word 'black' at all.

Regards,

Erik

I am not able to comment on the issue of the arrest and incident to which that relates, for obvious reasons.

I can comment on the 'black' guy thing. I think that drug dealing comes from all cultures, and spartacus knows well my standpoint on this issue as we discussed this at the last riders evning.

Proving is often 'difficult' due to what evidence is actually required, as opposed to what is percieved to be required. The comment above tho re a contributor to this thread witnessing such an exchange is both saddening and frustrating IMV re the police not being able to get there - perhaps they were attending a burglary in progress or a personal attack alarm???

andy c!

I thought a few more postings to this thread might have been praising plod for catching someone they wished to interview just as they were about to flee the country rather than burying them for not emulating the death squads official and unofficial as seen in some banana republics.

quote:

Anyone surprised that he's black? What is it about young black men and guns? It can't be all about rap music, surely?

Nope, no surprise at all Graham.

It's a fact that the majority of photo-fit images of wanted assailants or suspects of shootings on Crime Watch/News have black faces. If anyone doesn't believe me, take note next time the programs are shown.

Ian

Chaps

This problem will not go away until you get really tough with the offenders and I mean tough.

If a drug dealer is caught with a gun, then he should be locked up for life with no release, in other words he dies in prison irrespective of his age. That will soon send out a very sure message.

If he uses the gun to resist arrest, then the police should be allowed to kill him without any form of inquest afterwards. I have no concern about the human rights of these people but I do have concern about their victims.

Regards

Mick

Mick

I entirely agree.

Regards

Earwicker

quote:

I thought a few more postings to this thread might have been praising plod for catching someone they wished to interview just as they were about to flee the country rather than burying them for not emulating the death squads official and unofficial as seen in some banana republics.

Indeed.

But as I have said before, its very easy to be negative, and ignore the positive's, isn't it?

The other interesting point is that we get more threads about persecution of motorists et al, rather than violent crime/drugs issues/burglaries/anti-social behaviour etc - perhaps he government have got it wrong trying to tackle the latter issues, and they should direct the police to deal with the former ones!

andy c!

quote:

Originally posted by Mick Parry:
Chaps

This problem will not go away until you get really tough with the offenders and I mean tough.

If a drug dealer is caught with a gun, then he should be locked up for life with no release, in other words he dies in prison irrespective of his age. That will soon send out a very sure message.

If he uses the gun to resist arrest, then the police should be allowed to kill him without any form of inquest afterwards. I have no concern about the human rights of these people but I do have concern about their victims.

Regards

Mick

I completely agree as long as the same applies to the other people who have just as much impact on our lives. Examples are the corporate criminals like maxwell, the ENRON bosses and their accountants, the people who manage our pension funds and steal our future and our childrens future, the oil companies that make record profits but somehow our energy bills still go up by 22%. These people also have long lasting damaging effects on our lives! Their faces may not be seen on Crimewatch but they are criminals all the same. The exception is that they only feature in broadsheet newspapers in the financial section.

I say well done to the police for tracking him down so quickly it's just a shame that they take so long over cases like Damilola Taylor, when old ladies are battered in their own homes. The reality is that there is not enough people in the police force and they are stretched to the limit with all the minor offences they have to deal with, which is a reflection of todays society where people do not have any respect for each other or the authorities.

My local police are already focused on responding to serious crime in quite a few areas and imho they seem to have got the balance about right. I do agree with the point about financial crime not being highlighted maybe because you can make millions without having to deal in drugs or hold a gun to someone's head but it still needs to be addressed and financed by new money.

Dear spartacus,

Same Law For rich And Poor.

Sadly that never has been, and seems no more likely in the future than the past!

Who pays the lowest incremental tax rates in UK? Who get off speeding offenses? Who get away with not paying Council tax, at least till they are rumbled?

The priveleged and powerful, who also generally happen to be the rich. I am not particularly worried by this, as there is nothing I can do about it, and we all have to accept that life in not fair in some degree. After all, none of us in the West have any business complaining when we considers the poverty which the absolute majority of the World's population lives in!

All the best from Fredrik

quote:

Originally posted by Fredrik_Fiske:

The priveleged and powerful, who also generally happen to be the rich. I am not particularly worried by this, as there is nothing I can do about it, and we all have to accept that life in not fair in some degree. After all, none of us in the West have any business complaining when we considers the poverty which the absolute majority of the World's population lives in!

All the best from Fredrik

I agree, we do not have much cause to complain really but there are things that can be done. I know that the world is not fair but when we all do our little bit the result is pretty amazing. There is always something that we can do. Look at the pressure that was put on South Africa when people started to think about what they purchased and where it came from, another example is the Fair Trade movement.

If we all did not turn a blind eye to some of these incidents and help our police force then things could get better. There are examples of this where the police are working with communties to reduce the amount of time they spend on dealing with minor crime. It really is about people co-operating with each other.

Dear spartacus,

I totally agree! We can all do incremental things. I know I try too, even if it is only buying buying Co-op Fairtrade groung coffee in preference to its fancier, but no nicer tasting, non-Fairtrade equvalent, as just one example...

The problem with Policing is largely down to two things: Shortage of Money, which is not endless, and a question of priorities, And also the actual priorities of the Police Authorities. In this respect the amalgamation of the Forces, currently being discussed and presumably to be implemented by the Gov't, is nothing but a bad thing if it makes these Authorities even more remote from the communities who finance them, and they remain the servants of. Sometimes I think the Police forget their roles as law enforcing servants of the community, rather than simply enforcers of the law, ever wanting more powers, priveleges, and seemingly becoming all too often, but certainly not always, rather high handed in their attitude.

All the best from Fredrik

Fredrik

I am surprised that any young man wants a career in the police force today. If they catch a crook, the crook usually gets a ludicrously light sentence which makes it all seem hardly worthwhile.

The latest fiasco was the 7/7 bombings. We had every leftwing pinko out for sacking and even prosecuting the policeman who shot the suspect who acted very suspiciously indeed.

This is a two way thing, we expect results from the police and they in turn are entitled to a decent level of support.

Regards

Mick

Dear Mick,

I totally agree. Everyone is human, and mistakes are no forgiven in today's media led, thoughless and PC-mad society. No, I can see why anyone with a bit about them would not want to join the Police. Same with politics in a way. The prurience of the media into their lives at a private level (and which is usually NOT a public interest issue) has pressumably stopped a good number of capable people from going into it, and I must say what we have now (on all sides) looks very much like some half-decayed tag-end of a carcase compared to the quality that was there on all side in the first half of the twentieth century.

To some extent it is a sad reflection on the irresposible attitude of the public at large, that we have got the police force we have today, however that comment reflects on the people actually doing the job. There are indeed too many in police jobs who ought never to be there. It is a catch 22. I don't know the answer, but I agree with your sentiments above.

All the best from Fredrik

Fredrik

I do not suppose there is an all embracing answer but dishing out tougher sentences and giving the Police more support would go a long way.

Even those idiots who break the speed limits waffle on for England how bad the police are rather than take their deserve punishment with good grace.

Regards

Mick

Dear Mick,

No doubt you have seen what I wrote about cherry picking the laws, some might choose to obey...

I totally agree once again. We don't always, but at least you are always civil to me, and I hope I am to you. But twice in a day to agree. Things must be moving on! Fredrik

quote:

Originally posted by andy c:

quote:

I thought a few more postings to this thread might have been praising plod for catching someone they wished to interview just as they were about to flee the country rather than burying them for not emulating the death squads official and unofficial as seen in some banana republics.

Indeed.

But as I have said before, its very easy to be negative, and ignore the positive's, isn't it?

The other interesting point is that we get more threads about persecution of motorists et al, rather than violent crime/drugs issues/burglaries/anti-social behaviour etc - perhaps he government have got it wrong trying to tackle the latter issues, and they should direct the police to deal with the former ones!

andy c!

I would say cut back on the police presence on the roads and concentrate on the drug peddlers, there are speed cameras to deal with speeders, pardon the pun! how any county can justify having two police cars with two officers inside each one plus a police motorcyclist working in tandem with these road safety partnerships is beyond belief when around the corner peoples lives are being made a misery or homes are being burgled, I think there is a problem with allocation of resources there, unless the police are receiving a wedge from these safety partnerships.
The way things are going in britain more and more people are going to take the law into their own hands because they are not being protected.
I was shocked as anyone about this shooting, will the police be armed as standard? if they were the crim would just go armed anyway even if they would not have done before, so it does not solve the problem.
Just a final thought, how many police hours would be allocated to a shooting of a police officer as opposed to the shooting say of a post master or civilian?
Just that I have noticed all the stops are pulled when it involves a shooting of the former at a time we are being told police forces are stretched.

Van the Man

Yes the police are over stretched and the one sure way to cut their workload and make our life much easier is to put offenders away for very long times in prison where they can do no harm.

We must rethink our attitudes and give say 20 years inside for a burglary offence. No release at all for drug trafficing etc. That keeps them away from us and frees up police time.

There is a cost issue of long term imprisonment, so chain gang them and make them earn their keep. We need to realise that the well being of the law abiding citizen come way before the rights of these low lifes. With luck a tough life will reduce their life expectancy anyway.

Regards

Mick

Mick why not just come out and say they should executed? Saves money all round.

They're already doin' it!
If they can't democratize they just rub out.

One must ask about the underlying economic conditions which are driving such widespread drug dealing.

One must also ask about the underlying worldwide conditions that drive such widespread drug use.

Thieves used to be very severely punished for stealing a gentleman's handkerchief. It didn't stop handkerchief theft. Nor did it stop gentlemen wearing expensive handkerchiefs. Is it odd that gentlemen were not punished for wearing such handkerchiefs? When all about them was poverty, hunger, squalor and misery?

Harry

I have never advocated the death penalty.

Criminals tend to re offend. Most crimes involving drugs are committed by re offenders. The process of rehabilitation, is and always will be, a flop.

The simplest way of dealing with people who use guns or deal in drugs is to lock them up permanently. When they send out letters to their friends lamenting their wretched existance in prison, the message will soon get through that drug dealing is a high risk venture to a life in prison without release.

We will all be better off with them inside. I have a lot more concern for school children whose lives will be ruined by drugs just because some re offending scumbag is selling the stuff because some liberal pinko decided he should be given goodness knows how chances to reform.

Regards

Mick

The people selling drugs in the corner of the streets are sometimes addicted as well.
Some started because of no chance to get a job.
I'm not sayin' that drugs dealing is ok, but if we want to sort problems out we must go inside the matter and understand why.
I do repeat that years of war on stuff didn't bring to anywhere than a lot of more problems, a lot of policemen and women shot dead and more people in jails.
Once there was alcohol and people put their problems in a bottle.
Chemical drugs are, in someone point of view, better than alcohol.
When alcohol makes your brain switched off, chemical drugs just let you change the whole reality into a fancy place where things are better than any other concrete solution.
Alcohol is not considered a drug, while it is, because people normally stand it and it's sometimes encouraged in the use.
Things don't change with drugs.
They certainly are not advertised on magazines, but the engine that move them is the same.
The matter is that during the hard american prohibitionism alcohol was sold as well and the gains was in gangland hands with worst result.
The big problem is not drugs, but why people want them.
Because they still do buy them even if they are illegal.

so legalise drugs - control the distribution, reduce the cost and low and behold, dealers are redundant, hence a reduction in addict recruitment, petty crime to raise cash to buy drugs disappears and the addicts can come forward for treatment without fear if they wish.

and also reduce the prison population

the police can then get back to law enforcement instead of picking up the pieces of a failed welfare system.

And Gordo Brown can collect tax revenue on the sale of recreational pharmaceuticals to help pay for the rehabitation centres

quote:

Originally posted by Derek Wright:
so legalise drugs - control the distribution,

Sorry Derek.
No legalisation.
Legalisation on eroin or cocaine would be a disaster.
Controlled distribution to addicteds and take them away from dealers hands with the chance to start a rehabilitation and start back again.
Legalize and control market on marijuana is ok.
Drugs dealers need to "create" clients.
The more addicted the client get the more gain.
So why not tryin the dutch way?
Separate marijuana from the rest and avoid people to get in the "marketing" strategy of the dealers.
No more police running to catch young boys in the streets, but a sharpen action to the "big dealers".
No more wasted money and resources.